Horn wont work !

[DamirGTI 342]

As usual , MOT time and the bloody horn stopped working !!

 

Earth is fine , checked .. all fuses are good ..  but theres simply no power supply from the stalk when pressing the button ..

Tried 5 spare stalks - still nothing .. theres simply no voltage via wire No 24 which per the wiring diagram triggers/activates the horn positive ..

Pulled an length of wire directly from the horn positive terminal and when i touch any of the live wires - it works .. but simply does not work not even when i connect it directly on the stalk terminal of the said wire No 24 bypassing the fuse box ..

 

It's an Ph1 car with electric horn . And everything else electrical and stalk controlled works just fine .

 

Confused

 

Any ideas ?!?

Can it be something burnt inside the fuse box ?

 

 

D

[sp_en_ny 17 1 Cars]

I had the same/similar thing with my phase 2 cti. Along with the horn the cigarette lighter and electric roof also stopped working. 

 

Changed the fuse board and hey presto not had any issues since. 

[DamirGTI 342]

Righto !

 

I did actually seen/heard some sparking on the fuse board , had to replace the stalk cos the main beam didn't work , and by unplugging the stalk something sparked in the fuse board .. but none of the fuses hasn't blown .. and then the horn stopped working .

 

Will dig my spare fuse board from the shed ..

 

Thanks !

 

D

[sp_en_ny 17 1 Cars]

Check if the cig lighter is working, pretty sure they both run from the same part of the fuse board. If it's not working prob same fault as I had. A friend also had the exact same problem. Starts of intermittent and just gets worse. 

[DamirGTI 342]

Now that's interesting - the cig lighter does work !

 

D

[sp_en_ny 17 1 Cars]

If you got a spare fuse board would still try that, not a big job to swap over. If you still got same prob then i would be out of ideas and beyond my know how. 

[jackherer 543]

The fuse layout changes over the years, I posted these tables from the Haynes manual the other day -

 

[DamirGTI 342]

I do have a few spare fuse boxes form 205 and 309 ... will try an known good one later .

For now , i wired up an manual horn switch as i need it MOT-d asap , really can't wait ...

 

Kieran , yes i got fuse amperage all arranged per the car manufacturing year  , and it's been like that for last 15 years ! but thanks anyway

 

Must be the fuse box me thinks also .. as i've tried all kind of stuff but nothing really worked , and 5 stalks can't all be faulty (they do work on my other 205-s) ...  the fact is - something did spark up around/inside the 25 amp fuse slot No 8 when i unclipped and removed the stalk .. but it didn't fry the fuse , so bound to be something inside the fuse box then .

 

Thanks !

 

D

[jackherer 543]

I wasn't pointing out the fuse values, I meant the cigar lighter etc. is on a different circuit depending on age which might explain why yours works and Spencer's didn't.

 

When you fix it take the old fuse box apart and let us know what you find. They're generally pretty reliable but as they get older we might see more problems with them.

[DamirGTI 342]

I see .. make sense yes ! 

 

Mine is originally Ph1 1.6 , and had old style dash .. which i replaced some 10 years ago with the Ph2 dash and rewired all the switches from Ph1 to Ph2 obviously , so i might even connected the cig lighter on some other wiring circuit can't remember ..

 

Have really zero spare time now to play with this , and need the car as an daily drive more than ever , but when i find some spare time to try out the spare fuse board will update this thread with what happened in the end !

 

One more thing , i have an mint condition stalk from Ph1 405 , it connects just fine on 205 loom , lights works with flashing beams etc. - but it just wont trigger the indicators .. any ideas why and "how to" make it work with the 205 indicators ?!

 

D

[Gohn 68]

I've just been thru the exact same scenario so thought it may be worth adding to this for others

 

my horn began playing up a while ago, it was intermittent and would not work sometimes

so a few months ago, I went thru and checked my fuses, changed the horn and checked the single wire horn earth behind LF headlight

I always keep my earth clusters really clean and corrosion free but checked them just in case also

the horn then worked for a bit

but it was just a false positive, because soon after it started playing up again

and then more recently totally died, not a peep

so back I go and check in order:

fuses, all good

fuseboard relay, swapped with spare, also good

horn, swapped with spare and then ran direct line from battery, works great

hmmm

checked that I was getting good signal from fuseboard to horn thru the power line, yes

then checked that was getting good signal from indicator stalk/steer column to fuseboard, also yes

so wire loom good

horn good

fuses good

all connections good

still no horn

at this point figured it must be the horn/indicator stalk,

tried two spares and still no horn

cant be three stalks are stuffed so the only other thing it could be was already suggested above

so I take out every plug from the fuseboard and put every plug back into a spare fuseboard I thought I'd never EVER need

connected up and bbrrrrruuuuup, HORN !

