[engine_work] Mad's - Supercharged Pug Project

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

I thought I'd post a couple of pictures showing my progess on charging the pug. Its starting to come together now, but still along way to go. I am well happy with how it looks and is comming together.

I binned my orignal plan, and have moved the charger closer to the engine. Now need to use a remote oil filter, which is ok, as I can move it to sensible place where its easier to change!

 

 

 

 

I am still deciding about the water charge cooler (see item at the back above exhaust manifold). My advsor still thinks its a good idea; the idea being it provides a shorter inlet track, thus inceasing throttle response over an air type cooler. I'm not 100% sure.

 

I need to also block off the pressure warning light sender, as I dont have room for it!

 

Not sure quite whats happening about the inlet as yet, prob just weld to the stub in the picture.

 

I have also sorted driving the a standard tacho from the MS, it works a treat. On the MS front, having problems driving the coil packs, but it will be a while before I need them, so hopfully have it sorted by then!

 

Mad.

[welshpug 1,666]

very good! but can we have bigger pictures please!

 

I see you've used a Jag XKR chargecooler there, defeinitely a good way of keeping temps down and tracts short

 

how is the Charger unit itself mounted and what kind of drive belt are you using?

 

[Baz 421]

Coming along nicely!

 

But also, bugger!! Almost forgot about this the other day when i was chatting/dreaming with a mate about a SC'd Mi, thinking it would be a bit original!! You bast*rd!!

 

Keep the updates coming!

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

I'll post some more and bigger pictures on my website when I get time.

 

Its an 8v so an Mi might still be still orignal!

 

We're going to keep with the standard 6 rib belt so we dont have to changer the charger pully.

 

Mounting... Hummm.... The use of a large shoe horn! Basically its a case of deciding where best to mount the charger then fitting everything else around! Like there is about a 1mm between the starter and the charger! The oil filter needs to be remote, the oil pressure warning sender has to go! I also may need to move the rad forward.

 

Mad.

[TEKNOPUG 3]

Surely putting the chargecooler on top of the incredibly hot exhaust manifold can't be a good idea?!

 

Can you not locate it where the battery goes?

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

That is a good point, which was well presented, TEKNOPUG! I have been thinking about moving it like you said, design is a little fluid at the moment.

 

Feedback is welcome, as I may over look something!

[TEKNOPUG 3]

For reference there is a guide to fitting a chargecooler from a Subaru Legacy on the Home page.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

There have been quite a few SC'd Mi's and 8v's over the past 18 to 20 years the engine has been tinkered with. Very little is new now

 

Looks good though. Jon Murgie has a remote oil filter mount for sale which is what you need.

[M@tt 77]

excellent project mate

 

i'm also in the process of supercharging my mi16 with a Eaton M45 supercharger(should be delivered in tyhe next day or so) although i'm still at the very early stages of coolecting all the parts.

 

I decided to change from the turbo option to the SC option as all the fabricating etc will be done at the cold end and i won't have to piss about with manifolds at the hot end where the welds will probably bust due to the heat.

 

I'm also planning on running Megasquirt as well so would be very interested in seeing how you get on with it.

and like welshpug i'm interetested to see how you've mounted your sc and alternator and how you are going to run the belt.

 

I've been looking into whether it's possible to mount an additonal pully ontop of the existing crank pulley and allow the supercharger to sit slightly further over and mount the SC where the alternator is and move the alternator down nearer the sump or vice versa.

 

oh i've added you to my msn list if thats ok so i can pick your brains

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

I've been looking into whether it's possible to mount an additonal pully ontop of the existing crank pulley and allow the supercharger to sit slightly further over and mount the SC where the alternator is and move the alternator down nearer the sump or vice versa.

 

Bear in mind some MI sumps have mounts for an Aircon pump, so this may be ideal to mount the alternator etc.

[M@tt 77]

Bear in mind some MI sumps have mounts for an Aircon pump, so this may be ideal to mount the alternator etc

 

i've looked at this already however the spacing between the lugs on my sump are pretty much the same width as mounting points on the alternator so i either need to get an alternator with narrower(or wider) mounting lugs to either go in inside or outside th esump mounting lugs not sure whether i'd be able to find a suitable one. Also i couldn't shift the alternator sideways ie so one lug was on the inside and one was on the outside as it wouldn't line up with the crank pulley aanymore.

[welshpug 1,666]

use a custom pulley, or make an adapter bracket.

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

Pulleys - I source a pulley from a 406 turbo, it sticks out more than the standard 8valve, which gives more room to play.

 

Belts: I'm going to run a 6 grove belt, not sure what from as the belt run hasnt been decided yet. Going to use an idler to make sure there is plent of rap on the charger pulley.

 

Mounting : Basically its all custom. I've built a big cradle that picks up a lot of the mountings on the block. Then all the charger mounts are attached to that. I've modified the charger to get it to fit around the starter motor. The m45 has a water pump power take off at one end which can be partly removed.

 

MS: I've been running MS for just injection and it was ok. I'm playing with coil packs at the moment!

 

Mad.

