Yet another XU9/10 engine build

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Righto. Thanks for the advice. The one Spoox have on eBay is a brand new Quaife which is in an auction. No idea why as they also have brand new ones on their website at much more than the bid figure ( so far, but bidding continues until Sunday)

 

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

You will also need a pair of diff bearings. Don’t be ripped off they are a readily available taper roller bearing!

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Hi. Got a set of those as part of my box rebuild kit. SKF ones . The ATB on eBay is proving very popular. Bother 

[jackherer 543]

They've always been very popular second hand, the only times I've ever got good deals on used Quaifes have been when they come with a car.

[petert 586]

I'm selling one. $1750, inc an XSi. 

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

A very good price but I suspect the shipping costs might put the price up a bit!!!! . I will keep my eyes open for one at a good price, but I suspect that , as others have said , such items are few and far between . The only good thing is that the diff is relatively easy to change in situ so  if the bits that are coming to me free of charge will do the job in the short term, I could use what I have until finances allow(!)  a new one 

[jamie_1992 66 1 Cars]

Where did you get a gearbox rebuild kit? 

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Afternoon, 

The kit was from a company called ‘gearbox parts online ‘ item number 112083468487. Cost was £99.99 and is a comprehensive kit of bearings and seals . There is a ‘however’ . The taper roller bearings were manufactured by SNR . Not a problem in itself but they are subtlety different to the SKF ones that I had to get from ‘simply bearings’ to replace them ( well, one of them) . By the way, these taper bearings are 32005x/Q . The reason for the replacement is that the SNR bearings have a slight recess in the tear of the inner track that butts up against the 3/4 gear collar . I found that this recess allowed the bearing to be pressed ( driven ) very slightly further backwards towards the gear cluster to the extent that the remaining part of the flat face of the inner race was fouling the gear cluster preventing it from rotating cleanly . Every picture tells a story, so picture to illustrate below.

Having said all this, the kit of parts is still good value. For the cost of one extra taper roller at £10.81 , I would use them again .

SNR on the right, SKF on the left 

[xy8 4]

Sticky?

I had same problem  years ago , luckily discovered it before gearbox was installed. 

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Worse than sticky. The 3/4 gear cluster could not rotate . I discovered it after I had drifted the bearing home and tried to select 3rd and 4th by sliding the synchroniser hub. Third was fine but  forth would not engage. It took me a few. Moments to discover the reason . Then I had to remove my newly drifted into place bearing to investigate . Clearly the chamfer/recess  on the SNR bearing  is the problem as the replacement SKF  works fine . Odd that the manufacturers are clearly not aware of this difficulty .

Andy

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Update. I got in touch with ‘gearbox parts online’ and advised them of the problem. One of their technical staff called me back a couple of hours later and explained that they had sent one of the bearingsin error. That is, they had sent two identical bearings for the input ( first motion shaft) when in fact the two, though dimensionally identical , should have been different, one of them not having the recess . They have reimbursed me the cost of the replacement I got from elsewhere. 

Excellent service from them. They thanked me for the contact and said they would check all the be3/4 kits that they had packed to ensure the same error was not repeated .

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

Fair play to them wanting to get it right. Lots of places wouldn't give a toss.

[welshpug 1,657]

thats odd, I think all the kits I have used were SNR bearings without any issues with them, both input shaft bearings identical.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

It is odd. The SKF bearings are are not an issue because they do not have the recess, but it looks as if the SNR ones do, depending upon the part number . Anyway. Sorted .

 On the diff front, a friend very kindly sent me some spare sun and planet gears and a spare BE4 diff. The BE4 one looks much more substantial . The gear teeth roots are a good 2mm thicker and the diff casing is significantly more substantial. I wonder if anyone has experience of these diffs compared to the be3 ones.  Having  said all this. I am still hanging my nose over an ATB one 

[dcc 855]

Issue with the be4 is the be3 205 inner cv splines are too deep and need to use either be4/306/xsara shaft inner cv or cut splines down

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Ah. I did not know that. Thank you. And just when I thought things were going well. 

[welshpug 1,657]

if its an lsd or atb they use the old full spline BE1/3 pattern so its not a problem.

 

can you put up a picture of this groove you mention? as I've never seen it.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Pause on the gearbox whilst  I (a) find an ATB diff which is not too expensive and (b) the gearbox bolts come back from the platers so back to the engine, or more specifically the cam cover. I used some JB weld to fix a threaded filler in place and have just got round to giving the cover a coat of etch primer. I will need to sand off the primer from the ‘16v logo and the raised parallel rails , then top coat, then sand the above again and then clear lacquer , but as the air is now a little warmer, that will be a quick job. The engine is paused as the liners I ordered just before Christmas still have not been made, neither has the machining work on the head been completed . I should not have told the machine shop that ‘I was in no rush’ 

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Update on the ATB diff. I think I may have managed a deal for an ATB supplied by Rally design made by Blackline . Only snag is that to get a good deal, I have to buy several, so I may have a brand new ATB available at a decent price !!

 

[welshpug 1,657]

who???

[welshpug 1,657]

well I found them for sale at Motorsport tools, just about £600, a totally unknown brand, I;d save the little bit extra for a Quaife or a 3j tbh.

[welshpug 1,657]

actually I found some advertised at a local supplier Godspeed motorsport for £435.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Blackline-Peugeort-205-Be3-Be4-5-Helical-LSD-Differential-Limited-Slip-Diff-ATB/6015252289?thm=1000

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

 Been in touch with Godspeed. Out of stock for the moment but they forgot to update the eBay site . They do not know when they are likely to get more , so back to Rallydesign ( big into Fords are Rallydesign) or Quaife at the eye watering £700 . Rallydesign will do several at a good price but that leaves me with the challenge of selling one on for at least £450 

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

I gave up on ‘other’ ATB diffs. Quaife should arrive this week. Then all I will need is all the box bolts back from the platers, and I will be able to reassemble the box. In the meantime, I found some red paint and lacquer , tart that I am . Results below. 

On the engine front, solid lifters on their way . The 85mm liners have arrived at the machine shop, but I suspect that my place in the queue is now in double digits .

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Plated gearbox bolts collected today, so I could begin to make a bit of progress on reassembly. First job was to set the preload on the taper bearings of the first motion ( input) shaft. The book suggests that the depth of the bearing in that case should be measured with a depth gauge, ditto the protrusion of the front face of the three bolt housing and then allow 0.03 mm to add preload. Well, when I tried to measure the depth of the bearing in the casing, I got very inconsistent measurements . Plan ‘b’ was to install the shim and the housing, and then gently tighten the three bolts until the input shaft had no sideways movement , no up and down  and the bearing was just beginning to drag. Then, with feeler gauges , measure the gap between the housing face and the garrbox case and use that to sort out the shim thickness . 

That job done, and shim sourced from Peugeot, and more progress tomorrow I hope .