Diesel Fuel In A Petrol Car

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

I'm looking at a car for a bit of a winter project/something to pick away at, and probably punt.

 

The owner say's he thinks the HG is away, and this is probably reflected in the price.

 

 

However, a mechanic has already been to view the car and seemed to think it was either a piston ring or possibly that the guys wife had put diesel in instead of petrol.

 

It starts, runs very rough before dying, and there is smoke out the back, and the fuel gauge reads about 1/4.

 

 

I'm gonna go see the car tomorrow night hopefully. Is there anything/anyway I can narrow down the problem? or anything I should look out for to get a better idea if it's HG, rings, or fuel? (whilst trying to get a bargain!)

[calvinhorse 870]

Usual HG checks like Mayonnaise under the water and oil caps, are the pipes pressuring up etc etc

 

Diesel in petrol, easiest way to check is stick your nose in the filler neck, you'll soon tell.

 

Diesel can knacker the fuel pump and fowl the plugs upbut other than that it's a tank flush, new filter and away you go!

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Great, thanks Calvin.

 

So, if all the above looked ok, would it would point to rings/compression test?, would dodgy piston rings stop it ticking over?

[dcc 855]

Open fuel filler and offer a flame, if it explodes its full of petrol, if it doesnt its full of diesel

[calvinhorse 870]

Tell tale sign of piston rings being damaged is oil stinking of petrol but I'd do a compression test like you say.

 

Dan you're absolutely off your rocker M9

[Lukespeed 10]

Test compression with the engine hot, mine all read similar cold, but once hot there was a 70psi difference

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

I'll not be able to do a compression test on a car i'm only viewing.

 

Am I right in thinking, if rings were the problem, it would probably still tick over ok?

 

The seller say's the car doesn't idle, he say's it starts, coughs, splutters, and cut's out, with smoke out the back..... he never said what colour of smoke.

[GLPoomobile 958]

I'll not be able to do a compression test on a car i'm only viewing.

 

 

 

Well that depends how agreeable the seller is. First time I ever did a compression test was on a 205 I was viewing (and bought). You never know, if it gives you an answer but you decide not to buy it, the seller may be grateful to have got some free advice on the problem.

[toolie72 67 1 Cars]

What kind of a motor you looking at-maybe google common faults if it's a type of car you're not up on

Mind you google will probably tell you it's got a brain tumour!!

[calvinhorse 870]

Well that depends how agreeable the seller is. First time I ever did a compression test was on a 205 I was viewing (and bought). You never know, if it gives you an answer but you decide not to buy it, the seller may be grateful to have got some free advice on the problem.

And if he doesn't let you I'd say he's hiding something

[Anthony 1,003]

And if he doesn't let you I'd say he's hiding something

Or doesn't want someone who they don't know and have no idea of their competence (or lack thereof) start to dismantle their engine, potentially causing further issues.

[calvinhorse 870]

Fair point

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Or doesn't want someone who they don't know and have no idea of their competence (or lack thereof) start to dismantle their engine, potentially causing further issues.

Yeah, I wouldn't be doing cartwheels if someone arrived with a socket set to view any car I was selling.

[calvinhorse 870]

You can always ask, I'm sure you're capable of changing spark plugs

[And 15 1 Cars]

Water in fuel can give what you discribe a I had it not long a go with a micra ones were the filler neck corroded and let's rain water in, it did fire but sorted of started to rev but missing before cutting out but would restart again and do the same it smoked badly to.

Edited October 31, 2016 by And

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

You can always ask, I'm sure you're capable of changing spark plugs

I don't really want to ask, as I said a duff HG is reflected in the price. I think sniffing the tank like you said is a good shout, and I'll check expansion tank, oil filler, dipstick, for Mayo. I doubt it will run long enough to check for pipework pressurising.

 

Regarding rings, it should idle ok even if they were worn?, so if it doesn't idle it's unlikely to be them that's causing the issue?

 

I got the impression this isn't a problem that's gradually got worse over time, more like something that's recently happened when the guys wife was driving it.

 

What colour would the reek be if it was diesel in the tank?

 

Another thing I can think of that may have happened is its had a duff timing belt tensioner and it's jumped the timing.

[GLPoomobile 958]

Yeah, I wouldn't be doing cartwheels if someone arrived with a socket set to view any car I was selling.

 

It's all a matter of context though isn't it? I wouldn't be happy either, if the car I was selling was in good working order and/or modern and complex. On the other hand, if I was selling something that was already f***ed and the potential buyer could convince me of their competence and just wanted to do some fairly basic testing, I just might entertain the suggestion with me supervising.

 

You may assume the seller will be precious about it and may take offence, just as they may assume you are a further risk to their property. Until you ask, neither of you will know. You don't ask, you don't get.

 

EDIT: However, Anthony does have a fair point as there is always the risk you could cause further issues. Even if you didn't, the law of sod means something else goes wrong and you get the blame.

