[rally_prep] 205 1.6 Gti Rally Car Build

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well it's been ages since I last updated this thread but I've done quite a bit, nearly there in fact

 

The bodywork is complete and it runs, well did run until someone punctured the fuel tank on the back of a flatbed...just need to sort out a bias valve, tidy up a bit of wiring and fit windscreen and it'll be ready for its MOT!

 

 

I still need to upload the most recent pics but here's a taster:

 

Engine plumbed in

 

Starting to look more rally car like

 

 

More pics soon I promise

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Finally got around to uploading all my pics now

 

Getting ready for spraying:

 

 

 

 

Just sprayed:

 

 

4 or so weeks later:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It still needs a fuel tank, windscreen and brakes bleeding but it's a lot nearer now

 

Hopefully it'll be on the road next time update this

Edited October 19, 2008 by stuart

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well I'm on night shift and am bored so think it's about time I updated this thread seeing as it's been on the road now for nearly a year. ( I did spend about 45 mins writing a full story but I've just lost it and really can't be arse writing all that out again...)

 

Basically, it passed it's mot fine, I fitted all the safety kit, gaurds, etc and I acquired an MSA log book and then drove it on the road for a couple of weeks.

Had no problems to speak of except a couple of minor leaks, I put some proper oil in after running it on cheap stuff for a few hundred miles and then was ready for my first rally, the SMC stages at Weeton Army barracks back in March.

 

Here's a couple of pics:

 

 

 

 

 

The car ran almost faultlessly all the event except for the gear linkage popping off - fixed with the r-clip off an axle stand of all things! Also on one of the closeing stages, I blew one of the spax dampers on a surface change on a corner so was a bit soft for the last couple of stages. Out of about 50 finishers we came 18th o/a and 6th in class, which considering the car is pretty standard, I was very chuffed and glad that the car stood up to the punishment it took.

 

So for the next event, I decided to enter the welsh international rally on the Epynt army ranges in wales, as this was to be the first round of the 205 challenge, which I will be competing in next season.

After Weeton, I had to replace the front damper I broke but I thought I'd upgrade them seeing as they weren't particularly up to rallying, so I took the plunge and got hold of some new poper Bilstein adjustable platforms. On recommendation, I went for the gravel inserts but with a long tarmac spring as a compromise for both gravel and tar. On fitting these, the ride height was considerably higher than before (was too low anyway) so I decided to raise the rear to match. This was a little bit last minuite, so did it the spline method as I don't have a torsion bar puller. For some reason, I ended up with a very high ride height and couldn't get an in between setting but Epynt is notorious for it's yumps and crests so left it at that until I had time to do it properly.

 

Here's some pics of the car in action on the ranges:

 

 

 

The event didn't go quite as smoothly as weeton, as on changing into 3rd after the start line the clutch cable snapped!!! I managed to get it back to service, which was interesting, having to set off on the starter motor. Luckily I had a spare clutch cable so that was changed but we pickep up 1 min 30 pens on top of the time lost with the problem. By then we were almost last, but was just glad to be able to carry on as the roads were amazing down there! In the end, we finished 57th over all and 12th (ish) in class but had some good stages (saw over 110 on the speedo a couple of times!).

 

One thing that did frustrate me though was the cars lack of power, especially at epynt as it had some very steep hills where other cars were making loads of time on me, only to catch them up again on the fast downhill bits. The lack of power was noticably low down, so I decided to rebuild the engine and whilst at it make a few 'improvements'.

 

So this is how the car looks at the moment:

 

 

And here's a taster of what's to come:

 

 

 

The engine I am building has had the bottom end balanced with lightened flywheel, new pistons / liners, worked head with Newman 300 cam and will be breathing through the Weber 45's and Longman 4-2-1. Hopefully I'll be looking at the good side of 140bhp with a good torque and power band but I'm not getting my hopes up too much as I'm not sure what the head will be like, although it was done recently at Mikeanics in Congleton, which I've heard good thing about.

