Overheating Water And Water Disappearing

[jonarob 0]

OK, just this morning I took the 1.6 to uni (about 10 miles mainly dual carriageway) and by the time i got there she was overheating and the warning lights were on.

 

Went into lecture and came back with a litre of evian. Put half in the coolant tank and got home with the temp approaching the max but never quite overheating. Coolant tank was empty when I got home. Put the rest of the water in and it's been sat on my drive for a couple of hours. Just went to look again with the intention of taking her out to see if she's still overheating and no water in the tank again.

 

There are no signs of leakage or anything - what's going on? I've done a search but it hasn't really helped.

 

Car's done just over 60,000 genuine miles and is in mint condition throughout. Tell me this isn't serious!

[hengti 2]

is there any sign of water contaminating the oil ?

[jonarob 0]

This is what I was worried about. Not from what I can see...

 

I'll have a good look round the cap in a sec.

[jonarob 0]

Had a good look around the engine bay - no sign of mayo under the oil fill cap, and nice clean oil on the dipstick (oil changed last week).

 

Where can the water go? There are no leaks in the footwells either.

Edited May 18, 2006 by jonarob

[Butler 0]

Was the journey in traffic?

 

Could it be overheating because the fan is not cutting in and fourcing out the water though the pressure cap on the expansion tank.

 

If it starts getting hot later and the fan isn't cutting in, open the windows and but the blowers on full heat.

Edited May 18, 2006 by Butler

[jonarob 0]

My fan was cutting in as the heat rose, and it remains on for a minute or so after stopping the car.

 

The journey was a little bit in traffic and admittedly that's when the warning light came on, but it hasn't happened before and it's not exactly a hot day.

[Rippthrough 98]

Could be the HG has just gone between a coolant passage then.

[jonarob 0]

Christ.

 

Is that gonna be expensive?

[Butler 0]

Is there oil in your water?

 

You make have a leak also. When it gets hot, open the bonnet and check.

 

HG is expensive if you pay Peugeot to fix it.

[jonarob 0]

I suppose it's possible that water is coming out in the engine bay and evaporating before i see it... I'll check.

 

Doesn't seem to be oil in the water.

[jonarob 0]

Well I've worked out where the water was going. At the top of the coolant reservoir thing there's the pressurised cap. On the neck of the reservoir there's a little rubber pipe that leads into the engine bay.

 

It's obviously some sort of overflow pipe so when the pressure increases the water rises up to the cap and out of the pipe. Thing is, the pipe doesn't lead anywhere. It just pisses into the engine bay onto my suspension. Should it lead somewhere? This seems to be where all of my water is going...

[hengti 2]

if it's not leaking externally, i'd suspect hg i'm afraid

that's a fair amount of water to be losing though - would have thought it'd show up either in the oil/combustion chambers - take it you're not getting any white smoke?

 

if you take the expansion cap off (not whilst it's red hot!), can you smell combustion gases coming from the expansion tank with the engine running? probably difficult to decide without testing equipment - take it to a garage and ask them to perform a 'sniffer' test

 

compression test might help too - but, if it fails the sniffer test, that's a definite diagnosis

 

mine went late last year - cost me alot (£500), but you can get it done alot cheaper

 

 

(another) edit : isn't that just the expansion blow off outlet?

Edited May 18, 2006 by hengti

[jonarob 0]

The little pipe I've arrowed here:

 

 

The other end of the pipe is open and just leads into the engine bay - is this normal? Why's my water pissing out of it if it is?

[Butler 0]

Yes it goes somewhere, its a closed system. I can't remeber where of the top of my head. Someone will though.

 

 

EDIT: not sure about that one. It should only come out of there if the system is being presurised. HG failure would cause this.

Edited May 18, 2006 by Butler

[Craigb 2]

EDIT: not sure about that one. It should only come out of there if the system is being presurised. HG failure would cause this.

 

Or the expansion cap is faulty and just allowing it to flow out

[jonarob 0]

So does anyone know where that pipe goes? Is it supposed to be open ended? Can someone have a look in their beast?

[Butler 0]

yeah that one should be open. on the phase 2, like me it does even exist, so i though you meant one of the black pipes originally.

 

 

Good point Craig, that would be a cheap easy fix.

Edited May 18, 2006 by Butler

[Rob_the_Sparky 9]

Well if it wasn't a HG that caused it to loose water in the first place then you have almost certainly bust it now based on my experience. They seem to die at the first sign of the stop light.

 

When the HG goes 99% of the time it is between the pistons and the water jacket. THis has two effects:

 

1) When stationary water can leak into the pistons

2) When engine is running it will blow gasses into the water jacket and if bad it will push water out of the system

 

The overflow pipe is indeed meant to be like that.

