Tachometer With Aftermarket Ecu

[IvarS 0]

Read somewhere that Graham sucessfully installed a BX coilpack tachometer into his 205. I did the same the other day and it works great. All you who get the Emerald tacho drive should try looking for a Citroen BX 16 TZI or other coil pack BX instead. The only thing that needs to be done is moving one of the cables in the connector.

 

[Jonmurgie 2]

Great to hear... so what other BX's will have that kind of tachometer?

[jackherer 543]

Great to hear... so what other BX's will have that kind of tachometer?

 

only a very few late 19TZI and 19GTI (8v) models that have coilpacks and not distributors.

[Jonmurgie 2]

So not the easiest things to track down then! Am toying with that or just fitting one of the motorbike/kit car dashs (the MoTeC dash would be nice though!)

[IvarS 0]

I think all the BX "Millesime" models have coilpack ignition. Mine came off a 16 TZi 1991 and AFAIK, BX-production continued until 1993 so it shouldn't be that hard to find!

 

Something I noticed is the coilpack tachometer only has three wires in the connector at the back of the instrument while the 205 GTi tachometer always has four. This way you can see if the tacho will work. I also have read that 16 TZI with ORGA-number (production date, stamped on A-pillar) 5285 and later have coilpack ignition (1991-04-29 and on).

Edited March 21, 2006 by IvarS

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Excellent, mine was from an MP3.1 car & is used on the same but I didn't know if it would work on a system such as Emerald. Good news that it does. The rev counter can also be found in a 405 or any car using MP3.1 I would assume.

The only thing that needs to be done is moving one of the cables in the connector.

I had to do the same & will take a picture next time I have the dash cowl off to get my K light working as I've yet to do this.

 

I recently got another rev counter from a BX & I don't think it was a coilpack version but this rev counter has four pins (my BX one & old 205 only have three but a different order) so I want to see if it works or not with the extra pin where one is missing on the 205 rev counter (not car loom btw).

 

Graham.

[IvarS 0]

I'm running Megasquirt, cannot guarantee that it will work with Emerald but I would be surprised if it didn't. My signal comes straigth from the ECU, as it does on an Emerald setup so whouldn't be any difference.

 

Graham: Is the 405 tachometer the same, fits the 205 instrument housing?

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Graham: Is the 405 tachometer the same, fits the 205 instrument housing?

The facia is visably bigger but the internals are fine afaik & can be swapped over using the 205 facia.

 

I've not used them personally but NickR used the rev counter from my donor 405 on his & they worked / fitted inside the 205 clocks fine.

 

Graham.

[Sam 4]

Which wire is it that needs swapping? I have fitted a set of these dials but all that happens is when the car is turning over the rev counter moves very slightly, thats it!

[IvarS 0]

Which wire is it that needs swapping? I have fitted a set of these dials but all that happens is when the car is turning over the rev counter moves very slightly, thats it!

 

On my tachometer, the only yellow wire needed to be moved to match the connector in the car.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Sam, not sure which wire it is that needs moving but iirc the 205 loom plug has four wires in it & the ecu rpm signal goes to a different pin. I found out which it was by running the car & trying the wire to the corresponding pin thats different on the rev counter & it worked.

 

Hardly the most scientific method but it worked & nothing blew up.

 

I'm going to take the dash cover off this next week hopefully so I'll take the picture then.

 

I was looking at the back of the original 205 rev counter & want to compare it with one from an MP3.1 set of clocks as maybe we can see the different resistors used internally to see if it could be done easily for very little considering how hard these clocks are to come by.

 

See attached pictures for the clock plug pin differences.

 

Graham.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

I did a little raid on some cars in the scrapyard today & managed to find two 405's with the Magnet Marreli ecu's & rev counter so I stripped their clocks down to get the rev counters. I cut a bit out of the blue wires film from the back of one set & got the plug to it.

 

I'm going to have a play around as I think they can be made to fit & work in the standard 205 clocks without to much work, just a bit of soldering once I figure out the wires.

 

Graham.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Good news for all, I've sorted it.

 

I took my dash apart this evening to get a picture of my rev counter plug showing where the wires were & decided whilst it was stripped to have a play with the other rev counters.

 

I was right & I had moved the wire to the empty slot on the GTi loom (top one on plug) I don't know if this is the same on the XS loom though.

 

I got my clocks far enough out & then split the wires in teh loom from the new clocks I got from a scrap car. I joined the earth from the new clocks to the existing earth on the 205 loom, guessed the others & got it working.

 

I took photos of my progress & then removed everything again & got the soldering iron ready. I almost connected them up wrong but realised my mistake before I'd done any soldering.

 

I removed the original small blue plug from the rev counter leaving the four pin holes open & removed the plug & wires from the original 205 rev counter so it will fit into the binnacle the same. With the wires in what I hoped was the right order I soldered them up hoping I hadn't damaged the pcb in the process.

 

When it was all soldered I tested the wires with a multimeter & all passed so I went back out to my car & connected the rev counter up & fired it up. It works perfectly.