I've also picked up a gearbox with a Quaiffe 4.8 CWP and ATB LSD so this should help out of the tight chicanes where it was really struggling.

 

More pics to come soon when I start assembling the engine - just waiting on some main bearings to arrive and then things should start to happen a bit more quickly.

 

Hopefully I will be out again before the end of the year, looking at the Christmas stages at Croft at the moment.

 

Thanks for looking

 

Stu

p.s. can a moderator please merge my other project thread: http://forum.205gtidrivers.com/index.php?s...20&start=20 into this one and move it into the projects section? I cant seem to add any more to posts to that any more...

Edited October 26, 2009 by stuart

[brumster 135 1 Cars]

Excellent, another rally man amongst the fold !

 

I can't help but think you'd be best ditching the ATB diff and replacing it with a plate-type though, particularly if you're doing some gravel stages next year. You should get good money for it (potentially on here, of all places) to put towards a Kaaz/TranX/etc. and it could just be what saves your bacon in the woods. Would be useful on tarmac too, don't get me wrong.

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

I know, I keep thinking the same actually but am going to stick with this for now for various reasons.

 

I was going to go for a tranx originally but have heard that they're very heavy on the steering, unless you fit power steering of course. This box came up as a complete unit though and cost the same as a tranx on it's own so that's another reason why I didn't go for one. Also, less maintenance, cost, etc.

 

I think I'll see how it goes for now, can always change it easily enough and sell it on, like you say they seem to hold their value well.

[brumster 135 1 Cars]

True, it would make things a little tougher on the tarmac, although you'd probably be alright in the forests (depends how 'beef' you are ). Mind you, putting a power steering rack in is no bad thing for the quicker rack/etc. Maybe a future upgrade for you to keep in mind then the ATB will certainly be better on the tarmac than not having one...!

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

True, it would make things a little tougher on the tarmac, although you'd probably be alright in the forests (depends how 'beef' you are ). Mind you, putting a power steering rack in is no bad thing for the quicker rack/etc. Maybe a future upgrade for you to keep in mind then the ATB will certainly be better on the tarmac than not having one...!

 

To be honest I found it hard enough wrestling it through the stupidly tight chicanes they put in without an LSD and I'm not exactly what you'd call small. Saying that though, I have been driving a power steering car for the past 6 months or so which doesn't help...need to get the other 205 back on the road again - beats going to the gym any day!

 

I think if I decide to swap to a plate diff I'll fit power steering then. I was actually looking at PS racks on GSF before and they're only about 110 quid, cheaper than a quaiffe quickrack kit and you then have the option to go power assisted too if you want. How much quicker is the PS rack compared to the normal one?

 

By the way, I meant to post up a pic of this exhaust manifold I won on Ebay a while back:

 

 

It's supposed to be a Longman one - can anyone confirm it's actually a Longman and if it's going to be any good for my engine spec? It looks very nicely made and has been ceramic coated once upon a time...

I've got a Magnex 4-1 at the moment but thought that a 4-2-1 might give better torque low down. That's the impression I've got after reading many threads on here over the years. I've still got my Magnex anyway so might even try both to see which one works best.

 

 

Some more pics of random bits:

 

Whilst waiting for engine bits to turn up I got bored It's still only half done too

 

Engine mounts and brackets ready to go on, although I need to grind a bit off the alternator bracket yet so the inlet manifold fits.

[Sven_2k4 0]

How's the Mini project going?

 

Also have you got a wiring diagram of the loom your using? i.e what did you keep, what did you bin?

 

Sven ;o)

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well the engine build is well underway. I've built up the bottom end, just need to fit the oil pump, sump, baffle and then fit the head, ancillaries, etc and it's done.

 

I have a few pics but will update this thread next week as hopefully I will be fitting the new engine, providing I get it finished this weekend.

