My Rr Graph At Last

[Adnic69 0]

Link to my rr graph. Spec is Autosprint stage 3 head single angle vavle seats, reprofiled cam to piper 270 spec, rebuilt bottom end.

It didnt give as much power as I wanted but they never do. It does feel a quick car though. I have been wondering if the cam is what is letting it down. As I am changing to bike tb's would a catcam 279 help?

 

All comments on graph welcome.

 

http://img196.imageshack.us/img196/7677/rr3zy.jpg

[smckeown 1]

I wouldn't be happy with those results. It's making a little more power but at 600rpm more, but even worse is its making less torque and at significantly more RPM.

 

Bummer

[Ahl 4]

As Sean said.

 

I take it those are projected flywheel figures?

 

Pumaracing has often said that the piper/kent 270 cams are either the same or even slightly worse than the standard cam - i can't remember which is which.

 

What do Autosprint recommend with their cylinder head? They'd probably be the best people to ask.

[Adnic69 0]

They are flywheel yeah. I was told that it was a good cam for road manners and that head. I can't see it being the head as it was really well done and I have used him to do heads for me in the past and got good results. It could also be that owen developments didnt set it up 100%. Do they generaly need a vernier to be 100%?

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Not knowing what a Stage 3 head intails it's hard to say, But it's makes power well up the range compared to std so the breathing can;t be that bad, I've never liked Piper cams (Or what ever there trading name is now) but Richard Longman use them.

Not good power at all, For a base figure mine which is basically blue printed made 137bhp on the rollers last yr, which seems about right as it goes fairly well

[Adnic69 0]

So the weak link is either the cam or setting up.

Well when it has the 4 branch,bike tb's, megasquirt I will send it to emerald for dave walker to play with it.

What cam do you think would suit it best?

[smckeown 1]

So the weak link is either the cam or setting up.

 

Or dare I say it the head. Has Owen Developments got a good reputation for setting up 205s on stock induction etc. ?

 

Who build the bottom ?

What is the exact spec of the head ?

 

I'm no expert, but would it be worth checking things like compression, fuel pressure, anything else that might reduce power ?

[Adnic69 0]

I rebuilt the bottom end and spent a long while making sure it was put together well. I will check compression but can't imagine its that. To be honest I heard good thigs about them on other cars so just thought that they would be good on 205's also.

Silly I know.

I know its hard to say but what sort of power shouild I be expecting with a spec like that?

[smckeown 1]

Well it's not so much the power that i think is radically wrong, just the fact the torque is way up te rev range, that just seems rather odd. I'm sure more experienced people can say more

[Adnic69 0]

Forgive the ignorance but what would put the torque so far up the rev range?

[Rippthrough 98]

Forgive the ignorance but what would put the torque so far up the rev range?

 

 

Cams?

[Adnic69 0]

uuumm. Does make you wonder. Surely a 15 year old cam that has been reprofiled is never going to be that good is it. Add to the fact that I don't have a vernier.

I am more than tempted to swap it for a catcam when I do the other bits to it.

Didnt Dino's engine of similar spec but with 4branch make 143ftlbs torque?

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Owen's have been setting up 205 for many many years all with various config's from std Stock Hatch cars to our monster 8v's with 225bhp, I'm surprized Mark did anything with the Megasquirt thing as he likes Motec these days. Not sure on the bike T/B's thou, I;ve yet to see good proven results with using them.

I would go for a better cam thou as that should make the most of any mods done, But as said speak to Autosprint and see what they recomend for the head work carried out

[Anthony 1,003]

Does anyone have the figures that an average standard 1.9 makes on those rollers?

 

I'm going to go against the flow here and say that the engine doesn't look that bad to me - sure the power/torque figures don't sound much, but it's got a fairly flat torque curve with a decent slab of grunt between 2500 and 6500rpm, looks like it'll rev much better than a standard 1.9 lump, and is 10hp odd up on what a good standard 1.9 8v will get which seems about right for a flowed head given the cam isn't much different to standard.

 

I reckon that mapped ignition would do wonders for that engine - especially if you're running over 10:1 compression (which you'll need to for hotter cams) as the standard dizzy advance curve is not well suited at all and needs retarding loads to keep it from pinking low down (which then kills power/torque)

[Adnic69 0]

Well all I can do is keep it as it is for now, buy the 4branch, modify the mangoleti manifold to take mt bike tb's, build the megasquirt get it all ready to go on and swap it over. With the possible change in cam.

Thanks for the positive words Anthony. Its another one of those don't believe the rr results as it does feel a quick car and pulls very well.

[Kitsune 0]

I've also heard good things about Mark and OD. Need to talk to them about setting up my 205. Need more funds though!

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Miss read the post abit, I thought you had the TB's etc on already!!, But with them fitted it will help allot, Just put sometime into the inlet including welding it I would have thought as you can never get the ports to match up otherwise, Might be worth ebaying it and getting another one just not made by mangoleti.

[petert 588]

stage 3 head single angle vavle seats, reprofiled cam to piper 270 spec,......

 

Herein lies the problems.

 

The 8V head flow responds to well cut three angle seats. Just cutting the seats correctly with a quick blend into the throats makes a huge improvement.

 

The next issue is cam timing. If the head has been decked and running a std. pulley, there is "little" chance of the cam being timing correctly. It will be retarded and most likely the reason why the power range has been pushed up the rev range.

[Adnic69 0]

Miles, in respect to the manifold I was going to get someone to take the opening where the tb would sit out to the outside dimension of the tb and take the about 10mm deep into the manifold. Thus creating an area where the tb wouls slot it, using the recess on the tb to place an O ring and drilling and tapping 3 areas to insert a grub screw around the body on each inlet track. This would secure the tb and make it airtight with the advantage of having the port the other end ot the manifold matching the head. All I need to do then is alter the spacing, something like 15mm.