My Rebuilt Mi Engine! Water In Oil! + Over Heating!

[matt-k 0]

Ok guys, I decided to strike my engine up again today after conecting the exhaust and thought id let it run for a bit to check everything was ok, oil pressure, temp guages etc. After about 4-5 mins (no longer) i noticed the oil temp guage hadnt moved but the water temp was over the half way mark and rising slowly, ive fitted the uprated oil spring and the pressure was holding between the two top marks. i went to have a fiddle with the oil sensor conections and noticed the exhaust manifold was starting to glow red! Not good i thought so i switched it off. I now have the tell tale sign of a white residue in the oil filler pipe. Balls.

 

Can you give me your veiws on this please? The engines just had a new head gasket and wet liner seals but im guessing either the first has blown or the seals have melted due to the over heating? Also what do you think caused the temperature rise? Under fueling maybe? Im running twin 40s and the regulators on the highest flow setting? Is it possible my facet fuel pumps not up to the job?

[dani959 0]

did you check the water temp when that happened? Did the water level drop? XU engines are known to breathe heavily, so it might just be vapour.

My guess is the car was running very lean.

 

Also, I don't think the liner seals would have gone. They are sitting in the bottom of the block, so the heat wouldn't have got there.

 

Good Luck!

 

Daniel

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

Either very lean, or with the timing very retarded. What ignition system are you using?

[Alastairh 47]

Try a compression test. That may give a more accurate answer than just guessing.

 

Al

[pee vee 1]

exhaust manifold was glowing from just idling

 

there is always mayo in the top of the filler caps on xu engines lol, think its condensation or soemthing like that,

[matt-k 0]

The water level does'nt seem to have dropped and the oil was new and clean also the car is still garaged as i havent got the drivshafts in yet, so the waters definatly come from the coolant.

 

One of the reasons i was running it was to sort out the idle speed as it was ticking over at a little over 2000 revs on nearly full advance on the distributor (cant afford megajolt yet!) Another thing which happend was the oil filler pipe which is located just bellow the carbs started breathing heavier blowing droplets of white oil into the air? (without the cap on). Does this give any clues as to whether its the head gasket?

 

Below is a pic of my facet fuel pump. Can you tell from the picture if its good enough for this application?

 

And one the car so far!

[dani959 0]

If it was idling, I'm sure the fuel pump was up to the job... On idle the fuel demand is not a lot!

Set the idle mixture a bit richer (one bolt on each carb) and the heat should come down, as well as the idle speed.

 

If the coolant level didn't drop, shouldn't really be the gasket.

[luggy 13]

The water level does'nt seem to have dropped and the oil was new and clean also the car is still garaged as i havent got the drivshafts in yet, so the waters definatly come from the coolant.

 

Hi Matt

Im not knit picking and you probably dont want to hear it but its not advisable to have the engine idling with no driveshafts or oil in the box unless you've got the clutch depressed, gearbox wont appreciate being ran dry.

[matt-k 0]

Clutch now depressed! Thanks!

 

Ive had ago at changing the mixture screws on the webbers (do i screw them in for less air?) I tried every variation and even retarded the dissy but once the engine got warm it just picked back up to over 2000 revs and got too hot again! Ive asked a mechanic and he seems to think it could be the timing thats off so im going to take the belt off and start again. Thing is with the timing pins (snug fitting drill bits!) in place surly you cant go wrong??

One more thing that ill add is on tickover the right hand carb has no fuel coming from the main jets (which is correct i believe) but the other one is spitting some fuel from both main jets and is creating a "put put" sound breathing in and out.??

 

Any more ideas welcome.

 

Thanks, Matt.

[woodsy 0]

Clutch now depressed! Thanks!

 

Ive had ago at changing the mixture screws on the webbers (do i screw them in for less air?) I tried every variation and even retarded the dissy but once the engine got warm it just picked back up to over 2000 revs and got too hot again! Ive asked a mechanic and he seems to think it could be the timing thats off so im going to take the belt off and start again. Thing is with the timing pins (snug fitting drill bits!) in place surly you cant go wrong??

One more thing that ill add is on tickover the right hand carb has no fuel coming from the main jets (which is correct i believe) but the other one is spitting some fuel from both main jets and is creating a "put put" sound breathing in and out.??

 

Any more ideas welcome.

 

Thanks, Matt.

 

could it be the carbs need balancing as when i did head on my mi motor and bolted the carbs back on they where miles out.Thats why one of them is put putting noise.

[trialster 0]

the put putting noise is possibly a sign that the timing is out. the valve may be open for too long and overlapping into the compression stroke!

 

just an idea!

[matt-k 0]

the put putting noise is possibly a sign that the timing is out. the valve may be open for too long and overlapping into the compression stroke!

 

just an idea!

 

Yes i had thought that too. Ive checked my timing belt and it seems to be spot on, all the timing holes in the block (Crank) and head line up with the holes in the pullys etc. Ive just removed and refitted the inlet manifold with a new gasket incase any air was getting in that way but the exhaust is still getting far too hot and glowing red

 

Another thought ive had is could i have put the camshafts back in the wrong way round? Is that possible? Exhaust on the inlet & vice versa? They were sat on the bench along time before refitting and got mixed up.

 

Ive yet to do a compression test as i dont have the kit, but maybe i havent lapped in the valves enough and air is being sucked in on the induction & ignition stroke??

 

I know its alot of what ifs but this is the first time ive re-built an engine and want to get it running right (hopefully without having to remove the head again) so any ideas on this are greatly appreciated.

 

Cheers, Matt.

