Long Distance Rally Advice Wanted

[casnell 0]

On the subject of water<>oil and air<>oil coolers, running both isn't really feasible as they both use a sandwich plate behind the oil filter. You could plumb them off a single sandwich plate sequentially but I honestly never had anything useful to say about the water<>oil on a competition car. Ok - one good point - it helps get the oil up to temparature - but in a competition car it never cooled the oil enough. I would go with a good old mocal-style cooler up front behind the bumper and in front of the water radiator. Try and tuck it up a little so it doesn't get hit with flying stones/rocks from cars in front, if that's an issue with your style of motorsport (not sure)?

 

The Grp.N gear linkage was basically uprated bar ends with a little catch wire to apparently help them stay on. I've ran them for several years now and never had the need to go to Grp.A. Grp.A, as petert has shown, is full rose jointed kit but does mean a modification to your linkage underneath the gear stick, and also the one arm on your gearbox.

Ok, where's the best place to get an air/oil rad style cooler from?

 

I think maybe the Gpn style is probably ok, I've done a lot of dirt miles with no prob.s yet.(mind you, it is a long event...)

[MrG 3]

on the subject of lights, how about a roof mounted set, african safari rally cars had roof mtd lamps, saves them getting knocked off on a large yump or soil bank leaving you with nothing? Plus with air inlet many have roof mounted set ups to try and reduce the amount of crap getting in?

[casnell 0]

on the subject of lights, how about a roof mounted set, african safari rally cars had roof mtd lamps, saves them getting knocked off on a large yump or soil bank leaving you with nothing? Plus with air inlet many have roof mounted set ups to try and reduce the amount of crap getting in?

No, centre of lights has to below the bottom of the windscreen, pity cos in dust it would be nice to have high ones...

 

A snorkel is an interesting thought, I'll check the regs.

[base-1 17]

Seam weld the shell if you can, if you don't have a fancy cage add to it. Fcuk all balljoints right off, french tat is made of butter. Rose joint the lower arms definitely, do the steering rack too if you can and gear links as previously said. Hard rubber front top and rear beam mounts would be good as they have some pliancy but shouldn't fall apart.

 

Have you just got one small bar across in front of the rad? Something bigger braced onto the chassis/tied into the cage if it's triangulated would be good and offer alot more protection if you hit a roo or tree.

 

How serious is your chassis prep? Finishing a safari type rally without shattering the car into bits needs a real strong shell. Sounds like you'll have a great time

Edited February 24, 2008 by base-1

[casnell 0]

Seam weld the shell if you can, if you don't have a fancy cage add to it. Fcuk all balljoints right off, french tat is made of butter. Rose joint the lower arms definitely, do the steering rack too if you can and gear links as previously said. Hard rubber front top and rear beam mounts would be good as they have some pliancy but shouldn't fall apart.

 

Have you just got one small bar across in front of the rad? Something bigger braced onto the chassis/tied into the cage if it's triangulated would be good and offer alot more protection if you hit a roo or tree.

 

How serious is your chassis prep? Finishing a safari type rally without shattering the car into bits needs a real strong shell. Sounds like you'll have a great time

Some seam welding was done when the cage went in.

 

It's a fully welded-in cage with fairly serious diagonals already, so I'm happy with that. I'm trying to work out some sort of front bar, you're correct, at the moment it's only got an alloy bar for the lights and it will need to be a bit more serious. The sump guard actually protrudes in front of the skirt, so I might put bars up from that.

 

I'm so excited already, and it's six months off!

[base-1 17]

Cool. Are the suspension mounts tied into the cage? If not I'd do this when you reinforce the strut tops. Some forwards triangulating would be good for possible impacts aswell, I'll get a pic in a minute to show what I mean.... quick edit - the sump guard protuding is good aswell

Edited February 24, 2008 by base-1

[base-1 17]

 

Something like this, over the distance/terrain you'll be covering, a bit of extra weight like this won't hamper you in comparison to the car deforming and things falling off lol - brace the engine mounts and subframe where you can aswell as the shape of the bay/chassis rails to turrets etc

Edited February 25, 2008 by base-1

[casnell 0]

Did a shakedown Rally last weekend of 1900 km around Victoria.(The UK fits into the state of Victoria if that gives you an idea of size!) We covered snow, mud, tarmac, gravel, salt pans and sandy desert, great adventure!

