willxs 0 Posted October 16, 2006 heard a romour (mainly from some honda boys) they say that in order to get good handling, they have the front lower than the back? cheesewedge style. Personally, i dont agree. anyone shed any techincal info to this? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
VisaGTi16v 1 Posted October 16, 2006 I was also told this the other week when I let someone double drive my car at a sprint. He said getting more weight over the front would help the traction and a way to do this was lifting the back. Im not sure as ive always read you want to move weight back etc and surely more weight over the front means more understeer Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rippthrough 98 Posted October 16, 2006 (edited) I was also told this the other week when I let someone double drive my car at a sprint. He said getting more weight over the front would help the traction and a way to do this was lifting the back. Im not sure as ive always read you want to move weight back etc and surely more weight over the front means more understeer Mines nose down and it's improve the traction, the turn in and the high speed stability. In fact, I can't yet think of a downside bar it being a little more oversteery, if you don't like that kind of thing. -Phillip Edited October 16, 2006 by Rippthrough Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hengti 2 Posted October 16, 2006 (edited) wouldn't this make the back end rather 'lively' whilst braking and turning in?!! ed. beaten to it! Edited October 16, 2006 by hengti Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rippthrough 98 Posted October 16, 2006 (edited) wouldn't this make the back end rather 'lively' whilst braking and turning in?!! ed. beaten to it! yes, it's a touch more 'twitchy' on turn in, but my after the new tyres and dampers my cars been ultra stable there anyway, so a little didn't hurt. -Phillip Edited October 16, 2006 by Rippthrough Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tom_m 0 Posted October 16, 2006 mines nose down with problems Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sandy 191 Posted October 16, 2006 I always go for about 10mm nose down on 205/309's and 15mm on 106's, they simply don't handle properly level or lower at the back. Less traction, severe scrubby understeer followed by violent oversteer if you provoke it is the norm if it's lower at the back; which is one of the reasons not to lower "2 splines" as so many people do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TEKNOPUG 3 Posted October 16, 2006 Checl out the sticky in the Suspension section. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
veloce200 3 Posted October 16, 2006 main reason for nose down (all cars are from factory) is aerodynamic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Henry 1.9GTi 36 Posted October 17, 2006 lol, just spent 30 mins trying to quote some examples out of a book on handling. Confused myself so i gave up, couldnt explain it all in a short post plus theres so many factors which determine the handling characteristics it seemed pointless to quote just the one. But the book is: Chassis Engineering by Herb Adams Its american so in lbs rather than Newtons and other stuff like that but is a good read. Also biased towards rearwheel drive oval cars which turn left. Basically shows that yes titlting a front wheel drive car nose down will improve things but then u could also leave it the same and reduce weight in the rear. Or add rear anti-roll bars or all of that, but then u need to know the tire performance curve (how much traction it will produce for varying vertical loads) to make sense of ne of the above as more weight gives more traction, but with diminishing returns on cornering force. Bah to much to explain, basically alot of maths envoled in setting up a car for best handling, so many factors involved, cant wait to get stuck in to this at uni! Best bet if its not a high budget race car is just trial and error whilst recording some lap times. Go book some test sessions Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sandy 191 Posted October 17, 2006 (edited) There is one hell of alot more to handling than the longtitudinal attitude of the car and the 205 is a complex car to understand because of the trailing arm rear. Lowering the car more than 30mm, fitting harder front springs (with OE rear bars), fitting over stiff rear dampers (to compensate for the ordinary bars (didn't Paul Simon write that??)), widening the rear track but not the front... all contribute to spoiling the balance and geometry and hence handling, which is often confused with body roll or grip! My point of keeping the nose down attitude of the car is a generalism that assumes the geometry and spring rates are somewhere around standard settings. Edited October 17, 2006 by sandy309 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
