A little movie of my stalling engine

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

Se movie, after about 1 min the idle gets rough and finally it stalls?

 

engine is rebuild, have started it 10 time so far and it does this every time.

 

any ideas?

 

 

Edited July 28, 2018 by HelmutGTI

[Richie-Van-GTi 72 2 Cars]

needs setting up properly, right from the start the timing sounds slightly off and its running lumpy.

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

If it is properly rebuilt eg new piston rings then letting it sit and idle will do it no good at all. It needs to be driven at varying speeds and loads to bed the rings in. Keep idling it they will not bed in properly and you will end up with an engine that smokes and uses oil.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

15 minutes ago, Tom Fenton said:

If it is properly rebuilt eg new piston rings then letting it sit and idle will do it no good at all. It needs to be driven at varying speeds and loads to bed the rings in. Keep idling it they will not bed in properly and you will end up with an engine that smokes and uses oil.

Yes I know, but before I can even drive it it has to work and not cut out after 1 minute.

[davev 1]

It's been a while since I've heard a 1.9 but my first impression is it sounds rough. 

I'd start with the essentials and double check cam timing and valve clearance, then move to ign timing. after you can set up the tps and check your inlet and breather system ect, inc the sad unit.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

4 hours ago, davev said:

It's been a while since I've heard a 1.9 but my first impression is it sounds rough. 

I'd start with the essentials and double check cam timing and valve clearance, then move to ign timing. after you can set up the tps and check your inlet and breather system ect, inc the sad unit.

Thanx I will, it’s a cat model som perhaps it could be the lambda sensor.

[Thijs_Rallye 87 4 Cars]

3 hours ago, HelmutGTI said:

Thanx I will, it’s a cat model som perhaps it could be the lambda sensor.

Good to know it is a cat model. Maybe you've switched the connectors at the sensor? Should trigger the CEL light normally, but I can't see it in the video.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

1 hour ago, Thijs_Rallye said:

Good to know it is a cat model. Maybe you've switched the connectors at the sensor? Should trigger the CEL light normally, but I can't see it in the video.

No I haven’t they are colour matched, started the car again today. Works and revs like a charm until it’s get hot. I have montronic injection so not able to set any ignition timing. The ECU sort that out for me.

I think it’s either the ATF, SAD or the lambda sensor. I have tried another temp sensor without result. A new lambda sensor is bougt to try 

[DamirGTI 342]

What i would try :

 

Coil (square coils are prone to failing)

Ignition amp. (try with some known good spare , and add heat sink grease)

Fuel pump (if the car stood for longer periods , stale fuel will damage the pump .. or it's simply gone bad cos the age of use) .. Noticed slightly longer cranking to start , Motronic 205 usually starts on faster .

 

It's like cutting off the fuel or the spark .

 

Sound kinda strange like running on 3 cylinders ?!

 

D

[Thijs_Rallye 87 4 Cars]

8 hours ago, DamirGTI said:



 

Sound kinda strange like running on 3 cylinders ?! 

 

 

I agree it sounds like that.

@HelmutGTI, just to cover the basics but have you double checked your cam timing? Has the head been skimmed much?

 

Can you post a movie when is it running and revving with a cold engine to have a reference to the other movie?

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

2 hours ago, Thijs_Rallye said:

 

I agree it sounds like that.

@HelmutGTI, just to cover the basics but have you double checked your cam timing? Has the head been skimmed much?

 

Can you post a movie when is it running and revving with a cold engine to have a reference to the other movie?

You are right, it indeed running on 3 cylinders.  checked the sparks, cyl no2 spark plug was still brand new.

 

It was wet, and had a good spark so it gets fuel and current.

just to be sure I 

started the engine again, pulled the spark plug wire on cyl 2, the engine didn’t make any changes so def not fireing on that cyl.

 

I gonna re check my cam timing, is that the most plausible error. I will also check the compression on each cyl. 