Edited November 1, 2016 by GLPoomobile

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

GLP, the guy might be happy enough for me to do a compression test. I have a kit etc and could do it no bother. However the car is priced on a duff HG and I talked another slice off it when I spoke to him, but I wouldn't like him getting any ideas if a compression test had good results.

[GLPoomobile 958]

GLP, the guy might be happy enough for me to do a compression test. I have a kit etc and could do it no bother. However the car is priced on a duff HG and I talked another slice off it when I spoke to him, but I wouldn't like him getting any ideas if a compression test had good results.

 

Good shout. Vert tactical. I suppose if you are dead set on buying regardless it's pretty irrelevant. You'll find out the true extent of the problem once you have your mits on it.

[lagonda 42]

If I was the owner and agreed to compression tests, I would most definitely be looking over your shoulder. After all, I've been honest enough to fess up the car has a problem, and offered the car at a reduced price. If those tests indicate the compressions are in fact OK, I'd certainly be reconsidering the price of the car. Also bear in mind my CTi had all the symptoms of blown head gasket, yet the compressions were fine every time I checked. Eventually the head gasket did actually blow....but the original problem proved to be cracks in the cylinder head....which of course conveniently closed up each time I used a compression tester.

 

So your tests could prove fine but you infact have an even more expensive fix.

 

On balance I'd drive a hard bargain, enough to cover worst eventuality, and hope for a better outcome on dismantling. At the end of the day, if you're not happy with his lowest price, walk away and leave him your phone number. Doesn't sound like he's getting much other interest.

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

If I was the owner and agreed to compression tests, I would most definitely be looking over your shoulder. After all, I've been honest enough to fess up the car has a problem, and offered the car at a reduced price. If those tests indicate the compressions are in fact OK, I'd certainly be reconsidering the price of the car. Also bear in mind my CTi had all the symptoms of blown head gasket, yet the compressions were fine every time I checked. Eventually the head gasket did actually blow....but the original problem proved to be cracks in the cylinder head....which of course conveniently closed up each time I used a compression tester.

 

So your tests could prove fine but you infact have an even more expensive fix.

 

On balance I'd drive a hard bargain, enough to cover worst eventuality, and hope for a better outcome on dismantling. At the end of the day, if you're not happy with his lowest price, walk away and leave him your phone number. Doesn't sound like he's getting much other interest.

Agreed, although I don't think there is any getting away that it doesn't tick over. I think worse case is a replacement engine job and if the rest of the car is ok I think a complete engine change is probably already in the price.

 

I've still to see it in the flesh, so there maybe be other issues that he might or might not want to discount, obviously issues will probably have costs/parts associated with them, but i'd say it's probably worth the money even as a breaker.....not sure i'd want that hassle though.

 

I spoke to a mechanic this morning, he say's if it's got the wrong fuel in it to put a lottery ticket on! it's highly unlikely.

 

He thinks the symptoms I described, really rough/won't idle, smoke out the back, point to timing/head damage.

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Well I went and seen the car, it's in very good condition. 03' Cooper S

 

Checked everything, no smell of petrol in the oil, no smell of diesel in the fuel, oil looked OK on dipstick, but there was what looked like copper grease under oil filler. I asked him about it and he said he had added a little head gasket repair but not a lot as the bottle had split when it arrived. Mmmm

 

The water looked OK but had been over filled, he said he had topped it up before I arrived and it hadn't been run like that.

 

So, battery flat, I hooked up jump leads. It turns over absolutely fine, no funny noises at all, the bumps and lumps he described are from the exhaust that's on it, and the car wants to start.

 

He recently changed the coil on it and my spider senses tell me it's an electrical issue that's stopping it going, but I did notice the fuel pump seemed a lot quieter than on mine. He said before it stopped running it was fine and just suddenly stopped running leaving a roundabout.

 

So, I've decided to take my chances on it, made an offer, and collect it tomorrow night.

[GLPoomobile 958]

but there was what looked like copper grease under oil filler. I asked him about it and he said he had added a little head gasket repair but not a lot as the bottle had split when it arrived. Mmmm

 

 

Oh dear! If he's added KSeal/RAdweld etc to the coolant (which looks like you've described as it's basically copper particles in a solution) then it's not too bad, just flush the coolant out well and refill with fresh. But under the oil filler cap? Surely he didn't....no he couldn't have........added it to the oil instead of the coolant?

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

 

Oh dear! If he's added KSeal/RAdweld etc to the coolant (which looks like you've described as it's basically copper particles in a solution) then it's not too bad, just flush the coolant out well and refill with fresh. But under the oil filler cap? Surely he didn't....no he couldn't have........added it to the oil instead of the coolant?

Yeah GLP, under the oil filler cap, and you've just pointed it out to me! (I've never used the stuff)

 

I've told him not to do anything with the car that I would be dropping the fluids out of it.

 

What do I do about that then on a non runner?

[calvinhorse 870]

There is a crazy head gasket repair fluid you pour in the oil, I've seen it work on youtube videos, it's not uncommon... No idea if it lasts but I'd say it's what he's talking about