Oil pressure gauge

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

Hello all!

Mine 309 gti ´87 has problem, when i turn ignition power on, oil pressure goes to end. I also tried to 

switch wires 30 and 30B  at  probes, but it was same issue again.

What may be the problem?

 

Second question; where is the oil temperature probe? At oil pan?

[PhilNW 44]

1 - Full gauge can mean it is shorted to earth or bad sensor 

 

2 - 

Try 

https://catalogs.ssg.asia/peugeot/?lang=en

 

Select
309 -

without parameters

without parameters

lubrication

oil filter gauge 

injection

Does it look like that?

[DamirGTI 342]

Oil temp. sender is on the sump , item No. 10 :

 

http://www.miamistu.co.uk/pug/GB/205F/0/03A20A.HTM

 

Mostly 16 dia. sender , unless it's an late Ph2 model , then it'll be 14 dia. .

 

D

 

 

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

14 hours ago, PhilNW said:

1 - Full gauge can mean it is shorted to earth or bad sensor 

 

2 - 

Try 

https://catalogs.ssg.asia/peugeot/?lang=en

 

Select
309 -

without parameters

without parameters

lubrication

oil filter gauge 

injection

Does it look like that?

Yes it looks like that. 

Oil pressure was full when ignition power on, but when engine is running, gauge goes to zero. But red light is not on.  It functions like vice versa.

Edited January 6, 2022 by Sumu

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

Looks like I have to check a bit more this issue. Any ideas? 

I removed wire from gauge and still oil pressure is full.

 

brown wire is 30B and violet is 30.

[PhilNW 44]

If I remember right

 

The sensor on the left is the low oil pressure switch (for the warning light)

The sensor on the right is the oil pressure sensor ( for the oil gauge)

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by PhilNW

[DamirGTI 342]

With a multimeter , test the brown wire for short to ground (twist/wiggle the wiring loom a bit as you do the testing) ... in fact , test both of them .

 

Both of those wires go directly from the instrument cluster to the sensors/senders , only mid way trough engine bay they should be on a connector/multiplug which is known to cause all kinds of problems from broken wire insulation , broken wire copper strands , badly oxidized connections and oxidized/blackened/rotten wire copper strands deep down under the insulation etc. .

 

Best to chop off OE multiplugs and join the wires together with some modern sealed connector blocks or directly by soldering and heat shrink tubing one by one  . 

 

Also , try to swap places of the two wires on the sensors/senders , and see what happens . But my main assumption is , short to ground somewhere from the instrument cluster to the wire ends .

 

D

 

 

Edited January 6, 2022 by DamirGTI

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

2 minutes ago, DamirGTI said:

With a multimeter , test the brown wire for short to ground ... in fact , test both of them .

 

Both of those wires go directly from the instrument cluster to the sensors/senders , only mid way trough engine bay they should be on a connector/multiplug which is known to cause all kinds of problems from broken wire insulation , wire copper strands , badly oxidized connections etc. . Best to chop off the OE multiplugs off and join the wires together with some modern sealed connector blocks or directly by soldering and heat shrink tubing . 

 

Also , try to swap places of the two wires on the sensors/senders , and see what happens . But my main assumption is , short to ground somewhere from the instrument cluster to the wire ends .

 

D

 

 

I¨ve tried swap those also, but no change on function. 

This featutre has been on this car so long I have owned it, but now there is a chance to fix it. (because of winter and snow there is plenty of time...)

Earlier owner told me that they had put wires wrongly while engine restoration, but that seems not to be true anymore...

[DamirGTI 342]

Yes , wire orientation on the sensors/senders seems fine based on the wire numbers . But , you never know , especially as you say if someone's been there before rewiring the loom .

 

Anyhow , should be easy to sort out ... need multimeter and wiring diagram and some patience .

 

Do you have wiring diagram for working on a 309 ? if not , i can send you entire 309 repair manual .

