[car_restoration] Sorrento Gti16v Full Rebuild

[yippeekayay 18 1 Cars]

right now I miss my H plate miami gti16s and my 40k 1.9 sorrento badly..... cant wait to see this finished nearly as much as the owner does....

sorry dont mean to hijack this excellent build thread..anyone know where my H plate miami lhd 309 gti16s is, was last seen in warwick 2 years ago... I want it back....( Fenton have you seen it lately...)

[j_turnell 137 3 Cars]

Just one thing i would do which will help tidy the engine bay would be to route the loom under the inlet

[de Noir 0]

Sure thing, me would like it too.

 

I have refreshed the whole loom, did everything as it was.

It appears injector hoses on my loom are too short for this.

309 install was exactly like this.

 

But this is only a draft and haven't tried for real, though.

 

 

In the meantime got myself a set of 7x15 ET13 EXIP wheels:

 

 

Unfortunately they do not blend nicely with 309 rear beam and do not fit at the front at all.

At least not without the adaptors.

 

Anyone interested?

[FicaGTI 0]

I have problem with this project...I am never satisfacted with my car when see this...

[chrisj21 2]

I know that feeling.

 

Looks stunning, a really fantastic job.

 

Chris

[welshpug 1,661]

are the wheels a direct Peugeot fitment? Offset is perfect for a standard 205 AFAIK

[de Noir 0]

Yes. Gutmann used them alot.

Me thinks I have seen some EXIP wheels in a 205 brochure, as dealer fit option.

 

They don't mix with 309 setup though!

 

 

[dale205mills 39 7 Cars]

some nice retro wheels, in that photo.

[welshpug 1,661]

Henry Yorke will love that picture

 

I picked up a pair of the very top polished face ones for him recently

[alien7 0]

Thanks...

 

Here are few details of the trolley. It's not tidiest design, but serves its purpose very well.

One day, when this is all over I will purify the design and draw workshop blueprints...

 

 

...which I did...

 

TROLLEY BLUEPRINTS

Thanks for drawing,

I need it now

Edited May 14, 2010 by alien7

[de Noir 0]

almost done here!

 

 

 

words and pictures soon!

Edited June 30, 2010 by MH_

[Guest rob_s]

very very nice! bet seeing/having it finished has been worth the 4 years work and head ache over parts?

[jackherer 543]

It looks photoshopped, the headlights and panel gaps are far too straight, there is no way that is a real 205

[de Noir 0]

cheers fellas

not completed yet, but close enough!

 

all vital signs OK

engine running-in in progress

but still have to sort few technical issues, finish the exterior, sort interior details etc.

 

 

it's been five and half years and still don't know whether it was worth it or not, tough question mate!

 

 

 

It looks photoshopped, the headlights and panel gaps are far too straight, there is no way that is a real 205

 

 

 

no, this is a virtual one

[de Noir 0]

Hi all

 

Haven't had time to take some decent photos, been busy sorting stuff on the car

 

It is registered and actually drives and test-drives, but list of issues kind of grows or at lest, does not shrink the way I would love it

 

 

Had an slight overheating issue, engine could not maintain 85-95 operating temeperature.

Struggled between 90-105 instead, and kept spitting coolant out.

Suspected of everything and step-by-step cross-checked. At the end inspection revealed faulty 'slow' fan speed.

 

I have fitted 309 twin fan setup lifted straight from donor vehicle.

Which at the beginning worked fine until one relay went out, thus not turning on both fans on 'slow'.

Faulty relay replaced, now everything works fine.

 

I have kept 90° thermostat as found in the engine, and combined it with 92-97°C thermoswitch (purple ring) I've nicked from 8v engine.

Car now maintans 85-95 operating temperature, at least at 25-28°C air temperature and running-in not-revving-above-4k driving.

 

Regarding cooling system, I am using new rad, 309 header tank, some Fiat and Opel hoses and no oil-to-water and TB circuits.

I am going to add Mocal oil cooler to the system when I shift enough shirts.

 

Diagram:

 

 

 

Next thing to sort is faulty idle speed.

Cold engine idles at around 1000rpm, when warmed up it rises up to 1200-1300 rpm.

