Wheel Alignment

[dynacord 6 1 Cars]

Well, I'm having issues with my jap crap, numerous alignments have been done, toe is in spec, wheels have been rotated gazillion times - the car continues to pull slightly to the right (Honda Accord Tourer).

There is some mystery with the rear suspension (probably sagged rear right spring, not had any time to check) right rear camber is about -2 degrees, left is within spec (around 1.4 or so).

From what I've searched, the rear alignment cannot make the car pulling to one side; front cross-camber and cross-caster would be the most pronounced reasons - pulling to the side with least negative camber or the side that has the least (negative) caster (not sure if the last alignment machine showed these values).

I'm totally lost what to do next. Front brakes are new, so it's not a sticking caliper or piston. All front bushes are poly (relatively new). I guess the car is very road-camber sensitive, not an experience I've had with my Pugs.

I drive this car mainly on the highway and it becomes annoying to keep holding the wheel to go straight.

any advise is appreciated

Edited December 5, 2016 by dynacord

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

I'd say something is worn out, I'd go through all the suspension mountings, dampers, hubs, and rack to look for any wear/play/slop in anything. A quick wobble and visual isn't good enough here, check everything thoroughly. I wouldn't rule out the poly bushes either as sometimes they can cause issues.

 

You say the front is 'in spec', where is it? What's your rear toe? Is the rack centred?

How many different garages has it been too? A lot haven't a clue on how to even set the tracking never mind fully aligning a car.

[j_turnell 137 3 Cars]

Did you get a print out with all figures? As Allan suggests I'd check for any play in the rack or suspension and also check tyre pressures first off.

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

Sort the rear spring issue first. Cross car corner weights will all be way out if there's a problem which won't help.

[j_turnell 137 3 Cars]

Not sure if this has a beam axle or control arms with eccentrics? I remember s2000 certainly have eccentrics. The rear camber may just need adjustment rather than a spring issue. Does the car require the boot or front seats loading? As this can have a big effect on figures if it does and this wasn't done during the alignment. Mercs and BMW's are particularly sensitive to this.

[dynacord 6 1 Cars]

The machine is Hunter (high quality, laser). My bet would be that the castor difference makes the car pulling to the right (also in our country roads are cambered right, in the UK I think most are cambered left). Here are the values

Camber

Front Left Front Right

-0°13' -0°29'

Difference: 0°16' (allowed +-0°45')

Rear Left Rear Right

-1°45' -2°13'

Difference: 0°28' (allowed +-0°30')

Castor

Front Left Front Right

2°58' 2°18'

Total diff: 0°40' (allowed by specs +-0°45')

Toe

Front Left Front Right

0°02' -0°05'

Difference: -0°03' (allowed +-0°09')

Rear Left Rear Right

0°05' -0°02'

Difference 0°03' (allowed +-0°09')

The rear sits level on both sides, so not sure if the rear spring has started sagging, but the difference in camber is huge.

These Hondas don't cave camber/caster adjustment (no eccentrics like on S2000, only front and rear toe).

[j_turnell 137 3 Cars]

How is rear toe adjusted? Can you only change total toe on the back? I'd be more worried about the front castor rather than the half degree difference in rear camber, castor figure seems a bit low also. Is it an old car, does it not have PAS? In terms of toe the whole car is pointing to the right also, your thrust angle is out, only marginally but the setup could be improved.

 

You want slightly more castor and camber on the side closest to the gutter as this will help keep the car straight due to the crown on the road. Assuming you drive on the right, this won't be helping having the castor the other way around, getting on for 3/4 deg difference.

[And 15 1 Cars]

Looking at that it just wants set up correctly and more even side to side and also front tracking looks to be set to compensate for the rear, rear tracking should always be set first if adjustable.

[dynacord 6 1 Cars]

I'm not sure if rear tracking will have such strong effect, like pulling to one side. I think it will wear out tires very fast, but there aren't any issues.

Silly thing is, factory castor spec is just 3°15', with PAS. A 306 GTI has more than that, Subaru Outback from the same year is about 5.5 or 6 degrees, different suspension though.

So, front right is about a full degree off. There is a Superpro eccentric poly bush which adds about half a degree castor, which won't bring it back to factory spec, but should even the difference (left-right).