 

Car performed really well except got 1700k's into it and broke a driveshaft tripod (1.6 shafts) so next on the list is to upgrade to 1.9 shafts.

 

Other problem was we lost one set of rear pads. I had this problem last year so i wired the wedge in as per the build manual and still lost a set. Any suggestions?

 

Cheers, Chris

[casnell 0]

bump re pads falling out?????

[casnell 0]

bump re pads falling out?????

No-one got an idea to firmly fix pads in????

[Craigb 2]

If you have wired the wedge as you call it in and still lost a set , then tehre must be some wear in either the caliper the wedge or the pad back plate is not the correct size.

 

Did you lose the wedge as well?

[casnell 0]

If you have wired the wedge as you call it in and still lost a set , then tehre must be some wear in either the caliper the wedge or the pad back plate is not the correct size.

 

Did you lose the wedge as well?

New Endless pads, new wedge, and yes lost the wedge as well...I think the pads were maybe not as tight as they could be, but they are great pads.

 

The wedge(what is the correct term?) was pretty tight though, I had quite a bit of trouble getting it in.

 

It was a bl**dy rough event, although I expect the Sept one to be longer and rougher.

[base-1 17]

Could you weld fixings for a bracket over the top of the pads, looks a bit like the fuel pump cradle support in the pic I posted above (three speed holes in it), that would prevent the pads coming out of the top, and then drill the tabs on the backing plate and wire them to this bracket?

 

Would probably double the time taken to fit/remove pads but should keep them in there alright... probably haven't explained what I mean very well mind!

[James_R 3]

you can get 405 wedges which are meant to be slightly beefier, or get new rear calipers or upgrade to drums to stop it happening?

[jonnie205 1]

make sure battery is well strapped down, and terminals are on good these often, have you got strut top reinforcement plates?

[casnell 0]

Upgrade to drums means fouling problems with rear wheels, although maybe not a bad idea from a safety point of view. I'll investigate 405 wedges, I was thinking of making thicker ones myself.

 

Battery is well stuck down behind co-driver.

 

Haven't got reinforcement plates, probably should have, but it's done 17 rallies without and no problems there (yet).

[jonah 1]

Have you got the Peugeot Sport Rally Build Book? That shows where to drill and lockwire the rear calipers so the wedge can't fall out. There are scanned copies floating round the 'net in pdf format, PM me if you can't find it and I'll send you a copy.

 

Other weak points that haven't already been mentioned, based on my experience:

The exhaust manifold to downpipe joint - the cups that locate the bolt heads in the manifold flange can pull through, and also the lugs on the downpipe flange can snap off. Worth carrying some steel wire (and thick gloves!) with you so you can lash it back together if it fails.

Check whether the diff drain plug is hitting the sump guard over rough ground - it does on my car, and managed to work itself loose and fall out on one event. Lockwire it!

Obvious really but make sure the cooling system is in top condition, rubber coolant hoses always seem to be a weakness - ideally replace the whole lot with silicone hoses. Also carry hose repair bandage and spare water, and make sure the coolant level sensor is working! (the early type sensor clogs up and siezes with age)

 

Which end of the driveshaft did you break on the shakedown? If it was the inner then 1.9 shafts won't help as the inner joints are the same on both. You can reduce the risk of the LH driveshaft failing by fitting a third rubber buffer in the top right engine mount to prevent the engine moving too far to the right.

 

Tachymetric relays are also apparently known to fail, so bring a spare...

 

Anyway sounds like a great event... good luck!!

Edited May 15, 2008 by jonah

[casnell 0]

Have you got the Peugeot Sport Rally Build Book? That shows where to drill and lockwire the rear calipers so the wedge can't fall out. There are scanned copies floating round the 'net in pdf format, PM me if you can't find it and I'll send you a copy.

 

Other weak points that haven't already been mentioned, based on my experience:

The exhaust manifold to downpipe joint - the cups that locate the bolt heads in the manifold flange can pull through, and also the lugs on the downpipe flange can snap off. Worth carrying some steel wire (and thick gloves!) with you so you can lash it back together if it fails.

Check whether the diff drain plug is hitting the sump guard over rough ground - it does on my car, and managed to work itself loose and fall out on one event. Lockwire it!