TPS and ISCV disconnected, one at the time, and revs rise up to 2-3000rpm on warm engine.

 

I am using AFM from 8v engine, as one belonging to Mi engine has been opened before and not giving great confidence.

Best to take it at some specialists to check.

Engine itself is 309 GTI 16 unit D6C with M1.3 management, me thinks with knock sensor but no lambda, which is a bit unusual.

Have to doublecheck ECU number.

 

I suspect of throttle position being wrong.

To sort this I need to take TB down, as primary barell adjusting screw is stuck and needs to be machined out.

Are the Haynes TB adjusting and TPS check-adjust procedure the right ones?

Any help or ideas on this is welcome!

 

 

Then there is a small matter of clutch pedal dropping down in a period of time, need to adjust it again.

Clutch is Sachs Sporting, fitted new.

Gearbox type BE3, fork lever and bearings checked before install, should be ok.

I guess it's cable or cable washer problem, needs checking too. Any other suggestions maybe?

 

 

Thing that worries me the most is heavy and not-returning steering.

Prime suspect is steering rack, as wheels turn fine when disconnected from it.

I am running PAS steering rack which was operating fine before disassembling of the car 5 years ago.

It was cleaned, greased and fitted back in, with 306GTI cylinder instead of original one.

Everything was operating smoothly at the working table.

I suspect of jammed steering rack piston. Any other ideas maybe?

 

 

Now, almost finished with writing... I am having a light but noticeable judder when turning left.. With power on or off, no matter.

No clonking sound, the whole body just shakes. I am getting it thru the steering wheel also.

When driving straight and turning right haven't noticed anything suspicious.

Suspension is standard brand new OE stuff, 309 GTI 16 wishbones and ARB + 205GTI front springs.

Every nut and bolt tight, 309 driveshafts in prime condition.

Tyres are also new, tracking done, wheels balanced.

Thing that fell to my mind is that I saw some balancing weights at the floor of my garage, could be fallen off from the front right wheel.

Haven't checked this yet as I was occupied with cooling, but I wonder has anyone here had similar experience?

 

 

And finally, I have opened the straight-out-of-the-peugeot-parts box with body trim the other day..

...to discover that they have sent me two left-door mouldings instead of one left and one right..

Ordered right one straight away, but I am getting information that it could be not-available any more..

So pretty please, I am after this, if someone here knows different or has heard of someone having it new, I'd love to buy it. Thanks!

 

 

Sorry for this mega post, I hope it wasnt a bugger to read!

Regards!

Edited July 21, 2010 by MH_

[stufarri 98 3 Cars]

Great read, well done mate.

 

One thing that amazes me more than the car though is your grasp of the English language - unless you are from the UK originally

[blue_haddock 2]

Great read, well done mate.

 

One thing that amazes me more than the car though is your grasp of the English language - unless you are from the UK originally

 

 

You mean the fact that he speaks better english than a certain person we know from Accy?

Edited July 21, 2010 by blue_haddock

[yeti-dj 7]

loving this build, real dedication but please moved the front plate to where it belongs.

 

well done, top marks..

[Paulmac19 4]

Just read this from start to finish loving it excellent work

Edited July 22, 2010 by Paulmac19

[feb 47]

Fantastic car and a congratulations for the dedication and persistency! Did you manage to source parts e.g. door and windscreen seals new, does Peugeot still make all parts for 205s?

The reason I am asking is that when I had to replace the windscreen seal in my 205 I was told that Peugeot has stopped making them and the only one left was a non-sunroof one. I had no choice but to buy that despite the car having a sunroof

We need more photos of it!

Edited July 22, 2010 by feb

[de Noir 0]

Thanks for support guys, love that you love this build

 

I have to comment the comments on my english...

Far better writer than speaker...

Anyway thanks.

 

 

Now, the car.

 

I have managed to source most of body (and other) parts from new, some stuff was ordered 4-5 years ago, at the beginning of the build.

Recent informations I got are that many of those parts are not available any more. Which is pity.

 

There are also parts fitted from other Peugeot models, some from new, some second hand and refurbished.

Some stuff was custom made, like exhaust system for example.

 

Most difficult to source ditto the most expensive were Mi engine parts.