[whizzer71 0]

Hi Matt,sounds like a retardation prob some where,Check both the cam pulleys as the key ways in them sometimes shear,also check the bottom pulley I seem to remember that it is a two part item jointed with rubber ?,if these two parts have shifted and the timing hole is in the outer part then you crank timing could be out against the cam timing (Very common on cast XU's) have seen it on two turbo units now although I realise yours is an alloy 1905cc MI unit,If this is not the case then ignore what Ive just stated cos its utter baloney !.

Failing all of that then it'll be an ignition problem ,try another coil maybe (happened to me in the past also)

 

Good luck

 

Tris

 

Edited March 2, 2008 by whizzer71

[whizzer71 0]

Clutch now depressed! Thanks!

 

Ive had ago at changing the mixture screws on the webbers (do i screw them in for less air?) I tried every variation and even retarded the dissy but once the engine got warm it just picked back up to over 2000 revs and got too hot again! Ive asked a mechanic and he seems to think it could be the timing thats off so im going to take the belt off and start again. Thing is with the timing pins (snug fitting drill bits!) in place surly you cant go wrong??

One more thing that ill add is on tickover the right hand carb has no fuel coming from the main jets (which is correct i believe) but the other one is spitting some fuel from both main jets and is creating a "put put" sound breathing in and out.??

 

Any more ideas welcome.

 

Thanks, Matt.

 

One other thing check the float heights in that carb (ie the one "bleeding fuel"),or even better both carbs and check the float needle/seat also make sure if its rubber tipped it hasnt cracked or hasnt got a worn ridge in it where it locates in the seat.

 

[ALEX 98 1 Cars]

Did the fan kick in?

I wouldn't worry about the oil temp gauge, They usually lack behind the water temp for obvious reasons!

Edited March 3, 2008 by ALEX

[matt-k 0]

Thanks for your suggestions lads, ive rebuilt the carbs and fitted new needle valves and gaskets etc so cant think it would be those? I did set the floats accourding to an article on the internet originally and have tried resetting them to allow more fuel through but that made no difference! The crank pulley timing hole is on the inner part so the rubber wont affect it (good thought mind).

The fan has'nt kicked in yet but i dont run the engine for long as the exhaust starts glowing at anything over 5 minutes but im not sure if the fans pluged in correctly yet but thats somthing to sort out when the engines running better! Unless anyone has a PIC OF WHERE THE FAN PLUG CONNECTS TOO!?

 

God im getting fed up with this engine!

 

Thanks, Matt.

[whizzer71 0]

Thanks for your suggestions lads, ive rebuilt the carbs and fitted new needle valves and gaskets etc so cant think it would be those? I did set the floats accourding to an article on the internet originally and have tried resetting them to allow more fuel through but that made no difference! The crank pulley timing hole is on the inner part so the rubber wont affect it (good thought mind).

The fan has'nt kicked in yet but i dont run the engine for long as the exhaust starts glowing at anything over 5 minutes but im not sure if the fans pluged in correctly yet but thats somthing to sort out when the engines running better! Unless anyone has a PIC OF WHERE THE FAN PLUG CONNECTS TOO!?

 

God im getting fed up with this engine!

 

Thanks, Matt.

 

Check those cam pulleys Matt and try another coil if you have one spare ! ,I can understand that its testing your patience ,But it'll make it all the more worth while when you do ace it !

 

[ALEX 98 1 Cars]

The connector for the fan is usually behind the passangers Headlight!.

Flat (yellow or grey) connector. Replace it with a couple of bullet/spade connectors (large yellow ones) if it's rusty.

[matt-k 0]

I managed to get hold of a compression tester today and the results are as follows 205, 220, 200, 225 psi. Is this ok?

I also removed the rocker cover and spark plugs, placed a screw driver down No1 hole so it rested on the piston, lent a ruler behind it for measurment and turned it over by hand to see when the valves opened & closed in relation to the piston (technical hey!) I found that the exhaust valves begin to open approx 15mm before the ignition stroke reches the bottom of its stroke & the inlet valve is still in the process of closing for approx 15mm on its way up the cylinder on the compression stroke. Is this normal?

Another mechanic i spoke to today who lent me the compression tester says i may have the inlet exhaust cams the wrong way round? what do you think? I noted the markings on them, the inlet has j2 stamped on it and kI at the other end and the exhaust has A2 and Lj stamped on it, mean anything?

 

Anyhow thats it for now, i look forwards to all your technical knoledge and thanks again for any help.

 

Matt.

 

Ps whizzer, i havent checked the pulley splines yet as they were fine when i rebuilt them.

[matt-k 0]

Just to add, im not too worried about the white residue in the filler pipe anymore as theres no oil in the water and the oil on the dipstick looks fine. I just want to stop the exhaust from glowing red!

[sutol 0]

If your ign timing is retarded it will cause the manifold to glow red as the mixture is still burning as it is shoved out the cylinders if you get my drift. Well sort of....

[matt-k 0]

Anyone elts help me out with some answers?

 

Anyone..........

[DrSarty 90 1 Cars]

What Sutol has said makes perfect sense. I think you're barking up the wrong tree worrying at this stage about cooling fans working, as after 5 minutes your engine ABSOLUTELY should not have a glowing exhaust manifold.

 

Something is making this occur, and it sounds like serious timing mismatch to me. It will be a simple mistake and fix; just don't run the engine too much and risk damaging any more components at this stage until you've found the prob.

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

Either very lean, or with the timing very retarded. What ignition system are you using?

 

As I posted nearly a month ago, have you checked the ignition timing?

 

As others have said, if this is drastically wrong then it will make it run very very hot.

 

I'm personally 99% sure this is your problem.....

[ALEX 98 1 Cars]

I don't know much about setting up an Mi16, but it sounds like a mixture issue if it's not the cooling system.

Your Compression results looks as if you've got a healthy engine though!