 

I've also been buying more bits...have a Megajolt ECU to run the ignition on the new engine with fuelling taken car of by the twin 45 Webers

Brakes are being replaced by Hi Spec 4 pot calipers and a Stud / nut kit from the group buy arrived yesterday too so will be getting those on shortly after then engine is in. Before I put it back on the road the rear beam will be rebuilt, have all the bits now just need to get round to doing it, as always

 

The loom is pretty much as it was to look at, I just removed the wiring for the stereo, electric windows, interior lights and central locking. I left the wires for the heater in case I wanted to fit it again (which I will be doing when I get hold of another one...) and also the wires for the cig lighter so I can fit a map light or Potti when I get around to it. Only done daylight rallies so far so not needed one up to now!

To work out which wires needed to come out I just separated what I knew I didn't need and then went through the haynes manual and tried to find the rest, which was fun...Amazingly everything worked first time too!

 

By the way, in my last post I mentioned that I have a new 4-2-1 manifold which I thought was a Longman.

It is actually a Maniflow so should hopefully work well with the head / webers. I'm just wondering if it's going to be any better suited to the engine than the Magnex 4-1 it is replacing though?

I'm looking for as much torque as possible from the engine with it being for rallying, so thought that 4-2-1's are generally better for this.

 

Has anyone had any experience with this manifold?

Edited November 13, 2009 by stuart

[Sven_2k4 0]

Hi

 

did you use and tune the 1.6 in the end or did you transplant a 1.9?

 

dont seem to be having a great deal of sucsess finding a donor 205 1.9 GTi so may have to source a 1.6 instead......

 

Cheers Steve

[brumster 135 1 Cars]

By the way, in my last post I mentioned that I have a new 4-2-1 manifold which I thought was a Longman.

It is actually a Maniflow so should hopefully work well with the head / webers. I'm just wondering if it's going to be any better suited to the engine than the Magnex 4-1 it is replacing though?

 

I believe Longman specced it for Maniflow to build for them exclusively, but then over the years Maniflow started selling it via other routes. My "Longman" manifold is stamped "Maniflow".

 

This is the case with tonnes of Pug performance parts to be honest. "PTS Sump Baffles", christ, how many copies of these have I seen. Ultimately, it doesn't take much for someone to copy a load of laser-cut steel and weld it together, I guess. Everyone and their pet dog does it - takes a generic or copied part and stamps their name on it in an effort to become some amazing Peugeot performance tuning specialist... anyway, I digress....

 

Keep up the good work!

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well the engine isn't in yet but it's not far off, just need to time up the cam but have to wait for a vernier wheel to come and need to find out the crank angle when the cam is at max lift first.

 

Here's a few pics of where I'm up to though:

 

Bottom end built up

 

 

 

Nice clean sump, won't stay like that for long!

 

 

Head on

 

 

Bit of bling

 

 

Exhaust manifold fitted

 

 

Gearbox cleaning with BE3 clutch fork fitted

 

 

Lightened flywheel

 

 

 

T16 style front bumper for extra cooling with lowered rad

 

 

I'm going to get the car back on its wheels today and get the engine bay ready as I'm off work , so when I get the belt fitted I can drop it straight in.

 

More pics to come, that's my limit for today!

Edited November 24, 2009 by stuart

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well lots of progress this week, engine and gearbox are now more or less complete and are back where they belong at long last!

 

I found out off Newman cams that mine should be a Tarmac Rallysprint cam, so once my timing wheel had arrived and I'd borrowed a DTI off my uncle, I was able to set the timing as per the spec on their website. After fitting the belt, I turned over the engine a good few times by hand with no nasty noises. I then rechecked than cam timing again and amazingly it needed no further adjustment, so on went the covers and in it went.

 

I'm now waiting for a 306 xsi thermostat housing to arrive and then I can fit that along with a 306 coil pack and the engine can be filled with oil.

 

I also need to fit the trigger wheel, which is currently being drilled so it can be bolted to the alternator pulley (hole needs to be 14mm and bang in the middle so getting my uncle to do it on his stand drill) and then I need to make a bracket for the crank sensor.

