Lost All My Gearbox Oil

[Mike Walker 0]

Hello all

 

Parked my car up for the evening only to go out the next morning and find a big puddle of oil under the car which is definately gearbox oil (you can't mistake that smell ). I've just had an operation on my knee so i'm finding it difficult to crawl around underneath the car! I havn't had the 205 long so i'm pretty new to it but i've found what I think is the drain plug kind of hex shaped with an alan key like slot on the face?

 

If that is the drain plug it's still there and is dry I jacked the car up on one side which encouraged some more oil to drip out, I couldn't get far enough under the car to work out where from but its deffo not the drain plug so just wondering where else it could be from and why it's happened?

[Rob_the_Sparky 9]

Never heard of one failing that bad but I'd be looking at the driveshaft oil seals. The driveshafts go straight into the box with these seals to stop the oil dropping out. They often weep a bit but not heard on them failing like this but worth a try.

 

The drain plug is at the back of the diff, right by the subframe. Very hard to see if you are not under the car. There is also a filler plug on the end of the box.

 

Rob

[Mike Walker 0]

Never heard of one failing that bad but I'd be looking at the driveshaft oil seals. The driveshafts go straight into the box with these seals to stop the oil dropping out. They often weep a bit but not heard on them failing like this but worth a try.

 

The drain plug is at the back of the diff, right by the subframe. Very hard to see if you are not under the car. There is also a filler plug on the end of the box.

 

Rob

 

Thanks for the reply, that sounds like it could be the problem as it felt like it was coming from the area where the driveshafts go into the box was just a bit unsure of the setup as i'm only used to working on rear wheel drive cars.

 

I've got a Haynes manual on its way so hopefully i'll be able to have a bash at sorting it. It does seem strange that it would have failed that badly and suddenly, must have happened just before I parked up as there was a good few litres of oil there.

Edited September 6, 2006 by Mike Walker

[inferno 1]

last time this happened to me there was a hole in the diff casing. have a feel around the back of the box.

 

be ready to buy a new box though if its run dry for any lenth of time, as the last one i ran dry, i topped it back up and it blew a hole in the diff casing 2days later. im not sure why, but i know several people on hear will tell you theres did it too!

[Mike Walker 0]

last time this happened to me there was a hole in the diff casing. have a feel around the back of the box.

 

be ready to buy a new box though if its run dry for any lenth of time, as the last one i ran dry, i topped it back up and it blew a hole in the diff casing 2days later. im not sure why, but i know several people on hear will tell you theres did it too!

 

A hole as in.........a big round void that shouldn't be there, thats mad!!!

 

I'll have a feel round and i'll make sure my fingers are crossed as I do it. Due to the sheer amount of oil that got dumped in one area with the car at a standstill i'm pretty confident that it'll be ok once the problem is fixed and the box is topped back up but then I am an eternal optimist!

 

As a side note, driveshaft oil seals - difficult job?

[huxley309 0]

Nah not really, ripping the driveshaft will be the hardest part if it's the drivers side that's leaking....that shaft has the intermediate bearing you have to get out from the lower engine mount

Edited September 6, 2006 by huxley309

[Mike Walker 0]

Nah not really, ripping the driveshaft will be the hardest part if it's the drivers side that's leaking....that shaft has the intermediate bearing you have to get out from the lower engine mount

 

Sounds ok, got a feeling its the drivers side but hey ho its always fun learning new stuff

[pugrallye 0]

divers side is easy.. if you have a big pry bar to release the bearing

[mishu 0]

Happened to me about 2 years ago. Standstill -- about 1 litre poured out of it without warning. I filled it back up, and hasn't been a problem since.

 

Coincidence has it I'm planning to renew the oil tomorrow. If only the square wrench will fit the drain plug...

 

BTW, on a MA1 box (1.1 GR), I see 2 nuts with the square hole, both on the left side of the engine (end of gearbox), one very low and towards the back, and one a bit higher and towards the front. Am I right to assume these are the drain/level plugs? Don't have a photo, but would appreciate one

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Doesn't sound very good, Driveshaft seals normally weap oil not just dump a load out, So it could well be the Final Drive unit that's gone AOL, Has the car still got drive?

