1.6 Brake System

[robbiecfc 0]

Hi All,

 

Had an interesting experience last night. Brake pedal went to the floor during a bit of spirited driving. Pumped it and got a bit of braking back but it seemed mainly at the back only as they locked up once or twice while I was trying to shed some speed.

Few questions before I shell out...

 

1: Does this point to the master cylinder or a split line somewhere at the front?

2: Am going to replace the whole lot as that is the sort of excitement I am not looking for... Where is recommended for the various pipework, MasterCylinder, Discs, Pads, Drums and Shoes?

3: I believe std discs and drums are ok but an uprated pad type is recommended for 1.6s? Which pads?

4: Copper / Nickel or stainless braided throughout? Views and Opinions?

 

Thanks,

 

Robbie

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

1) Check for split fluid lines and fluid leaks first, if you can't see anything then the master cylinder is the next likely culprit.

 

2) Any decent motor factor or parts place will be able to get everything you need.

 

3) For uprated pads I have personally used and can recommend either Ferodo DS2500 or Mintex 1144 material pads.

 

4) I've recently done my own car with copper solid lines, and a Goodrich braided flexible line kit. With the calipers cleaned and lubricated and the rear drums cleaned and adjusted up the brakes are now good. Some people have had problems with aeroquip lines all the way through the car come MOT time. Also the hose is cheap enough but the fittings start to get expensive very quickly, especially if you use stainless instead of plated steel. For an all out track car used for nothing else I would use aeroquip lines. For anything else I'd do what I have done and run copper solid pipes with braided flexibles.

Edited January 14, 2008 by Tom Fenton

[robbiecfc 0]

1) Check for split fluid lines and fluid leaks first, if you can't see anything then the master cylinder is the next likely culprit.

 

2) Any decent motor factor or parts place will be able to get everything you need.

 

3) For uprated pads I have personally used and can recommend either Ferodo DS2500 or Mintex 1144 material pads.

 

4) I've recently done my own car with copper solid lines, and a Goodrich braided flexible line kit. With the calipers cleaned and lubricated and the rear drums cleaned and adjusted up the brakes are now good. Some people have had problems with aeroquip lines all the way through the car come MOT time. Also the hose is cheap enough but the fittings start to get expensive very quickly, especially if you use stainless instead of plated steel. For an all out track car used for nothing else I would use aeroquip lines. For anything else I'd do what I have done and run copper solid pipes with braided flexibles.

 

Hmm in the UK maybe, Ireland not a hope.

Was thinking of using Automec for the solid lines and Goodridge for the flexy stuff so was not far off. Xcellent

[VisaGTi16v 1]

1144's should be fine for road use, ensure you bed them in properly. Would be worth cleaning up the calipers with a wire brush and copper slipping the runners whilst doing all this lot

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Make sure you use a Bendix Master Cylinder, the amout of problems I;ve found with the cheaper pattern ones make them worthless.

The Slave cylinders are worth swaping too as another common point of failure with making sure the self adjusters are working

 

Solid lines are fine in copper/Nickel and a local garage could make them up within minutes which might be cheaper?

 

Pads, Ferodo do a fast road pad under the DS range just like the Mintex Extreme pads which are aimed more at road use and again the price compared with the 1144 or DS2500's is allot better.

 

With the lines make sure you get stainless fittings as the plated ones go rusty in no time at all

[robbiecfc 0]

Thanks for all the replies and advice, much appreciated.

 

Tom, you were spot on with your diagnosis. Turned out to be master cylinder.

 

Couple of questions:

Miles - Bendix Master Cylinder - Do you know of any suppliers off hand? PM me if it conflicts with site policy. Ref the slave cylinders, are they also known as wheel cylinders, i.e a LH and RH type?

Visa - gonna sound really stupid - Whats the best bedding in process? What do you mean by 'copper slipping the runners'?

 

Thanks Again.

[VisaGTi16v 1]

Just rubbing some copper slip (its like a hard grease type thing, get from Halfords), over the runners once you have cleaned them up properly.

 

Most pads have different bedding in procedures if you google but the Mintex 1155's I have were along the lines of three 30-5 stops then three 50-5 then three 80-5 then cool down, and they stunk REALLY bad after this. They still needed a bit more bedding in though as highlighted by the extreme smell after the first practise at the next sprint then the amount of smoke coming off them after the second practise, been brilliant since heh. Less extreme pads wont need so much. Generally a similar process to the above should be ok for most, just make sure you cool them down at the end by driving for a couple of miles with as little braking as possible

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

Slave cylinders are also known as wheel cylinders, yes.

 

The procedure that has always worked bedding in pads for me is as follows.

Drive up to mid revs in 1st gear, progressively stop down to <5mph.

Drive up to mid revs in 2nd gear, progressively stop down to <5mph.

Drive up to mid revs in 3rd gear, progressively stop down to <5mph.

Drive up to mid revs in 4th gear, progressively stop down to <5mph.

Drive up to mid revs in 5th gear, progressively stop down to <5mph.

Allow brakes to cool right down, then repeat the sequence.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

GSF sell the Bendix ones but just make sure you ask for them, The rear cylinders are normal again Bendix or Lucas supplied.

 

As Visa has said all pads have different bedding in proceedure's which relates to the compound of them so just have a read of the instruction's but most road type pads are pretty robust and don;t need allot