Brakes: Hydraulic Solid Line Replacement

[skeggyrik 3]

On removal of the rear beam it is evident that the solid lines are going to have to be replaced. With the minimal movement required to release the rear beam the drivers side line has started weeping brake fluid. On closer inspection the line going up an over the fuel tank are also in a similar state all corroded and flaked. The front lines in the arches aren't much better.

 

Anyway I've had a quote from Automec (I found the site mentioned on the forum) for full set of copper lines with brass fittings.

205 Gti 1.9 (Rear discs): The brake pipe set for your model is £66.33 plus £5.50 postage and VAT

 

That's £83.44 all in. This doesn't sound too bad to me, if you imagine the hassle of making them up yourself. Cutting, bending, flaring and fixing all the end bits, sounds like a it will take a lot of time for a beginner with questionable results.

Before I go in for these, I thought I'd ask if anyone else has recently purchased any, if so was it any cheaper and if so where

After reading other posts I'm not going to try and go the flexible route throughout.

Any advise on pitfall avoidance during fitting appreciated.

Also it looks like its a petrol tank off job and it's near full! Is it possible to drop the tank with fuel? If not what's the best way to get it empty, bearing in mind it 's up on bricks! Is it a pipe, a can and mouth full petrol??

Thanks

Richard

[hengti 2]

that seems v good value - i think it tends to be comparatively expensive to have individual pipes made up at high st places

 

it is possible to renew them without dropping the tank, but it's fiddly

[jackherer 543]

the price has gone up loads, last time I got a kit off them (2-3 years ago) it was nearer £36+vat.

 

quality is excellent however, I'd probably still get one at the price you quote, they did seem a bit too cheap when I got some so I'm not surprised really.

[Guest rick03054]

Any advise on pitfall avoidance during fitting appreciated.

 

Like Hengti says, it's not essential that you drop the tank but it makes the job slightly easier. I dropped the tank, so can't comment on doing it any other way.

 

If your tank is a bit full you can stilll get it off. First you have to depressurise the system, do this by pulling the furthest right fuse out of the fuse box while the car's running, this cuts power to the pump.

 

Then syphon as much out as you can with the hose-suck method then take the two nuts at the rear of the tank off, penetrating oil is a VERY good idea for these. then disconnect the pump and sender from inside the car and lower the rear of the tank, ie pull the back down, thge front is on a ledge so should stay put but put a trolley jack under there with a piece of wood to take any weight if it slides off.

 

The filler side also has to be dropped, so take the big jubilee clip off the pipe and pull this side down. It's a tight fit and it's going to be all clogged up with 15 years worth of leaves and road spray so don't expect it to fall off itself.

 

Once the tank is at a bit of an angle you will have access to the breather hoses, pop off the big one and I think there are two smaller ones that go into the top of the tank, also take the hoses off the fuel pump (that's why you depressurised the system!)

 

When these are off you will be able to bung up all the holes in the tank so the petrol wont spill everywhere, remember not to do it in a way that your bung could end up in your petrol! All that's left now is to wrestle the tank off, lowering you trolley jack as you go.

 

One peice of advice I have is when removing the pipes from the brackets (with the metal clips) ie on the strut and under the back of the car, don't just twist away at them wildly. I did and pulled one of the brackets through my floor! . Just cover them in penetrating oil and wiggle and pull.

 

I connected the rear pipes to the compensator first and started from the back. I put the compensator in place, made sure the back pipe would fit then went to the bonnet and pulled the front bit up, make sure it's in roughly the right place before you clip the compensator in because it can be a nightmare if it's away to one side. I used my hands to make the bends and as long as you do it sensibly and make curves not corners (if that makes sense?) it's easy enough.

 

As for the fronts, I got the pipe roughly in place, then connected the MC end first, because that gives you how much you have to play with making the really tight s-bend through the arch.

 

If you're getting a kit then you cold do one side at a time, refering to the other to make sure you have it right. As long as you take your time and be care full not to kink the pipes it's a pretty rewarding job to do, especially when the car stops afterwards!

 

 

 

 

Sorry I seem to have got a bit carried away with myself there!!! Hope that's of some use to you!

[skeggyrik 3]

Sorry I seem to have got a bit carried away with myself there!!! Hope that's of some use to you!

 

Rick, thanks, for the pointers, feel free to get carried anytime you're helping me out! Looks like you've already saved me getting my face sprayed with petrol, so thanks for that.

From what's been said above it looks like it's a pretty good deal, so will go ahead and order them. Hopefully they will be here for next weekend by which time I should be in position to fit them.

 

Will have a look how fiddly it's going to be without dropping the tank. On first look I thought it wasn't going to be possible.

If it's a "forum fiddly" it might be doable, if it's a "Haynes manual fiddly" it's impossible.

 

Will let you know how I get on and add my list of do's and don'ts for future searches.