The pressure cap won't make much difference, you can you these cars with it loose and not loose water (I know as it is a trick I use when my pipes are leaking a bit or I'm limping a car home with a bodged pipe)

 

Easiest test to do is a compression test, one tool and 10 minutes should tell you if you have bust an HG. Even better is a leak down test but that requires more tools and is probably a garage job.

 

To replace it isn't a small job but not horrific either, however confirm that this is what it is before getting it done. A thermostat stuck closed can also cause an over heat or a radiator that is blocked up.

 

Rob

 

P.S. If it a dead HG make sure you make sure that there isn't something else wrong. A dead HG is generally a result of overheating, not the cause (although it is possible the HG went first but you don't want to fix it and then overheat again).

[jonD6B 0]

My opinion is to change the thermostat before anything else. Could be the reason that the water went down without the car moving could just be air shifting in the system allowing the water level to drop. Change the stat, check the rad for small amounts of steam on warming up and make sure you bleed the system before running the car.

[ada205 2]

The little pipe I've arrowed here:

 

 

The other end of the pipe is open and just leads into the engine bay - is this normal? Why's my water pissing out of it if it is?

Is'nt that pipe just an overflow? Like Butler say's, their aint even the pipe on ph2's.

 

From what you say, sounds like waters disapearing whilst the car's not running, which is strange if theres no puddles under the car. If head gasket, then surley some of the symptoms already mentioned would be present. Does the top hose from the rad feel rock hard when the car's hot and has plenty of water in it, and does the car turn over/start ok, as HG blown can allow water in the bore's making starting a problem. Think someone else asked if there was any white smoke out the back? This would have been worse when it first started over heating as there would/should have been plenty of antifreeze in then, which really show's white out the back, and smells very distinctive. You've probably got none in now though, with all the top ups it's needed.

 

Maybe it's a leak that only shows under pressure. I once had a major leak that never showed when the car was standing, always bone dry under the car. When ever i drove a few miles though, the water light would come on pretty quickly. That turned out to be the water pump shagged. Rad and water pipe leaks sometimes dont show unless pressurised too. Have a look around the bottom of the engine on the drivers side to see if theres any water around the bottom pully area, as water pump has to be a strong suspect.

 

Also have a good feel behind the centre console, though you say foot wells are dry, so probably not matrix. Mine went recently, and completely flooded the foot well on the drivers side.

Edited May 18, 2006 by ada205

[aw11_hgt 0]

OK, just this morning I took the 1.6 to uni (about 10 miles mainly dual carriageway) and by the time i got there she was overheating and the warning lights were on.

 

Went into lecture and came back with a litre of evian. Put half in the coolant tank and got home with the temp approaching the max but never quite overheating. Coolant tank was empty when I got home. Put the rest of the water in and it's been sat on my drive for a couple of hours. Just went to look again with the intention of taking her out to see if she's still overheating and no water in the tank again.

 

There are no signs of leakage or anything - what's going on? I've done a search but it hasn't really helped.

 

Car's done just over 60,000 genuine miles and is in mint condition throughout. Tell me this isn't serious!

 

You don't mention whether you had any problems before today. If its behaving its self without any issues prior to today - suddenly HG faliure sounds a bit odd. Last year my 1.6 sprang an external leak under pressure from one of the small diameter hoses going to the IM - half an hour, and a fiver's worth fuel/water hose from halfrauds and problem solved. Also to stand more chance of diagnosing the problem first refill/bleed fully - this may highlight any external issues in the process. Try the cap as has been already mentioned. However HG can go with age, and 205 are getting on a bit now. HTH

[Rob_the_Sparky 9]

Sudden HG failure after an overheat is common, not unusual. The only other likely place to loose water and it to be hard to see is the water pump. Doen't sound right for that much water loss though.

 

Rob

[Simes 248 2 Cars]

My Mi went through a phase of this, just chucking water water out of the overflow pipe after a journey.

No HG failure, in fact I never found the cause although I put in at least 5l of water over that month.

Never had the stop light on though although the low cooling warning lamp did come on after I cleaned the sensor.

Edited May 19, 2006 by Simes

[jonarob 0]

The reservoir is empty again today after 24 hours of no use. Filled it up and left it there overnight without touching anything. What's going on?

[aw11_hgt 0]

The reservoir is empty again today after 24 hours of no use. Filled it up and left it there overnight without touching anything. What's going on?

 

 

When you say filled up have you literally just filled the reservoir bottle up and thats it?? If so you really need to open the bleed valves, refill and bleed the system fully, not just top up the bottle as air is obviously present in the system.