307 266mm Calipers On A 1.6 Hub

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

I have acquired a set of nearly new calipers, pads and discs (hubs, driveshafts wishbones etc!!) from a 1400 307 as the discs are 266mm in diameter. I am looking to upgrade my brakes on my CTI with these. As mine is a 1.9 CTI, it runs 1.6 GTI spec front hubs, shafts and brakes. I know for the 283mm 180 / 307 HDI conversion you need 1.9 hubs to mount the caliper and discs and to ideally change the master cylinder, but am hoping that I can avoid this by using the smaller calipers (and they also fit in my wheels).

 

Has anyone tried fitting these?

Do all 307's share the same hub?

Is the piston smaller in the 1400 caliper than the HDI / 2.0 caliper?

 

I have a set of 306 GTI-6 283mm discs too and maybe if the caliper was the same, then I could fit these by buying a bigger yoke and pads?

[Guest smokinslim]

Could be wrong but i think the GTI-6 brakes are the same as the 307 HDI ones

[Ryan 99]

GTI-6 brakes are different. The 307 283mm setup is the same as the 206 GTI180, although the 206 has better pads.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Henry, I'm fairly sure that the CTi runs base model hubs with a mixture of 1.9 discs & 1.6 calipers like the STDT(there was a topic about it recently).

 

Aren't the 307 283mm discs also a few mm wider than the GTi-6 ones?

 

These should all bolt straight on to you hubs with no extra work afaik.

 

We could do all this when you come up to swap the gearbox over if you want.

 

Graham.

[jonnie205 1]

You willneed 1.9 hubs for any 307 brake conversion. I have fitted 1.4 and 2.0 brakes on 1.9 hubs and they both go staright on so i guess this means they will not go on the 1.6 hub

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

I agree they won't fit onto the 1.6 GTi hubs but the 306 266mm discs & calipers fit onto base model hubs OK & so do the 1.9 discs (which are what should be fitted to your car now) so I still think they will fit with no need to change the hubs etc but having not tried it Jonnie could be right & you do need 1.9 hubs.

 

Graham.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

Henry, I'm fairly sure that the CTi runs base model hubs with a mixture of 1.9 discs & 1.6 calipers like the STDT(there was a topic about it recently).

 

Ahh then this sounds promising!! I suppose the only way I can find out is to try. It should be pretty obvious if they fit or not once I have removed the caliper and carrier from the hub and line up the new disc, caliper and yoke.

 

Why does the 1.6 have different design hubs? Also is it possible to just change the bearing in a base model hub to accomodate a 1.9 driveshaft if they are basically the same offset or are there base model , 1.6 and 1.9 hubs out there....

 

... infact looking here I can see there are only 2 designs of hub (Excluding ABS hubs) and one of those if for the 1.9 (XU9JA), so logically the 1.6 hub is the same as the base model ones! There are also only 2 types of bearing too here so base model shafts must be the same as 1.6 GTI shafts. Confused I am!!

 

Incidentally the above also leads me to believe that any 205 fitted with ABS (of which it was an option on the 1.6) will be using 1.9 running gear. I know that ABS'd 1.6's have 1.9 disc rear beams already.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Ahh then this sounds promising!! I suppose the only way I can find out is to try. It should be pretty obvious if they fit or not once I have removed the caliper and carrier from the hub and line up the new disc, caliper and yoke.

 

Why does the 1.6 have different design hubs?

Does look promising, a matter of try it & see. Basically hubs are different because they can be (& they are French).

Also is it possible to just change the bearing in a base model hub to accomodate a 1.9 driveshaft if they are basically the same offset or are there base model , 1.6 and 1.9 hubs out there....

I'm not sure but from looking at the parts CD previously the only difference is the driveflange (although there are actually three different hub carriers looking at the page you've linked to).

There are also only 2 types of bearing too here so base model shafts must be the same as 1.6 GTI shafts. Confused I am!!