Obvious really but make sure the cooling system is in top condition, rubber coolant hoses always seem to be a weakness - ideally replace the whole lot with silicone hoses. Also carry hose repair bandage and spare water, and make sure the coolant level sensor is working! (the early type sensor clogs up and siezes with age)

 

Which end of the driveshaft did you break on the shakedown? If it was the inner then 1.9 shafts won't help as the inner joints are the same on both. You can reduce the risk of the LH driveshaft failing by fitting a third rubber buffer in the top right engine mount to prevent the engine moving too far to the right.

 

Tachymetric relays are also apparently known to fail, so bring a spare...

 

Anyway sounds like a great event... good luck!!

Yeah, I've got the build manual and drilled/wired as per. Funnily enough the genuine Pug one fell out, the bodged one didn't! Good thought on the exhaust, I've noticed my manifold has a small crack repair that seems to be opening again. This seems a common problem with cast manifolds, should I get SS extractors???? or repair again???

Hadn't heard of drain plugs hitting, I'll check.

Coolant system was all replaced in Feb with BBM silicon hoses.(cost as much as the car lol)

Broke the inner tripod on the RHS, I've been told the later ones don't have a tripod?( remembering our early ones are really 1.6's)

Spare Tachy is a good idea...

 

Thanks guys so much for the ideas !

[casnell 0]

Well the events been run and won, not by us!

 

We broke a front wishbone bolt when we hit the second of two big holes on the first day, almost exactly at the geographic centre of Australia !

This was not such a problem, but it allowed the RHS driveshaft to pull apart at the inner CV and spit roller bearings down the road.

Took us a day to get a new shaft which meant we could rejoin, but were never going to be in the running.

 

We ended up doing 8000k's in 9 days - it's a big country!

 

Apart from that we killed the wishbone bushes and had to fit the spares, killed the rear billies and had to fit the spares, killed the exhaust and put up with the noise, killed the lightswitch and had to turn the headlights off by pulling the plugs off, smashed 1 headlight, wore out 4 tyres and had 2 flats,had 1 front and 1 rear caliper fall off, killed 1 fuel filter, lost lots of sleep and had lots of fun !

 

Thanks for all the advice, Chris

 

Here's a pic near Birdsville in the Simpson desert, more at Flickr, look for chrs_snll

[casnell 0]

More pix! I'll bet not many 205's have got to the Birdsville Pub![a

ttachment=6007:_DSC5578.jpg]

Edited November 16, 2008 by casnell

[Chris H 10]

Great Photo and a big well done to finnish the event. Probably covered more distance in one event that i've done in 10 years of rallying!

 

Do you mind if i copy your post on the brittish rally forum as there is a thread there about the extremes you will do to finnish a rally.

[jonnie205 1]

nice looking 205, any more pics of cage, engine bay etc?

[casnell 0]

Great Photo and a big well done to finnish the event. Probably covered more distance in one event that i've done in 10 years of rallying!

 

Do you mind if i copy your post on the brittish rally forum as there is a thread there about the extremes you will do to finnish a rally.

No worries !

 

 

And happy to put more pics up of the car, the insides still pretty filthy tho.

 

Changing back from standard 1.6 to worked (cam, decked, adj cam pulley, high comp) DKZ- can't wait!

Edited November 18, 2008 by casnell

[Saveit 0]

Impressively done there mate! When i started reading this thread, i never thought that a 205 could actually make it through such a rally (comparing to my own 205's which seem to fail all the time just by daily driving). Really impressed.

 

And the things that broke - well is it at all possible to do such a rally without anything breaking or falling off? Maybe you can prepare the car even better for next years event

 

I would love to do such a rally myself, but i would never trust a 205 to do the job allthough you have proven that they can

 

Great effort!

Edited November 18, 2008 by Saveit

[casnell 0]

Impressively done there mate! When i started reading this thread, i never thought that a 205 could actually make it through such a rally (comparing to my own 205's which seem to fail all the time just by daily driving). Really impressed.

 

And the things that broke - well is it at all possible to do such a rally without anything breaking or falling off? Maybe you can prepare the car even better for next years event

 

I would love to do such a rally myself, but i would never trust a 205 to do the job allthough you have proven that they can

 

Great effort!

I was pretty happy with the car, pretty much every car had it's dramas, and lets just say we had lovely sound and light shows each night with welders and angle grinders sending the sparks flying.

 

Quite a number of broken diffs, X-members, and major structural bits. One car they even welded the back doors shut because the shell started splitting across the back and they thought that would help. A Skyline resorted to welding star-picket sections all over the rear suspension to stop it twisting!