 

I always liked the Haynes Manual famous last words: Retain small spring pinggggg

 

Thanks again

 

Rich

[hengti 2]

to fit them with the tank in situ, i found it possible by threading them through from the front (compensator end). i bent a fairly gentle curve in the pipe, plugged up the end that was being pushed through and stuck at it. i remember one side took me half an hour or more to get through, but the other went through first time - go figure! there were loads of stones wedged inbetween the tank and the bodywork on mine, which I guess wasn't helping.

 

have fun either way!

[skeggyrik 3]

Just for a point of interest I had another quote come in for these from Namrick Ltd. www.namrick.co.uk/ and it came in at £84.40 including postage and VAT. Delivery would be 2-3 days.

 

So seems like that's about the price you have to pay. I've already ordered from Automec who were a quid cheaper anyway! Based on the quality recommendation about Automec stuff from Jackherer above I'm happy.

 

The Part number is GB 4702 if you should wish to order it from Namrick.

 

Rich

[Jonmurgie 2]

I've just bought complete raplacement lines in Goodridge 200 Series througout and it was about £200 inc vat which I didn't think was too bad if the copper lines are £85ish and the 6 line goodridge kit is about £90ish

 

http://www.mdracing.co.uk/images/rebuild/large/pic390.jpg

[Phil H 16]

I just go to the local factors who make them up for 50p a metre and 50p per union, costas about £40 to completely do a 4 line system.

[hengti 2]

I just go to the local factors who make them up for 50p a metre and 50p per union, costas about £40 to completely do a 4 line system.

 

that's well cheap - typical price round here seems to be £1/ft and £2/per union - so even the shortest pipe costs a fiver!

[Jonmurgie 2]

by comparison, that goodridge stuff is £6.20 + VAT per meter and about £7 + VAT per union

[Phil H 16]

that's well cheap - typical price round here seems to be £1/ft and £2/per union - so even the shortest pipe costs a fiver!

 

 

I may have got it wrong, with it possibly being £1.50 per metre and the same for a union, but nevertheless, it was £40 just over to do my 1.9.

[pug_ham 245 3 Cars]

I just go to the local factors who make them up for 50p a metre and 50p per union, costas about £40 to completely do a 4 line system.

I got a 25 foot roll for £6 & then unions are 20p each. Handy when you have your own pipe flaring tool.

 

Graham.

[Guest BrainFluid]

I just take the brake line off, take it to a friendly garage who then measure how long each line is and then puts a union on each end for me.

 

The most I've paid so far is £7 for one whole sides worth of line

 

But last time the geezer gave me the front and rear for free!

[jonah 1]

I got a 25 foot roll for £6 & then unions are 20p each. Handy when you have your own pipe flaring tool.

 

Graham.

That's definitely the way I would go. Machine Mart do a cutting and flaring kit for about £20, and a 25ft reel of pipe will do the whole car. You can usually even reuse the unions and save a few more pennies! The cutting and flaring isn't difficult (takes a few practice runs to get good flares), and copper pipe is so easy to work with, just unroll it as you clip it to the car and bend it to shape by hand. When you get to the end of each run you can make the flare in place, no need to measure out everything beforehand.

 

Also gives you the option of re-routing the rear pipe around the side of the fuel tank instead of over the top to save you dropping the tank - I have done this before and managed to find a route that was well tucked up out of the way of running damage.

[taylorspug 7]

I got a 25 foot roll for £6 & then unions are 20p each. Handy when you have your own pipe flaring tool.

 

Graham.

 

Amen to that! And maybe go to extremes and lash out on a full on flaring tool like i have...

 

Perfect flares anyone?

[skeggyrik 3]

Finally got round to doing this today! Got sidetracked with other jobs.

 

Anyway, I did it without dropping the tank, it was a bit fiddly but not as bad as I expected. As for the up and over the tank part, I went from the back and fed them forward in a gentle curve. Once through to the front I used a set of long nose pliers to get a hold of the union and slowly slid it back and forth creating more of a bend until I could pull it all the way through past the tank and into the area where the compensators sit. There is a clip for the pipe either side of the of the tank and one in the centre. I've got the new pipe clipped in to the 2 I could get to either side which is good enough for me, they aren't going anywhere. Once that was done the rest was easy.

 

Getting the old pipe out was going to be a pain so I cut it in half an pulled

 

Not got the master cylinder on the car at the minute so will have to "tie" into that when it's back on.

The old compensators are welded solid to the old unions so will have buy a pair of those.

 

otherwise happy.

 

Rich

[Jer309GTi 3]

Amen to that! And maybe go to extremes and lash out on a full on flaring tool like i have...

 

Perfect flares anyone?

 

Can't go wrong with one of those The Sykes-Pickavant one (very similar design) is so nice to use. Trouble is I can't justify the expense of buying one myself

[Richie-Van-GTi 74 2 Cars]

I ghot one of the machine mart specials, Clarke flaring kit I think it is, does the job fine and local plumbers merchants is very cheap indeed

Always handy to have stuff like that in the garage.