Base model shafts are the same at the hub end as the 1.6 GTi shafts but have weaker smaller CV joints.

Incidentally the above also leads me to believe that any 205 fitted with ABS (of which it was an option on the 1.6) will be using 1.9 running gear. I know that ABS'd 1.6's have 1.9 disc rear beams already.

Not having seen a 1.6 GTi with ABS I can't be sure but I understand you are right on that.

 

Graham.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

Just an update on this as it is nice to post the outcomes of investigations...

 

I put some new pads in my 307 HDi (283mm) and had a look at the caliper on it and measured the piston diameter. It was 56mm. The caliper was a different design than the 266m 307 one so it is not just a case of swopping yokes over to get 283mm brakes.

 

I then took the wheel off my CTI and looked to see if the 266mm 307 caliper would fit onto it and the offset is wrong. Basically I think I need the 1.9 hubs to be able to use the brakes, or find some offset 266mm discs

 

To conclude, if you want to fit any 307 calipers to a 205, I believe you really need 1.9 hubs. Base model hubs may do too (from what Graham says). To fit bigger brakes to a 1.6 GTI / CTI, you need new driveshafts to go with the hubs so they fit in the bearings.

[stuart 31 3 Cars]

Just an update on this as it is nice to post the outcomes of investigations...

 

I put some new pads in my 307 HDi (283mm) and had a look at the caliper on it and measured the piston diameter. It was 56mm. The caliper was a different design than the 266m 307 one so it is not just a case of swopping yokes over to get 283mm brakes.

 

I then took the wheel off my CTI and looked to see if the 266mm 307 caliper would fit onto it and the offset is wrong. Basically I think I need the 1.9 hubs to be able to use the brakes, or find some offset 266mm discs

 

To conclude, if you want to fit any 307 calipers to a 205, I believe you really need 1.9 hubs. Base model hubs may do too (from what Graham says). To fit bigger brakes to a 1.6 GTI / CTI, you need new driveshafts to go with the hubs so they fit in the bearings.

 

You can use base model hubs to fit 1.9 offset brakes to a 1.6 Gti. The spline on the outer shaft end is the same on the base model as it is on the 1.6 Gti.

 

You can also fit 1.9 offset brakes to a base model. I have Girling 1.9 Gti caliper and discs on my 205 Xs and they went straight on.

[Guest foz mi16]

If this is correct you have just made my day! So all i need to fit my bigger brakes to my 1.6gti are base model hubs and i dont even need to change my driveshafts?! My bigger brakes are off a 1.9 gti by the way!

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Going back a few post the 1.6 GTi with ABS did use the 1.9 Front hub's and shafts which I belive a different offset wheel,

But the 1.9 Brakes do fit on the 1.6 hubs as I;'ve done this a couple of time, but personally I prefer the 1.6 ones as they are allot lighter and better than the lump of cast iron as fitted to the 1.9's.

Be good to confirm if the 307 hubs are like the 205 ones as the 306 ones are.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Be good to confirm if the 307 hubs are like the 205 ones as the 306 ones are.

Henry has some so checking shouldn't be that hard but haven't the later 306 hubs got a larger balljoint fitted?

 

Only downside with 1.6 bendix calipers is the dis-similar metal corrosion that causes sheared bleed nipples imo, just like 1.9 rear calipers.

 

Graham.

[Henry Yorke 269 3 Cars]

307 hubs are no use as the struts are bolted to the hub instead of the slide in and pinch bolt style of a 205. I was hoping the same!! I have a pair of 307 hubs and driveshafts sitting out in the rain at the moment!!. Wishbones are still attached though I will save these for the wifes car as they tend to eat them every 40k

 

Dedication for you, a pic in the rain during the European Cup final!!

 

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

I saw mark (Dead205's) CTi yesterday, its a J reg & has 1.6Gti hubs fitted so you'll need some 1.9 hubs. (which you've already got ).

 

Graham.