 

D

Edited January 6, 2022 by DamirGTI

[SRDT 182]

Here you have it in French and from 1991 cars, that's the best diagrams I know on the internet:

http://ddata.over-blog.com/4/23/45/11//Schemas-Electriques-309.pdf

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

1 hour ago, SRDT said:

Here you have it in French and from 1991 cars, that's the best diagrams I know on the internet:

http://ddata.over-blog.com/4/23/45/11//Schemas-Electriques-309.pdf

Tanks, I already have used this manual several times earlier. 

 

 

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

4 hours ago, DamirGTI said:

 

 

Do you have wiring diagram for working on a 309 ? if not , i can send you entire 309 repair manual .

 

Yes please.

[DamirGTI 342]

Made an upload of the 309 manual , download from here :

 

https://easyupload.io/cqd9hn

 

D

 

 

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

15 hours ago, DamirGTI said:

With a multimeter , test the brown wire for short to ground (twist/wiggle the wiring loom a bit as you do the testing) ... in fact , test both of them .

 

Both of those wires go directly from the instrument cluster to the sensors/senders , only mid way trough engine bay they should be on a connector/multiplug which is known to cause all kinds of problems from broken wire insulation , broken wire copper strands , badly oxidized connections and oxidized/blackened/rotten wire copper strands deep down under the insulation etc. .

 

Best to chop off OE multiplugs and join the wires together with some modern sealed connector blocks or directly by soldering and heat shrink tubing one by one  . 

 

Also , try to swap places of the two wires on the sensors/senders , and see what happens . But my main assumption is , short to ground somewhere from the instrument cluster to the wire ends .

 

D

 

 

Both wires have same voltage, 11,2V when from battery it is 12,1V.  I think this loss is quite normal in old Peugeots...

[PhilNW 44]

Couple of questions

The oil pressure warning light goes out when engine running?

From the picture are there two terminals on the back of the oil gauge sensor?

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

33 minutes ago, PhilNW said:

Couple of questions

The oil pressure warning light goes out when engine running?

From the picture are there two terminals on the back of the oil gauge sensor?

1. Yes, warning light goes off when engine running.

 

2. No, it´s just an optical illusion. Only one terminal

[DamirGTI 342]

3 hours ago, Sumu said:

Both wires have same voltage, 11,2V when from battery it is 12,1V.  I think this loss is quite normal in old Peugeots...

 

Not the voltage test - need to perform continuity test .

 

Sensors/senders are 1pin type , thus with the ignition switched ON live +12V goes trough the wire and earth is trough the sensor/sender itself .

 

Switch mulitimeter on continuity/buzzer (speaker) , then put one probe on the wire terminal end and poke engine or chassis earth with another probe = if there's continuity or buzzer/speaker starts beeping you've found the problem ... ie. active short to ground but not trough the sensor/sender but somewhere in the loom touching engine/chassis earth or cross connection chuffed insulation 12V wires with an earth wire .

 

D

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

2 hours ago, DamirGTI said:

 

Not the voltage test - need to perform continuity test .

 

Sensors/senders are 1pin type , thus with the ignition switched ON live +12V goes trough the wire and earth is trough the sensor/sender itself .

 

Switch mulitimeter on continuity/buzzer (speaker) , then put one probe on the wire terminal end and poke engine or chassis earth with another probe = if there's continuity or buzzer/speaker starts beeping you've found the problem ... ie. active short to ground but not trough the sensor/sender but somewhere in the loom touching engine/chassis earth or cross connection chuffed insulation 12V wires with an earth wire .

 

D

Yes, I'm on it. I do not have had time for it for now. Just quick checks.

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

resistance between wire 30 and ground is about 57ohms. Same with 30B and ground, looks like exaxtly same resistance.

Resistance between wires 30 and 30B is changing all the time. Not exact reading possible. When measured, value increases from 1 ohm.

 

[Sumu 2 1 Cars]

Removed tape from wires. There was damage and contact between. Now works fine