I've actually decided to use a mondeo cam sensor as it's a lot smaller than the usual EDIS VR sensor but does the same job aparantly.

 

Once these little jobs are out of the way I will, with help from my dad, be attempting to wire all the Megajolt stuff up. I have left all the existing injection wiring in so that I have the option to fit a standard engine if I ever need to, so I will be installing a separate loom for the Megajolt instead of butchering what's already there.

 

In the meantime I've started lowering the rad and altering the fan cowling / slam panel to make room for a heat shield to direct air towards the carbs.

Up to now I've cut out the drivers side of the cowling (no fan so might as well go!) but have kept the surround so I can keep the original fan and also the original mounts for the grill.

When I fit the oil cooler (when it warms up a bit) there should be plenty of room to mount it now.

I cut off the lower rad mounts too, as I'll be attatching it to some L brackets on the front panel, about 4" lower than on the plastic cowling.

 

I've also marked out the slam panel as it needs cutting slightly to clear the air filters but I also want to take off the vertical parts of it that mask the carbs to allow even more air to get to them. Probably won't make that much difference but every little helps eh!

 

Anyway, here's a few pics of the progress:

 

Timing up the engine

 

Ready to go in

 

Back where it belongs

 

Fitted new clutch / lightened fly

 

Webery goodness

 

 

Hacked up fan cowling

 

Air box idea

 

I didn't bother putting the car back on it's wheels in the end, partly because I wanted to fit the driveshafts first but also as the wheels wont go over my new brakes...

I've tried spacing the calipers inboard by a few mm, I've had the brackets machined 2mm to bring the calipers nearer to the hub but they still touch the wheel, so looks like I need some spacers, which isn't ideal but should be ok up to 5mm or so. They look nice though so here's a pic

 

 

Thanks for looking, any comments / ideas welcome

 

Stu

Edited December 7, 2009 by stuart

[swordfish210 20]

I just gave the whole thing a read and theres some nice work you've done Once question about the radiator fan, wouldn't it have been easier to ditch the whole cowling and fit a new fan to the radiator as i've done?

[welshpug 1,661]

just curious, but what pistons have you gone for?

 

Worth mentioning that the standard engines have nowhere near enough compression for most cams, mine was ruddy awful with the PTS/Piper/Longman Gravel rally cam, though you might get away with it with carbs, it definitely doesn't work on the standard intake as it is.

 

also, have you trial fitted the lowered rad with the sump guard in place?

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

It might've been a bit neater to fit another fan to the rad but would mean buying an aftermarket one, making brackets up for it and also the grill mounts.

I had a slightly broken cowling and fan spare so thought I'd see how I could use that, I got the idea off Dreamweavers car when looking at how to lower the rad. The only minor issue is that the fan is still in the normal place but it shouldn't matter too much, the good thing though is that I can use the original grill mounts, which are also the perfect height to attach the heat shield too.

 

I haven't checked the sump gaurd yet but it only hangs under the front panel by about 1/2" so think I'll be ok. I haven't finished designing it yet, just been finding out what fits where best.

I'll hopefully be sorting out some brackets for the rad today and also make the actual heat shield from a sheet of ally. I'm just wondering if it's going to be worth extending the scoop up to the slam panel and box in the top or not?

I don't think carbs work too well with the ram air effect though, just want to direct a bit of cold air to the trumpets really.

 

The pistons I've used are standard ones but the head has had a lot taken off it, not sure what the compression ratio will be but I bought the cam with the worked head so hopefully it'll work ok with it.

The engine it came from, which also had a standard (used) bottom end, standard exhaust, 40 webers and a dizzy it made just over 140bhp so as long as it's somewhere near that I'll be happy enough. Just hope I've built the engine ok, we'll see...

[swordfish210 20]

I mounted my rad with cable ties It's allright for a circuit car, might be a bit much for a rally car though:

 

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well it's taken a bit longer than planned after having to mess about making brackets, finding temp sensors, being too cold, etc but last night I finally got the new engine running.

