dean 0 Posted March 26, 2008 can any one tell me what the best cams are to buy for a gti6 engine to give me most power and where the cheapest place to get them from thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bonzai 2 Posted March 26, 2008 you do know this forum has a search feature on it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bonzai 2 Posted March 26, 2008 if it wont work then you're doing it wrong. if you dont find an answer then thats different. Just be aware that this forum existed a long time before you came along, and you are not teh first person to ask what do i need to do to get 200bhp. For what its worth i would eitehr contact PeterT about a regrind option, or speak to QEP (forum sponsor) about what catcams offer for the engine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 244 3 Cars Posted March 27, 2008 Cams alone won't give you a massive increase in power, there is usually more work needed to an engine to find the optimum power from an uprated cam. eg. skim the head to increase the c/r. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
petert 588 Posted March 27, 2008 In the case of the GTi6, I don't agree with that. Compression is high enough to support bigger cams and it breathes like a demon. It has very mild standard cams. It's crying out for more camshaft duration. Definitely the key to unlocking the hidden power. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
taffycrook 2 Posted March 27, 2008 (edited) Agree, depending on what you what from the engine, how you are going to fuel it etc. Cams will give you a healthy increase in power. You may think about a inlet cam only to begin with, this will keep it all cheap and allow you to pass emissions tests and keep the std ecu. Edited March 27, 2008 by taffycrook Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
guffe 2 Posted March 27, 2008 I'll borrow this thread a little.. Is there more cam manufacturers for GTi6 cams than Cat Cams and Kent Cams? I haven't been able to find other brands. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
welshpug 1,661 Posted March 27, 2008 http://www.taylor-eng.com/index.html Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 244 3 Cars Posted March 27, 2008 In the case of the GTi6, I don't agree with that. Compression is high enough to support bigger cams and it breathes like a demon. It has very mild standard cams. It's crying out for more camshaft duration. Definitely the key to unlocking the hidden power. OK, I didn't realise the GTi-6 engine was such a good base for simply bolting new cams in without any other work. The GTi-6 ecu can be re-mapped by a specialist to allow for any extra fuelling etc to be added as required. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
taffycrook 2 Posted March 29, 2008 Graham, Most folk who have tested the gti6 heads think they are better than mi's for this sort of tuning. Better flow rates, and cam carrier bearings. Exhaust valves are bigger too iirc and this means you can go further with the inlet only theory without too much overlap. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toddy 7 Posted March 29, 2008 PT81's + remap seem to give excellent torque, see below http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.ph...1692&page=2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 244 3 Cars Posted March 29, 2008 Graham, Most folk who have tested the gti6 heads think they are better than mi's for this sort of tuning. Better flow rates, and cam carrier bearings. Exhaust valves are bigger too iirc and this means you can go further with the inlet only theory without too much overlap. Cool, glad I've got a GTi-6 head & cam's on an XU7 bottom end downstairs. Once all fitted with GTi-6 inlet & exhaust manifolds, in the car & mapped it'll make nice power. (Mi at least) Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
guffe 2 Posted March 31, 2008 Is there more cam manufacturers for GTi6 cams than Cat Cams and Kent Cams? I haven't been able to find other brands. Sorry, I meant new cams with a LOT of total lift (like 14mm/.550"), not grinded ones. Schrick makes also some Peugeot cams, but I'm not 100% that their "Peugeot XU10J4 4 Cyl. 4 Valve (2.0 l 306, Citroen Xsara..)" is for the GTi6 head. Probably is but those have "only" 10.5mm of lift. Just planning for the future, for now I'll have to settle for stock GTi6 ones. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisaGTi16v 1 Posted March 31, 2008 Graham, Do you know who can remap the standard gti6/vts ecu and roughly how much it costs? If someone does them quite cheaply and have enough info that you could just send the ecu off to them and have them remap it without having to travel miles that would be even better. All of the aftermarket chips I have seen are like £300 + mapping time! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
welshpug 1,661 Posted March 31, 2008 Wayne at Chipwizards up north is the only place I know of that does it (may be others but he's the only one with published results) Depending on how long it takes a remap costs around the £400 mark with Wayne. as for cams with 14mm lift these don't fit into the gti6 head without some modification, I was also under the impression that using that much lift was somewhat pointless and that gaining duration was more worthwhile. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pug_ham 244 3 Cars Posted March 31, 2008 Graham, Do you know who can remap the standard gti6/vts ecu and roughly how much it costs? If someone does them quite cheaply and have enough info that you could just send the ecu off to them and have them remap it without having to travel miles that would be even better. Like WP says, its Wayne at Chipwizards in Manchester that can do the remap of the GTi-6 ecu but you need to have the car there for the remap. IMO sending an ecu for a basic map isn't worth the money it costs because you'll be compromising what power your engine can actaully make. Even on two engines with the same work but done by different people the final map could be considerably different as could the power output. Graham. