[project] Tora Tora Tora 309

[EdCherry 34 1 Cars]

Really want to know more about the gearstick tower! Lovely car

[ultimatepug 0]

awesome!

 

regarding the front suspension changes you have made, have you opted out of using 'normal' 309 set up for any sort of reason? or would the old set up not work well with the honda heart in there?

 

very interesting project!

[Powers 13]

Excellent work.

Thats an interesting front subframe spacer.

[welshpug 1,657]

it looks such a compact engine and box!

 

is it with LSD? or not as its an UK engine? looks to be sat a fair way further forward than an XU, but far smaller.

 

Excellent work.

Thats an interesting front subframe spacer.

 

standard 309 subframe-chassis bush

Edited November 29, 2008 by welshpug

[Sandy 191]

The front arms etc are regular 309 GTI for now. The rear is turreted for coilovers and the numerous benefits they bring.

 

It's a UK engine/box, so open diff. The crank centreline is in the same fore/aft location as an XU, but the almost upright engine and narrow head make it look further forward. You can probably see how spacious the engine bay becomes with an upright engine!

[Henry 1.9GTi 36]

love the mod to front dampers, never seen the like

[BossHogg 0]

I have to ask as curiosity is killing me on how you are doing this. If you get a spare few minutes can you answer my questions?

 

1) to get the vtec to work, have you transplanted the ecu from the original car as well? if not would an aftermarket ecu be suitable for running the whole engine?

2) i'm guessing it you are using it on the track instrumentation might not be so critical, however if you are is it also going to be aftermarket or incorporated into the pug system?

3) Finally after reading about your dirveshafts i'm guessing that the honda shaft is sleeved inside the 405 shaft to give the correct length before welding back up.

 

Sorry if these are "bone" questions, i'm just more interested in something like this than a mi16 conversion with the inherent problems that it brings.

[Sandy 191]

1) Using DTA S60 aftermarket ECU, which can be programmed to make full use of the VTEC switching and mappable VTC cam phasing control. It's going to be on throttle bodies, so it'll need to be mapped from scratch whatever ECU is used.

 

2) Aftermarket instrumentation yes.

 

3) Almost, but getting it right without issues requires a technique Colin's developed and doesn't really want to give away!

[BossHogg 0]

1) Using DTA S60 aftermarket ECU, which can be programmed to make full use of the VTEC switching and mappable VTC cam phasing control. It's going to be on throttle bodies, so it'll need to be mapped from scratch whatever ECU is used.

 

2) Aftermarket instrumentation yes.

 

3) Almost, but getting it right without issues requires a technique Colin's developed and doesn't really want to give away!

 

Thanks very much Sandy much appreciated. Food for thought.

[jonnygoodhand 0]

3) Almost, but getting it right without issues requires a technique Colin's developed and doesn't really want to give away!

 

Does it involve the sacrifice of a goat and 205-themed chant?

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

Does it involve the sacrifice of a goat and 205-themed chant?

 

Yes. It's a surreal experience with all the gregorian style chanting of:

 

#main dealerus pricus extortionatum#

 

#oil surgeus on hard cornerus is now avoidabalum#

 

#ahhhhhhhhh.......men#

 

...with us all wearing welding goggles.

 

Hope I've not given the game away Sandy & Colin .

 

[GLPoomobile 958]

Does it involve the sacrifice of a goat and 205-themed chant?

 

Is that a slur against the Cornish? You bloomin racist!

 

 

Wicker man sir?

[tracktoy 0]

cool project- honda unit is hard to beat, the car should be an absolute animal

[ravydavy 0]

surely something must have been done to this?

any updates please?

[Sandy 191]

He's in the forces now,so doesn't have much time to work on the car. It is ongoing, just slower.

[ravydavy 0]

tell you what sandy, their is so much more room in the 309 engine bay compared to a 205. that engine looks lost in that bay compared to the k20a in my 205. just a quick question sandy. what do you think to dta management cause a few people keep telling me to go with hondata kpro management instead??

[Sandy 191]

Yes, one of the major plus points of using the 309 that swung the vote!

 

DTA, absolutely. I've done several competition K20s on S60 DTAs now and utterly happy with the flexibility and results. I'm a bit biased because I get on very well with the DTA software. I haven't used the Hondata, but I would be very surprised if it was better and you should choose the ECU according to who'll map it, rather than forum fashion or similar.

[ravydavy 0]

Do you really think their is any need for throttle bodies on the k20 engine sandy? They seem to do well without them. I've bought the integra engine hence more power anyway. I've just bought an RBC intake manifold conversion kit from the U.S so that should give extra bhp. Have you done that intake sandy. Just another question. Have you ever mapped the integra dc5 motor and what kind of power do you get out of it?

Many thanks David

[Sandy 191]

Throttle bodies will always be preferable unless there's a mega space restriction. The trouble is, many TB set ups aren't developed, just made to fit and often compromised as a result.

 

All the K engines I've mapped have been on TBs and no I haven't mapped a DC5 motor specifically.

[richardjw 1]

Looks awesome!

Looked into the K20 engine, hows the lack of torque effecting the trackability (New word there I think).

Do you have to rev the nuts off it to get it going, a 309 is quite heavy, or is it still manageable?

 

Bet it goes like the preverbrial clappers when on cam though!!

 

Hopefully see you around at a track soon, look out for a 205 with an Exiege venturi tunnel rear end....as you go past!

[Sandy 191]

Standard K20 vs modified K20 is night and day. We've seen 214lbft from a 2.25 litre one on ordinary fuel and 199lbft from a 2 litre on E85, both race engines obviously on calibrated and corrected engine dyno. The standard engine on a well designed TB set up will be alot gruntier than the standard engine.

[kennygti 0]

Any more updates at all?

Brilliant read mate.

 

Kenny

[gowmonster 2]

nice, how is the rear suspension setup? it looks like a trailing arm with a strut mated to it, i assume there is some sort of pivit where the bottom of the strut meets the arm/hub?

[Sandy 191]

It's pivoted at the bottom yes. Colin Satchell's design.

[CosKev 16]

Awesome car

 

One question,has the front lower x-member been strengthened where the engine stabiliser is bolted/welded too?????

 

Seems quite weak that x-member as standard,and not structural