 

Now just to fit them into a set of 205 clocks for the factory look but that won't take much.

 

Photos below of my evenings work.

 

Graham.

[Sam 4]

Graham, I have the bx coilpack dials, does this mean I can finally get my rev counter working by swapping those 2 wires

[Super Josh 4]

Graham, i'm a little confused from reading your post. Have you modified a standard 205 GTi clock so that it will work with the low voltage ECU tacho drive signal? or have you modified the loom so that you can fit a clock from another Pug/Citroen model?

 

 

Josh

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Graham, I have the bx coilpack dials, does this mean I can finally get my rev counter working by swapping those 2 wires

Hopefully yes. Its only one wire though that needs moving & joining with the wire from the ecu.

 

Graham, i'm a little confused from reading your post. Have you modified a standard 205 GTi clock so that it will work with the low voltage ECU tacho drive signal? or have you modified the loom so that you can fit a clock from another Pug/Citroen model?

Hmm, Neither.

 

I've used the plug from the 205 rev counter & fitted it to the rev counter from a late 405 with a Magnet Marreli ecu. All I have to do now is remove the rev counter from another set of clocks & using the facia from that rev counter attach it to the converted one so it fits in & looks standard. I think the only thing I'll have to do to fit it is widen the hole in the centre of the facia.

 

On one of the rev counters I got the needle can only be fitted in one place so that makes it easier.

 

Graham.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Done a bit more work on the swap recently, picture of finished item attached with 205 rev counter facia.

 

Not perfect but it'll work perfectly. I have to trim the back of the dial face down as it wouldn't sit low enough on the new inards for the centre pin to reach far enough through to get the needle on again so I drilled down the back of the old spacers until they were flush with the back & then had to re-drill the holes to attach it to the new clock.

 

First try & its fine.

 

We also re-soldered the connections as I had use of a better soldering iron than I have at home at work & we moved one connection as it had broken away so used a more secure connection this time round.

 

Graham.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

First (& only) problem, the pcb hits the plug when its all fitted back into the clocks binnacle so it won't fit fully home.

 

Some trimming required.

 

Graham.

[veloce200 3]

Stirling work Graham

 

I have my pug and a customers both without rev counters working (both with Emerald) - I'd be happy to buy the emerald adapters but the thing is I don't know which wires connect to which - none of the wires under the bonnet have numbers on and both cars are different - one early conv. coil and the other coil pack.

 

Graham in your investigations do you think you could tell me which wires would connect to where with the Emerald converter?

 

thanks very much (ps any luck with those pistons for the 405 head?

 

Julian

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Julian,

 

I haven't done any work on the Emerald but from what Ivan has said it is an easily done. (Dream Weaver has wired an Emerald adaptor into his Mi btw)

 

I woud've thought the ecu rpm feed wire will connect to the convertor & then the original loom wire (112) on the 205 to the convertor output, doesn't a wiring guide come with it?

 

pm sent re; pistons.

 

Graham.

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

I've just finished fitting one of these rev counters into a set of clocks for TT205 & thougth I'd post the finished results.

 

The rev counter was from a 106 Rallye & originally powered by a Magnet 8P ecu (afaik) & it works fine on mine with MP3.1 so I'm even more certain that it will work with Emerald, KMS & Motec etc. Basically any with a digital signal.

 

To clarify the wiring changes needed a little;

• The clock I used this time had a small four pin multi plug soldered into the circuit board which I removed after proviing it worked first.
  
• With the wires soldered onto the pcb correctly using this method there is no need to change any wiring on the car if the original rev counter plug is used & de-soldered from the old rev counter.
  
• The wire colours might differ depending on the year of your car but on mine (1990 phase 2) they were;
  

  
  

• Red wire on rev counter plug to white wire on 205 loom plug
  
  
• Blue wire on counter plug to green/yellow earth on 205 loom plug.
  
  
• Yellow wire to blue wire(112) on 205 loom.

  
  

• The ecu feed is connected to 112 where ever you choose. (Mine is done underneath the dash near the multi pugs inside the car iirc).
  

Any questions, post them & I'll try to help clarify any problems.

 

Graham.

[pugrallye 0]

fair cheaper than signal convertors eh graham? lol

did this a few years ago when my 205 first went onto an 8P based setup, and if you needed a durability test its still working perfectly now!! You should be able to scavange rev counter of any later model peugeot/citroen, mine came out of a saxo VTS and works perfectly on a recently completed Mi16 with coil packs, so your not limited to 205's/405's

Edited June 14, 2006 by pugrallye

[TT205 42]

did this a few years ago when my 205 first went onto an 8P based setup, and if you needed a durability test its still working perfectly now!!

 

Who mapped your 8P?

 

Cheers

 

Dave

[pugrallye 0]

The now defunct coventry peugeot specialists mapped my ecu

[TT205 42]

Thats who had built/rebuilt my original hill climb engine (of unknown spec as I bought it 2nd hand) - were they top notch/highly recommended?

 

Dave