 

Amazingly it fired 1st turn of the key and after I remembered to connect the servo vacuum it sprung into life! I only ran it for 30 secs or so but I could hold the revs steady at about 2krpm and it felt very responsive. So far so good...

 

I'll try and add some more pics later on after I've run it a bit more

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Managed to get out in the garage again tonight for an hour, topped up the coolant and checked for leaks. All seems fine apart from a minor leak from the thermostat outlet which can be fixed with a bit of instant gasket, just means draining the coolant again...could be worse I suppose....

 

So then I gave the webers a couple of pumps to get the fuel through and she fired up first turn of the key and still sounds sweet as a nut!

So, so far so good. Just can't wait to get it on the road and run in properly

 

Anyway, here's a few pics, although not particularly interesting sorry:

 

The bracket I made for the crank sensor

 

 

 

Fitted

 

 

How the engine looks now, catch tank isn't permanent by the way

 

 

Will try and upload some vids when it's on the road, sounds pretty good already though

Edited January 13, 2010 by stuart

[finnthebt 0]

Very clean, neat and tidy......but the catch tank??!!

 

.....whoops ..I should read the image comments first!!!!! (not that I really thought it wasn't going to get replaced).

Edited March 10, 2010 by finnthebt

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Well I've had the car set up finally. I've temporarily removed the megajolt though as I had loads of problems with a missfire under load, the first place I went to couldn't get rid of it and blamed it on the fuel pump and regulator setup I was running, changed to a facet red top pump and filter king regulator and it was better but the missfire was still there so they blamed it on the megajolt. So I swapped back to the dizzy and amazingly it was still there!

 

The problem was finally traced to the venturi bolts on the webers being loose (by Mikeanics - he knows his 205's!) and one had come out completely!

All the bolts were loose when I got them but they had tab washers locking them in place so thought they were supposed to be like that, it's amazing how much of an effect these caused, car was almost undriveable on the road yet was fine in the garage...lesson learnt

 

The car was set up at Mikeanics in Congleton and I can't recommend them enough, in just a few hours he sorted all the problems and got 157bhp and 126lbft out of it! I was only expecting 130-140bhp so I was over the moon with the result, the car is an absolute flying machine compared to before.

With the megajolt, it'll be even better, can't wait to see what it'll do then! I've also fitted some shorter, larger radius ram pipes as the ones I had were too long and were almost up against the filters, the new ones should work better than the weber ones anyway, look more impressive anyway if nothing else!

 

I'm still waiting for my in car camera but once sorted I'll get some videos done, I'm doing a test day next sat so hope to have it in before then.

Edited March 13, 2010 by stuart

[Craigb 2]

Nice one Glad you Sorted it .

 

Mike is a Top Bloke !

[Adrian247 5 1 Cars]

Just read this thread from start to finish, very interesting and inspirational. The car looks good too. Thanks.

[tomcolinjones 26]

n e news on the in car camers? wana hear what this baby sounds like. uve put a lot of work and effort into that car. it is very smart and looks realy neat.

good job

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

n e news on the in car camers? wana hear what this baby sounds like. uve put a lot of work and effort into that car. it is very smart and looks realy neat.

good job

 

Thanks for the postive comments I've definitely been putting the hours in recently! Just come in from the garage now actually getting it ready for 1st round of the 205 challenge next week. It's back on Megajolt again now and is going to be tweaked on Tuesday so will see what it can really do then

 

The camera is in now, here's a link to my youtube channel with a few vids of the test day I went to a couple of weeks ago:

 

http://www.youtube.com/user/stuartingham?feature=mhw5

 

Unfortunately the sound is a bit too sensitive due to me having it on the wrong setting but I'm really impressed with the quality of the pictures, the DVR is a cool little bit of kit.

 

Anyone interested in a camera like it, check out www.4kam.com tell them Stuart Ingham told you about them

Edited April 4, 2010 by stuart