Gearbox Choice For Gti6 Conversion

[funkymofo 0]

I am unsure about which box to use on my gti6 conversion.

 

I have ruled out the 1.6 box due to the useless 1st gear reports and unfriendly m'way driving.

I have also ruled out the gti6 box because of the complications of fitment and turning right etc.

 

Being as I have a 1.9 anyway, it made sense to me to use the existing box.

The other choice was the 5 speed box off a xsara vts, as I figure this will be more matched to the engine.

The only problem with that is that I cant seem to find anyone that makes an LSD or ATB for the VTS box, which would definately be on my list of upgrades for the future.

 

The car is going to be mainly fast road use with as many track days as I can afford, but I'd rather build it to track spec than road spec.

 

Anyone got any experience of the vts box? Or know of any available diff options for it?

Likewise has anyone got experience of the 1.9 BE3 on a gti6 lump and what do you think about it for both track and road usage?

 

I know parts of this question have been asked before and I apologise for that but I just wanted to paint the whole picture so I would get a more relevant answer.

 

Cheers

[jackherer 543]

The VTS box is just a BE3 so you can use a normal BE diff.

 

I am normally strongly against 1.9 boxes on 16v engines but I have driven a 205 with a GTI6 on a 1.9 box and it pulled a lot better than an Mi16 would have done and worked quite well. It did have a longmans head + cams though.

[sorr 0]

On my Mi16 I have a 1.9 box with 1.6 final drive which gets rid of the short first gear then gives you very closely spacing. For fast road and track use I would think it was ideal compromise. For example overtaking the 40 MPH Sunday it is great grab second it picks up very quickly, but 5th is still lon enough to use on the motorway.

[funkymofo 0]

thanks for the replies.

1.6 final drive is a good idea, I could just fit the standard 1.9 at first and then when I get the LSD put in change the final drive at the same time if I feel the need.

 

Like I said it makes sense to use the 1.9 if it is suitable being as I already have one.

[Sandy 191]

I droe a 306 rallye for the first time yesterday and the lack of lock was a bit annoying, it must be infuriating on the 205 with more restriction!

[petert 585]

Why not just use an Mi16 box?

 

You've contradicted yourself however. You'd ruled out the 1.6L box, but thought the 1.9L box with a 1.6L 4:06 diff was ok? Guess what? They have the same 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th gears!

 

It never ceases to amaze me how you guys with such a small country worry about over revving for a bit on the highway! The 4:06 is fine, although a fraction shorter than the standard Mi16 gearbox/diff.

[funkymofo 0]

yes thats true, but my MAIN concern with the 1.6 was the effective inability to use first gear. The motorway thing is only really a problem because I will be driving to a certain area of germany as often as possible so not sure if I could cope with the massive headache/fuel bill too often. Perhaps "ruled out" was worded a bit strongly- its more that Im put off the idea.

 

Mi16 box is a thought, but I dont see them come up for sale very often.

The ratios in the mi16 are somewhat of a comprimise between the 1.6 and 1.9 arent they?

[Hilgie 16 2 Cars]

why not use the VTS box?

[funkymofo 0]

well thats kind of my original question lol?

 

I havent heard anyones experience of using one yet and if its no better than a 1.9 there is no point as I already have one of those.

How do the ratios of a VTS compare with the 1.9?

[Hilgie 16 2 Cars]

much better...very similar to the Mi16 box.

[david932 0]

im having a very similar dilema with my 205 gti6 track car, i have a 1.6gti box, a vts box and a gti6 box.. some days i think "yeah lets have 6 gears and close ratios" others i think "full lock similar ratios lets go 1.6" then occasionally i consider the vts box but the spaced out 3rd, 4th and 5th puts me off a bit. im still very unsure of which to use. can anyone help???

 

heres some info on the xsara vts box that someone recently posted for me

 

http://forum.205gtidrivers.com/index.php?s...mp;#entry642223

 

hope this helps

[Hilgie 16 2 Cars]

I'd say VTS box for driveability and no full lock problems....