 

 

Regarding photos.

I got only few of them as I'm overloaded with sorting the gimmicks on the car.

I will for sure provide more, as soon as I take them.

 

 

Here's one from the back, note unfinished body trim and more missing stuff:

 

 

 

Until now I had only about an hour to spare for cabin cleaning + vacuum, and only one self-service wash in 5 years of build.

So, there is lot of need and room for detailing. Got the detailing stuff, polish and wax but haven't touched it yet.

 

Besides mechanical/electrical gimmicks that need sorting, I have to fit door and rear body trims, badges and finally set the rear beam height.

A thorough clean-wash-detailing job will follow soon after.

 

 

In the meantime, I would love to read some comments and advices on gimmicks that bugger me, feel free to reply on that subject too.

 

 

 

 

Ah yes, the number plate you see on the photo is not regular one but kind of self adhesive 'test' plate.

It's not on the car any more, I will either have it where it should be or not at all.

Edited July 22, 2010 by MH_

[de Noir 0]

Trying to sort the idle these days.

 

First, haven't had means and time to sort a seized TB primary barrel adjusting screw.

So, let's pretend TB is set up properly. No play at the spindle, etc.

 

Adjusted and checked TPS. Resistance readings as should be, both in zero and full throttle positions.

 

Checked all hoses as far as I could, tightened them all.

 

Contact sprayed all relevant connectors.

 

Checked ETS. Resistance readings 2kohms at 25°C garage temperature, and abut 500ohms in boiling water.

Are these readings okay?

 

Removed ICV to inlet hose, engine stalled instantly.

 

Tried to block air intake on AFM with a hand, for few times.

Once managed to stall the engine.

Few times almost succeeded, engine struggled in death cough at very low revs - with a hissing sound coming let's say somewhere from ICV T-joint or underneath it, meaning somewhere underneath the inlet manifold, oil filler breather hoses maybe.

 

Sprayed some aerosol around all breather hoses, to no avail.

 

 

Yet still, idle on cold start approx. 1000rpm.

Idle when warm rises to approx 1200-1250rpm and stays there rock solid.

Regardless o this, engine runs beautifully.

 

Have two more ECUs to try, haven't done this yet...

Another TB is waiting for me to collect.

 

 

Out of ideas. Engine wins. Please help.

Edited July 24, 2010 by MH_

[series111 21]

Very tidy looking car wish mine looked as good !!!!!!!!!!

[Edp 67 3 Cars]

Looks great and brings back memories of finishing mine off!

 

Wish I had gone MI16 though. I personally don't think the GTi6 engine 'suits' the 205 at all.

 

I'm thinking of going back to 8v power in mine.

 

Looking forward to the finished pictures!

[de Noir 0]

Cheers guys! Thanks

 

 

Ed, your car was very inspiring... To the point of lifting some ideas straight away.

 

 

She ain't that pretty in metal as on photos, or is it me expecting too much!

Managed to take care of some issues in the meantime.

 

 

Steering issue: I have fitted the wrong steering column, 309 instead of 205.

According to servicebox part # they should be the same for both of my cars, but closer inspection reveals they're not:

 

 

 

 

 

Swapped for shorter one, almost normal now, but still experiencing heavy feeling and non-returning wheel half a lock on both sides from centre.

Going to swap PAS cylinder as the fitted one is from crashed 306GTI... Which had a broken steering rack mounting, apparently from a crash..

Visually it was ok, but the more I think of it more it is obvious that cylinder shaft is slightly bent in the centre position - thus giving that heavy steering effect.

How stupid of me to fit it at the first place!

 

Still no progress on high idle.

Re-routed the engine wiring for the second time, rendered out some layout mistakes and possible airleak positions I did at the previous loom fitting.

 

Could not start after this to check for improvements, as distributor to coil contact nipple just broke and fell away of age.

I have planned to get a new distributor from the start, and this most definitely hurries the purchase a bit.

 

 

The most unpleasant of all surprises is paintjob starting to show some bad prep signs with time.

Polishing should help a bit, but I guess I would have to give her a thorough respray in the winter.

 

 

Sometimes I really this car!

Edited August 17, 2010 by MH_