[jochem 0]

I've been looking into whether it's possible to mount an additonal pully ontop of the existing crank pulley

 

In original state, the outer pulley / belt will rub the chassis. I'd stick to the one pulley.

 

Mad, did yiu make any calculations to the boost on normal pulley? Have you though about switching pulley's on the blower to alter it?

[M@tt 77]

yeah my concern was that there wasn't going to be enough room

 

after speaking to madspikes it seems you can either use a 406 turbo or 306 d-turbo crank pulley as they both have 6 grooves in the same as the blower pulley.(i'll also also need the alternator pulley or whole alternator of the same car aswell) However i'm not sure if these are exactly the same size as the mi16 crank pulley, also i haven't seen a mini crank pulley yet so unsure of the dimensions to compare against the 406 or 306 one.

 

Hopefully if anything the 406/306 one might be slightly bigger as that means the boost will be upped slightly .

aftermarket smaller blower pulleys for upping the boost seem to cost a fortune!

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

Mad, did yiu make any calculations to the boost on normal pulley? Have you though about switching pulley's on the blower to alter it?

 

I have done (ok, a friend has!) some calculation, and the standard pulley should be fine for what I want. I'm not looking a shed load for a power just a bit more without spending the earth, oh and to say "Its got a blower"

 

Mad.

Edited November 12, 2006 by madspikes

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

Much effort has been spent on the pug over the last week, but it doesnt look like from the lastest pics! But I guess thats the way it goes!

 

Not pictured, but I've been trying to work out how to fit the rad for the charge cooler! Anyone know what motor I can steel a thin 'suck' fan from. I need to mount the cooling fan engine side!

 

Disapointed that the tensioner had to go on this way around, there wasnt enough clearance to get it to go on the other way around! (Flat bit against the engine) I'm happy with the belt rap on the charger pulley, might get a bit more as the tensioner is going be to moved 10mm further down as I'm concered about the belt touching its self.

I've had the engine rotating using the statermotor and the belt run looks fine. Befoe people say anything... The belt was tighter at this point, and I know I need to add a screw adjuster!

 

 

Alot of time was spent working on a tottally new inlet manifold and plenium, but in the end just decided to modify the existing one... Currently it has a wacking great hole in the bottom so it clears the supercharger, this will be patched over soon. Also spent a while working out if the standard throttle will flow enough for this install! I think it should be ok... If you know different please say!

 

 

The large tube comming up through the inlet is the outlet from the charger and goes to the charge cooler (it will be connected with some sexy silicone hose!

 

 

Using a charge cooler to keep the charger to cylinder head length as short as possible.

 

It looks more OEM than I expected! Some silicone hoses should sort that!

 

Mad.

[Guest purpletoddy]

Quality project mate....I would love to have the b@lls to attempt it!!!........My mate is currently trying to mate the same type of charger on a 2.0 8v cavy sri engine that is going in an opel cadette.

 

Hope its worth all the effort and good luck

[DaveW 6]

Try finding a small car like a 106 as im sure they have slim fans engine side of the rad...

[Bonzai 2]

good progress. looks like even more of a bitch than i imagined it would be tbh. Im glad i gave up the project and saw the light of 16v's Best of luck with it though, i'd love to see how it drives, i bet it will have immense midrange on it. And a hell of a whine to match

[madspikes 41 1 Cars]

good progress. looks like even more of a bitch than i imagined it would be tbh. Im glad i gave up the project and saw the light of 16v's Best of luck with it though, i'd love to see how it drives, i bet it will have immense midrange on it. And a hell of a whine to match

 

Its not that bad really.. Its just hard trying to get everything to fit in the engine bay, and the 30 degree lean doesnt help! It should sound fantastic, and scare a few people on track days!

 

 

or this! http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Kenlowe-twin-10-cool...1QQcmdZViewItem

 

Nice one. I had a quick look on the bay before but didnt turn these up.

 

I need to fit the charger to the pug and see exactly how much space I have to play with, which isnt much I expect!

[Kitsune 0]

Nice work fella. I've currently been bitten by the charger bug, although slightly more in standard guise (Mk1 G60) but yeah, the noise they make is awesome and the engine note is so odd (like a hum). Only thing I found is that although very rapid, it doesnt actually feel that fast compared to say a turbo when you know when it's kicked in. Of course, the speedo needle/gearchange speed tells you something else. That's coming from a 180bhp stripped Mk1 Golf.

 

What's the estimated bhp/torque figure on this conversion?

 

How is the charger lubricated as well, or is it a self contained unit?

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

lookin good so far spikes. Just wonderin though, on the supercharger theres a little red and black plastic thing near the inlet. Is that where you take the vaccum from for the brakes? or am i being a div. al

[Bonzai 2]

i'm off the impression its something to do with the lubrication system in it, but i could be wrong.

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

i'm off the impression its something to do with the lubrication system in it, but i could be wrong.

 

i'm fairly certain they're sealed and dont need any sort of lubrication (please correct me if i'm wrong), the black and red plastic thingy is in a hole that passes through into the inlet.