2.0 Litre Iron Block With Mi16 Head

[Shevy 4]

My new engine setup will consist of using an 2.0 Litre Iron block with my mi16 alloy head.

I totally over looked the fact that the engine will sit 10mm taller.

This will cause me a bit of space problems with my T/Bs and 90mm trumpets and an airfilter

 

What are my options to lower the engine to give me some more clearance for my Trumpets and filter

I dont want to tilt the engine and put strain on the driveshafts etc.

 

I would still like to run the Pipercross Sausage filter, but I would consider an airbox instead if lowering the engine is a problem.

 

Any ideas would be much appreciated as I need to resolve this issue before the engine is refitted in the car.

[Richie-Van-GTi 71 2 Cars]

have you considered having the manifold re-angled for the intake so the TB's seat lower down?

[Shevy 4]

have you considered having the manifold re-angled for the intake so the TB's seat lower down?

 

I have initially thought about doing that and I could get QEP to do it for me.

But I thought the ideal inlet tract is one that is as straight as possible to the inlet valve.

Do people think it will make much difference to performance angling the inlet manifold ?

[smckeown 1]

I read about this area in Graham Bell's 4 stroke performance tuning book recently.

 

In that he was saying that yes any non straight inlet track will effect performance to a degree, but this might be offset by the benefits gained by tuning the length to the appropriate length. So not very specific really, but still encouragable.

 

What this means to me is that the length is still more important than the shape, and that slight curves may not be noticable if you have tuned the length otherwise.

[Shevy 4]

I read about this area in Graham Bell's 4 stroke performance tuning book recently.

 

In that he was saying that yes any non straight inlet track will effect performance to a degree, but this might be offset by the benefits gained by tuning the length to the appropriate length. So not very specific really, but still encouragable.

 

What this means to me is that the length is still more important than the shape, and that slight curves may not be noticable if you have tuned the length otherwise.

 

 

Cheers Sean, I thought it had an effect on performance, even if it is very small.

Ill speak to Matt and see what he can do to modify my Longmanns inlet manifold.

I will probably have a play with inlet tract length too when it comes to mapping and try to optimise the setup I have.

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

what is the best overall length for a system though , jenvey state its 350mm for a 9k engine .

 

i am having some clearance issues with my bike body system (read earlier post) and i could do with reducing the lenght of my manifold (std gti6 one cut down) but mine is about 350mm when the trumpets are fitted.

 

the angle at which they are coming out is near straight .

what is the lenght of your longmans manifold?

[smckeown 1]

what is the best overall length for a system though , jenvey state its 350mm for a 9k engine .

 

i am having some clearance issues with my bike body system (read earlier post) and i could do with reducing the lenght of my manifold (std gti6 one cut down) but mine is about 350mm when the trumpets are fitted.

 

the angle at which they are coming out is near straight .

what is the lenght of your longmans manifold?

 

there are some very informative topic available on the forum via the search button. I have been researching this area a lot recently with a view to optimising my inlet length

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

there are some very informative topic available on the forum via the search button. I have been researching this area a lot recently with a view to optimising my inlet length

 

 

yeah i did see your topic about track length i might have to have a good read through , tbh i didnt really consider track length until now

 

how have you got on with that anyway?

[smckeown 1]

yeah i did see your topic about track length i might have to have a good read through , tbh i didnt really consider track length until now

 

how have you got on with that anyway?

 

Yeah pretty good. Progress is:

 

I decided on the best design a while ago, i.e. using spacers rather than longer trumpets for flexibility

I've had the ali tubes professionally cut

Getting the ends laser cut currently

Proved the glue i'm using is very tough indeed and will do a good job

Bought the threaded bar and tap set (had a few trial runs too)

Had the custom rubber washers made and waiting to be used

Got an anodising place lined up

So in a few weeks i'll have a few sets to platy with ready for my RR session

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

Yeah pretty good. Progress is:

 

I decided on the best design a while ago, i.e. using spacers rather than longer trumpets for flexibility

I've had the ali tubes professionally cut

Getting the ends laser cut currently

Proved the glue i'm using is very tough indeed and will do a good job

Bought the threaded bar and tap set (had a few trial runs too)

Had the custom rubber washers made and waiting to be used

Got an anodising place lined up

So in a few weeks i'll have a few sets to platy with ready for my RR session

 

 

nice, i may well wait and see what results you get before making any definite descisions, although you are running an 8v aren't you? dunno what difference it will make between 8 and 16v

[smckeown 1]

I'd say the theory of inlet tract tuning related to every engine type; of course the actual length is always different and more or less unique.

 

The key for my journey has been trying to get the most flexible approach with regards to changing the lenght quickly, and allowing the same filter to be used regardless of length. I believe my design will meet al lthose objectives. Also the cost will be well under what jenvey charge; not that they have good sized spacers anyway.

[petert 585]

What are my options to lower the engine to give me some more clearance for my Trumpets and filter

I don’t want to tilt the engine and put strain on the driveshafts etc….

 

I have the same setup, S16 block, 1.9L head and TB's. I solved the problem by dropping the engine 15mm. It's hard to see from the pics., but I had the RH engine mount remade 15mm lower in overall height. I fabricated a new gearbox mount, but actually went too low and had to add a spacer. I also cut and shut the bottom mount so it was 15mm lower.

Edited January 18, 2007 by petert

[smckeown 1]

Impressive.