[Thijs_Rallye 87 4 Cars]

If it is wet is isn't firing properly. Do you have a spare spark plug cable which you can use to test? Considering your last post I'd try that before checking the timing.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

Okej! Checked my compressions 11,2 on each cyl so that’s good

The spark on the spark plug on cyl 2 isn’t blue, it’s realy big and yellow and also quite flimsy. The others have smaller blue more still sparks. Swapped spark no 1 and 2 but still no fire at cyl 2. So it could be the spark plug cable or the dizzy? 

[Thijs_Rallye 87 4 Cars]

3 hours ago, Thijs_Rallye said:

If it is wet is isn't firing properly. Do you have a spare spark plug cable which you can use to test? Considering your last post I'd try that before checking the timing.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

16 minutes ago, Thijs_Rallye said:

Yea I will try that, unfortunately I don’t have a spare cable. Now I’m off for semester for a week, but will try in next weekend.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

Ok I’ve tried another spark cable with no result. And I noticed it’s not even fireing on 3 cylinder but just 2. Cylinder 2-3 are not fireing. Both sparks are wet with fuel after a run.

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

Ok! Tryed new dizzy cap and rotor arm, new coil and ignition amp with no result.

still same result. Running rough with a clear smell of fuel.

 

 

i then manage to ruin my new gas filter when trying to tighten the bolt, so this evenings trial and error came to a abrupt stop.

 

I then read here about air leaks after the AFM and that it can come from the bolt in the manifold where you fit the oil filler cap.

My oil filler cap is not bolted to the manifold at all (sorry but I’m dumb) it just hanging loose.

I noticed fumes exits thrue the bolt hole from the manifold when engine cut out.

 

could this be the reason? Have to buy a new gas filter tomorrow and test. Feel exited.

[Richie-Van-GTi 72 2 Cars]

Air leak on the manifold will cause a lumpy running car but unlikely to be local to 2 cylinders consistently. If swapping leads and plugs around does not cause the misfire to change cylinders then try swapping injectors around. if it still stays at 2 and 3 then either the distributor is faulty or you have a mechanical issue on cylinders 2 and 3, possibly leaking betwen the 2. Can you perform a leak down test rather than  a compression test?

[HelmutGTI 5 1 Cars]

Whoop!!! Solved it!! 

 

Ok if anybody has similar problem I had here’s how I solved it.

 

I don’t think there was one thing, but more of a mix of small fault causing my engine to go lumpy, smoke as a chimney and cut out after a minute.

 

First the engine wasn’t firing properly on all 4 cylinders. To be sure a changed coil, coil amp, dizzy cap, rotor arm, spark cables and new ngk sparks again.

cleaned my injectors with carb cleaner and changed seals on em.

Re checked my timing re checked compression with all 4 spark plugs out and full throttle, 13 bar on each cylinder.

 

Boom no it was running on all 4 but still really lumpy and smokie. Turns out I disnt plug the screw hole in the manifold that bolts the oil filler cap... rookie?! 

 

Now the engine didn’t cut out on idle but still was smoking and a bit rough, engine (k) lamp started after a minute or two. I had bought a new lambda sensor which I thought I would return but figured I’ll try that to.

after wrestling with lots of heat and fire to unscrew the old lambda I installed a brand new shiny one. 

Started the engine and tada, now it reeved smooth no smoke and quite. Just as a new build engine should.

 

Regarding my lambda sensor, I think it was killed after extremely rich running when the engine was running rough. Or it was bad from the beginning?

I bought the car which a non functional engine after all.

 

thanks for all help, 

Edited August 17, 2018 by HelmutGTI

[jackherer 543]

Thanks for updating the thread.

 

4 hours ago, HelmutGTI said:

I don’t think there was one thing, but more of a mix of small fault

The hardest to find problems often turn out to be more than one thing at fault in my experience. That's what makes them hard to pin down, the fault doesn't respond to changes you make in predictable ways.

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

On ‎8‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 6:02 PM, HelmutGTI said:

Turns out I disnt plug the screw hole in the manifold that bolts the oil filler cap... rookie?! 

Lol this made me smile- a couple of years ago I had a fault with a 8V constantly running at 3000rpm- was going out my mind as I couldn't fix it- Jackherer mentions this same bolt - and yep it was loose