 

thanks to the original posters above

 

didn't seem to be any way of taking the old dud fuseboard apart for inspection or repair either

[welshpug 1,657]

there is always a way to dissasemble things...

[SRDT 175]

If you check the fuseboard with a continuity tester it may looks okay and can even light the LED of a usb charger on the cig lighter but as soon as you try it with real power then it dies.

And not only that but if you wait for a while it can revert to it's seemingly working state!

 

Fortunately there is a way to repair the fuseboard:

Remove it from the car, flip it over, remove the black cover and get your soldering iron with some tin.

The defective solder joint is hidden between the two plates of the fuseboard, it's on the bottom connector of the rear defroster relay (or electric roof on a cab):

Unlike me for this test there is no need to make a hole, slide the tin between the plates from the side and put the soldering iron on the top.

 

With this fix the fuseboard is as good as new. A spare fusebox on the other hand can last for years... or for a week ; and that's if you can find a GTI one.

[DamirGTI 342]

Shame on me i haven't done anything about this since then ! still have the horn wired via separate switch , very rarely use it thus i kinda forgotten about it .

 

That damaged area is in between the two layers of the fusebox right ? as i seem to remember not finding any damage with just the bottom fusebox cover removed .

 

D

[SRDT 175]

Yes it's a cold solder joint but it's hidden unless you dig a hole like I did.

It seems that this particular circuit is the only one to be on both layers and that put more mechanical stress on the solder joint.

After fixing my fusebox I was wondering if any other weak joints would pop up but it's really the only one that fail.

[Gohn 68]

genius !

bloody genius, thanks

 

hate throwing things away

recovered my fuseboard from the bin

soldered it as you suggest, and then flipped the board and soldered with the iron on the bottom too to try make sure I got enough on it

you can see the before and after pics

is there some way of testing if its worked before putting it back in ? some kind of simple quick and easy bench test ?

(or do I have to take a couple of hours like last time unplugging the current fuseboard and plugging in the fixed one and pushing on the horn ? )

[Gohn 68]

Figured you'd already ruled out the simple continuity test previously

so went ahead unplugged the spare fuseboard and put the fixed fuseboard back in the car

all connected up (even put some diametric grease on the plugs) and the horn works great

 

so happy bout it I soldered the spare fuseboard in case the one in my other car goes on the blink

 

thanks damir, baptiste, and all above

[Ozymandis 97]

3 hours ago, Gohn said:

diametric

Dielectric

[SRDT 175]

I used a bigger soldering iron but you should be fine.

First I tried to solder it inside the car but it only worked for a week and it's not really practical to do it upside down anyway.

[stumpyjag 6]

Mot on Thursday and exactly as above no horn, followed the re soldering guide and sorted. Saved me hours of chasing my ass thanks to all above. 

[engine killer 6]

hi all, is there any guide how to remove the fuse box?

 

my horn is not quite working as you mentioned. 

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

1 hour ago, engine killer said:

hi all, is there any guide how to remove the fuse box?

 

my horn is not quite working as you mentioned. 

It'll be in the haynes manual but it's pretty obvious / simple really.

 

Basically, disconnect the battery, gain access to the fuse box, the fuse box is just a push / clip fit into the dash as you can see in the picture below.

 

 

Carefully pull the fusebox towards you & the ball joints will pop out of their fixings to give you a bit more room to disconnect all the plugs.

 

They are all keyed so you shouldn't be able to mix up any of the locations.

 

IIRC there is usually a small dot of paint next to each slot of the plug colour that fits into that slot.

 

g

[engine killer 6]

48 minutes ago, pug_ham said:

It'll be in the haynes manual but it's pretty obvious / simple really.

 

Basically, disconnect the battery, gain access to the fuse box, the fuse box is just a push / clip fit into the dash as you can see in the picture below.

 

 

Carefully pull the fusebox towards you & the ball joints will pop out of their fixings to give you a bit more room to disconnect all the plugs.

 

They are all keyed so you shouldn't be able to mix up any of the locations.

 

IIRC there is usually a small dot of paint next to each slot of the plug colour that fits into that slot.

 

g

thanks, sorry i couldn't find it in my haynes manual.

 

anyway as you said pull it toward myself and disconnect all plugs as you have them labeled in the picture and i assume there is no need to disconnect the relays and fuses.  anything else connected to the fuse box may i ask?

 

thanks a million again.

 

 

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

8 hours ago, engine killer said:

i assume there is no need to disconnect the relays and fuses.  anything else connected to the fuse box may i ask?

No, the relays & fuses can stay in place & there isn't anything else connected to the fuse box to prevent you removing it.

 

g