 

As lowering a car in theory increases the angle of the wishbone, does lowering the engine balance out such a change when lowering the engine ?

 

Plus you have the lower COG benefits, and weight saving on the ali mount

[Dream Weaver 2]

My inlet manifold is a std Mi that was cut down at 42 degrees so the bodies sit in a level position, rather than pointing up like Jenvey's etc.

 

There has been no detrimental effect to my power/torque through doing this.

[jackherer 543]

As lowering a car in theory increases the angle of the wishbone, does lowering the engine balance out such a change when lowering the engine ?

 

The wishbones are attached to the subframe so lowering the engine won't affect them, but the driveshaft angle will be affected slightly. However it wont balance out any changes made by lowering the shell via shortening the strut height, it will exaggerate them.

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

This is how mine sits:

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1369.jpg

 

Using Jenvey manifold, red-jenvey TB's and 90mm trumpets.

It's not enough with lowering engine 15mm in my case.

 

When testfitting the stnadard bonnet it was quite clear I needed like at least 4cm more clearance than the standard bonnet would allow.

 

Glassfibre bonnet from Magnum Motorsports solved it though, now it's 0.5mm clearance to the filter

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1363.jpg

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1364.jpg

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1365.jpg

[steige 1 1 Cars]

This is how mine sits:

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1369.jpg

 

Using Jenvey manifold, red-jenvey TB's and 90mm trumpets.

It's not enough with lowering engine 15mm in my case.

 

When testfitting the stnadard bonnet it was quite clear I needed like at least 4cm more clearance than the standard bonnet would allow.

 

Glassfibre bonnet from Magnum Motorsports solved it though, now it's 0.5mm clearance to the filter

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1363.jpg

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1364.jpg

http://cortex.fa-s.ntnu.no/~kristian/205gt...06/CIMG1365.jpg

 

 

Are you using the alloy or iron block. I am going to be running exactly the same set up as you on my alloy block engine. I have only just fitted everything and noticed the potential clearance issue.

 

How is the quality of the magnum motorsport bonnet. Will the two bonnet catches be enough to hold it down and stop it flapping?

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

Are you using the alloy or iron block. I am going to be running exactly the same set up as you on my alloy block engine. I have only just fitted everything and noticed the potential clearance issue.

 

How is the quality of the magnum motorsport bonnet. Will the two bonnet catches be enough to hold it down and stop it flapping?

 

It's Iron block, no idea if the bonnet will flapp around or not, car will not be driven until spring 2007..

Edited January 19, 2007 by B1ack_Mi16

[Shevy 4]

I have the same setup, S16 block, 1.9L head and TB's. I solved the problem by dropping the engine 15mm. It's hard to see from the pics., but I had the RH engine mount remade 15mm lower in overall height. I fabricated a new gearbox mount, but actually went too low and had to add a spacer. I also cut and shut the bottom mount so it was 15mm lower.

 

 

Hi peter,

 

Do you run an Auto bonnet on your car for a bit of extra clearance ?

 

I'm bit confused how B1ack_Mi16 does not have clearance even after lowering , but you say you do ?

But you are both running the same setup ?

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

Hi peter,

 

Do you run an Auto bonnet on your car for a bit of extra clearance ?

 

I'm bit confused how B1ack_Mi16 does not have clearance even after lowering , but you say you do ?

But you are both running the same setup ?

 

I did never lower the engine, but still I needed 5cm more clearance than the standard bonnet would give.

I doubt the auto-bonnet will give more clearance at all, as it's in the very front the biggest clearance-issue is.

 

Maybe Peter doesn't use the Jenvey manifold?

 

I know the Chadil-manifold is more curved so you might not have as big clearance-problems if you're using that.

[stew205 17]

I have also gone down of the route of the re-angled inlet manifold.

 

It has solved my clearance issues (90mm trumpets inside the box).

 

A pic for a comparison to Black-Mi16's

 

Thanks

Stew

[petert 585]

Hi peter,

 

Do you run an Auto bonnet on your car for a bit of extra clearance ?

 

I'm bit confused how B1ack_Mi16 does not have clearance even after lowering , but you say you do ?

But you are both running the same setup ?

 

No, I use a std. bonnet. I use a custom manifold, made from an Mi16 manifold. Someone else made it, then I acquired it and had to re-angle it again to get the trumpets under the bonnet. Clearance is still extremely tight however.

[Alastairh 47]

Although i haven't put bodies on this setup YET.

 

Just thought id point out another alternative if people don't want to change there engines characteristics due to clearance. Ashley peddle just bought this fiberglass bonnet, through ebay, for £85 delivered, and apparently the guy has a few.

 

http://img245.imageshack.us/my.php?image=picture078cn3.jpg

 

Im sure he'd give the link to the guy if intrested.

 

Alastair

Edited January 19, 2007 by Alastairh

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

Although i haven't put bodies on this setup YET.

 

Just thought id point out another alternative if people don't want to change there engines characteristics due to clearance. Ashley peddle just bought this fiberglass bonnet, through ebay, for £85 delivered, and apparently the guy has a few.

 

http://img245.imageshack.us/my.php?image=picture078cn3.jpg

 

Im sure he'd give the link to the guy if intrested.

 

Alastair

 

That's the same one as I've got.

It's from Magnum Motorsports. 85£ sounds famialiar.

 

Thought shipping to norway was like 150£!!