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

i have fitted a 1.6 gti be1 box to my 6 engine (purely because that was what i had to start with) but seeing as i havent driven it yet i cant comment on it.

if it is wa*k then i will probabaly go for mi16 box or something like that

[Garry 1]

My brother has a Xsara VTS and the ratios really suit the engine, I think you will find the Xsara is quicker to 100 and over a 1/4mile so seems to be better than the 6 speed.

 

I do run a 6 speed by the way!

[david932 0]

what engine/weight spec doe's your brother run? if it's similar to yours?

[petert 585]

yes thats true, but my MAIN concern with the 1.6 was the effective inability to use first gear.

 

That's an old wife's tale as well. I recently built a gearbox for my Mi16 out of spares. The only 1st gear I had was a BE3 1.6L, 3.25:1. So it has overall 1st gear is much lower than a std. 1.6L box.

 

eg

 

3.25 x 4.43 = 14.4:1

 

rather than

 

3.25 x 4.06 = 13.195

 

With the Mi16 engine you can't even tell the difference. It might be a pain in an 8V engine, but not a free revving 16V. It pulls away very cleanly and is a joy to drive.

[Matt Holley 11]

I had a 1.9 and a 1.6 box on my old gti6 engined 205, what box you go for really depends what you want it for, I prefered the 1.6 box I never had problems using 1st gear and it had around 200bhp.

 

It would top out at 130 mph at 7500 rpm but I cant see the need to go much faster in a 205

Edited March 28, 2007 by matt holley

[jochem 0]

I started out with a 1.9 8v box on my gti6, but was very glad when i fitted a mi16 box later on. Suits the engine much better IMO.

[Anthony 1,002]

I also cannot understand what this nonsense is about a 1.6 gearbox being useless on the motorway - unless I'm mistaken, Peugeot made tens of thousands of 1.6 GTi's which managed just fine on the motorway, and I've happily done in excess of 20k miles (many of them long trips and/or motorway) in my 1.6 with no problem.

 

Only problem I can see is if you've a stripped car and a obnoxiously loud exhaust, but that'll be annoying regardless of gearbox choice.

 

I'll be using a 1.9 w/1.6 FD box on my 205 GTi-6.

[david932 0]

would the 1.6 give better acceleration on a gti6 than the mi/vts?

[whizzer71 0]

I currently run a 6box on my 205 Gti6 conversion,My mate has a Vts box on his ,The Vts box is a VERY good compromise could do with a slightly longer 3rd though to pull it round to higher speed for the 1/4 mile(changes into 4th just before the line),I was debating using the 1.6 Fd with Xsara gearset?,dunno if anyone has any comments on this.........?,Or possbly a 1.9 Gti box worked well on my mates old Mi with cams and the 6 engine is way torqiuer.

 

Edited March 28, 2007 by whizzer71

[jackherer 543]

I also cannot understand what this nonsense is about a 1.6 gearbox being useless on the motorway - unless I'm mistaken, Peugeot made tens of thousands of 1.6 GTi's which managed just fine on the motorway, and I've happily done in excess of 20k miles (many of them long trips and/or motorway) in my 1.6 with no problem.

 

Only problem I can see is if you've a stripped car and a obnoxiously loud exhaust, but that'll be annoying regardless of gearbox choice.

 

My mate Bond did 30k miles in 12 months in an Mi16 on a 1.6 box. It was largely stripped too but the exhaust was standard. Hes driving a Xantia TD at the moment while Matt @ QEP sorts his new engine out and thats going in with a 1.9 box and 1.6 FD.

[VisaGTi16v 1]

All this talk about sitting on motorways at high revs with a 1.6 box....I have one in my Visa Mi16 coupled to tiny 13" wheels. I think it redefines the term buzz box! Due to being totally stripped etc I have to wear ear plugs and ear defenders heh. 80mph is ~4600rpm so LOUD on the motorway. 2/3/4/5 are nice. 1st is a bit low but I can still do good starts at sprints, ~2.6sec to the 64ft with no lsd. The first from my old mi16 box would be better but given the choice of the two in standard form I would take the 1.6

 

I have a Xsara VTS as a road car and that does have a nice spead of gears, just a shame my 3rd gear synchro is buggered so makes a bit of noise if you slam it in on a downchange at high revs from 4th

Edited March 29, 2007 by VisaGTi16v