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisaGTi16v 1 Posted March 31, 2008 If you have a stock gti6/vts engine with a set of PT81's and say different filter/exhaust then surely he could reprogram your ecu without seeing the car and advise you of the correct position for the standard adjustable pulleys and it should be 99% as good as going on a roller. I can understand if you have had other head work, different injectors and all that but for just cams it doesnt seem needed for the sake of maybe 1 or 2 bhp when it would be £400 plus petrol to get there. If he charged say £200 for a off the shelf chip for a standard engine with PT81's then you could spend the money saved towards decent tyres etc which would make much more difference than a couple of bhp? I would think he could make a lot more business doing this as well as Manchester is a long way from London etc, probably £100 in petrol for me round trip as an example Why so few people that can do it anyway? Is it due to the immobiliser? That was the reason given when I mailed that bloke on ebay that sells tons of chips for different cars at £30 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Anthony 1,003 Posted March 31, 2008 PT81's + remap seem to give excellent torque, see below http://www.306gti6.com/forum/showthread.ph...1692&page=2 The link further down the page comparing the PT81's against a '6 with standard cams isn't particularly wonderful though, is it? Fractionally down across most of the rev range, only pulling out an improvement at the very topend of the rev range. OK, so I'm sure there's lots of other variables at play, and the comparison graph seems a bit rough and ready, but certainly taking what's there at face value I'd be VERY disappointed if I'd just paid £400+ for a pair of cams and that was the result. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisaGTi16v 1 Posted March 31, 2008 £400 for the cams and £400 for the mapping! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
taylorspug 7 Posted March 31, 2008 Tbh £400 for mapping just a set of cams is alot of money aswell. Id either get more work done on the engine and get it all mapped in one hit, or go for aftermarket management and save money on mapping costs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisaGTi16v 1 Posted March 31, 2008 I agree cant really compare those two bodged together graphs for all the normal reasons but its interesting how the standard ones goes flat for the last bit. I wonder why that is. My Mi16 does that with my fast road piper cams which using their waffle have a power band up to 6500 and the power curve does go dead flat at about 6600 but I think thats probably more likely my standard injectors running out of steam which shouldnt be the case in a stock j4rs with its beefy ones. Maybe its just the standard cam profile thats quite mild which makes it tail off but my old xsara never felt like it was struggling for the last few hundred rpm to the limiter Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bakes100 20 1 Cars Posted March 31, 2008 (edited) The standard j4rs cams and very mild - 205degree iirc so in theory you should see a good increase with an inlet cam , exhaust cams arent really that neccessary as im sure petert will testify! Most of the guys on the 306 forum see about 195-200bhp with the pt81 cams which is a nice peak power improvement , im not sure how the torque curve looks though not sure if it is 800-900 pounds worth of improvement..... Also im not sure the top end usually has that much of a flatspot!, mine certainly doesnt and those graphs look slighty bodged together Edited March 31, 2008 by Bakes100 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alastairh 47 Posted March 31, 2008 (edited) Tbh £400 for mapping just a set of cams is alot of money aswell. Id either get more work done on the engine and get it all mapped in one hit, or go for aftermarket management and save money on mapping costs. Agreed. Even if you went out and bought an Emerald all in one hit on the credit card direct from them for £900ish including mapping etc, at least later down the line you'll have something to show for it and sell the ecu on when you no longer need it. Al Edited March 31, 2008 by Alastairh Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toddy 7 Posted March 31, 2008 (edited) The link further down the page comparing the PT81's against a '6 with standard cams isn't particularly wonderful though, is it? Fractionally down across most of the rev range, only pulling out an improvement at the very topend of the rev range. OK, so I'm sure there's lots of other variables at play, and the comparison graph seems a bit rough and ready, but certainly taking what's there at face value I'd be VERY disappointed if I'd just paid £400+ for a pair of cams and that was the result. The std 6 most likely has had its cam timing optimised, I was referring to the Torque (Lb/ft) available which I have copied below from the thread, I am not to bothered about a headline bhp figure. 1000rpm = 61.27 2000rpm = 113.79 3000rpm = 125.5 4000rpm = 144.43 5000rpm = 154.93 5252rpm = 161.67 5500rpm = 165.52 Lb/ft 5750rpm = 165.93 6000rpm = 164.854 7000rpm = 147.8 Personally I think that is a good result while still retaining a plenum & therefore cheaper than ITB's although I would use an emerald rather than remap due to being able to use the emerald on further projects/upgrades. The OP wanted to know about potential increases from cams on a 6 engine. Has anyone a graph of a Petert regrind? Edited March 31, 2008 by Toddy Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