[jim21070 2]

The breather on top of the 'box may be blocked, causing a large pressure build-up.

[Craigb 2]

I had mine dump its oil from the driveshaft seal . It turned out be the fact that the gear box was parting company with the engine, and had pulled the shaft out of the housing enough for it not to seal ...

[Mike Walker 0]

Oh dear here come the doommongers

 

The car drove absolutely fine until I parked it up, no noticeable difference whatsoever. I havn't tried it since as I really wouldn't feel happy about trying to use the gearbox with no oil in it!

 

Erm, should you be able to see the flywheel when looking under the car........................?

[Rob_the_Sparky 9]

There should be a tin plate cover over the bottom of the bell housing but it is sometimes missing allowing you to see the back of the flywheel.

 

A driveshaft coming out or a hole in the casing would seem more likely than a seal failure though. For a drive shaft to come out though clearly there is something else wrong, like a wishbone or the aforementioned disconnecting box.

 

Rob

 

P.S. There are only 2 litres of oil in there so sounds like you have dropped most of it.

[jackherer 543]

For a drive shaft to come out though clearly there is something else wrong, like a wishbone or the aforementioned disconnecting box.

 

also could be the intermediate bearing bolts come undone, this allows the long shaft to come out far enough to drop all the oil.

[Mike Walker 0]

There should be a tin plate cover over the bottom of the bell housing but it is sometimes missing allowing you to see the back of the flywheel.

 

A driveshaft coming out or a hole in the casing would seem more likely than a seal failure though. For a drive shaft to come out though clearly there is something else wrong, like a wishbone or the aforementioned disconnecting box.

 

Rob

 

P.S. There are only 2 litres of oil in there so sounds like you have dropped most of it.

 

Gash, this sounds like its going to be more of a pisser than I thought

 

To start with the gearbox idea - if the gearbox bellhousing still mates to the block without a gap between the two I assume it rules out that idea?

 

Driveshaft popped out - Literally completely out from the box or just 'some' movement?

 

Oil seal gone - Visible deterioration of/rip in rubber?

 

If driveshaft has come out - Likely to be some underlying cause and I should remove the gearbox from car and investigate/just buy a new gearbox and replace?

[Rob_the_Sparky 9]

Driveshaft doesn't have to be completely out for it not to seal but if it is out then there would be an other problem that has let it pop out. Under normal conditions they can't fall out. More likely to be suspension or intermediate bearing problem than box.

 

Seal gone, must be faily major to drop that much oil, would have though it would be visible but remember I've never heard of a box dropping its oil that fast through a damaged seal. Usually just leaks a bit, annoying stain on the drive and an oily engine bay.

[Mike Walker 0]

Driveshaft doesn't have to be completely out for it not to seal but if it is out then there would be an other problem that has let it pop out. Under normal conditions they can't fall out. More likely to be suspension or intermediate bearing problem than box.

 

Seal gone, must be faily major to drop that much oil, would have though it would be visible but remember I've never heard of a box dropping its oil that fast through a damaged seal. Usually just leaks a bit, annoying stain on the drive and an oily engine bay.

 

Cheers for all the help

 

The knee's good enough to go crawling under the car now so i'm going to have a poke around today and will update the post with my findings.

[Mike Walker 0]

Well, I found the problem

 

Once I'd crawled under the car it was obvious that the driveshaft had come out about 8mm as there was a distinct section on it of 'shineyness'. I spent a while going round the suspension arms etc. looking for play but couldn't find anything a miss. Eventually I found a small bolt near the offending driveshaft which had a captive head one side and a nut the other side. This was extremelly loose so I started to do it up although I didn't think this very small diameter bolt could essentially hold the driveshaft in!!

 

As I tightened the nut onto the bolt the driveshaft gradually pulled itself back in until it was fully inside its housing as it should be. This seemed very much like a tensioner or something?

 

Anyway, i'm extremely happy that the problem was so minor and so easy to fix and i'm also certain it would have taken a lot longer to diagnose and fix had it not been for the advice on here.