[Car_Upgrade] Yet Another Mi16 1.9 Build

[Shane17 7 1 Cars]

Looking good Andy,

I have rebuilt my old 8v head before but only with the stock parts and to be honest the mi head scared me off especially with the uprated parts that's why I preferred to have it done for me so you have my respect for doing it yourself. What cams have you got in this one? I remember seeing the posts that you had a couple of heads, is this the solid one?

 

What head gasket are you going with?

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Evening,

The solid lifter head with the Peter Taylor cams I sold to Tom Fenton. I have a brand new pair of standard cams. Part of me wants to upgrade the cam( at least the inlet one) as I have an Emerald and Jenveys , but the sensible bit says that enough money has already been spent, I have new cams so ought to use them. I have almost standard compression ratio and a fully balanced bottom end, new liners, new oil pump, in fact new almost everything one way or another. Head gasket? Nothing clever, just a standard Payen one, 1.4mm thickness . I will end up with an almost completely standard mi 16 on bodies and aftermarket ecu which I hope will give me a smooth , driveable engine that pulls well and is happy to rev up to 7k on the odd occasion. Oh, one thing I had forgotten is that I plan to run sequential injection. I have the 'tang' from an XU 10J engine and the housing that holds the cam sensor . Might even use the vacuum pump yet, but that adds the oil drain complication so may just use the vacuum from the inlet for the brake servo.

I also have most of the bits needed to build up an iron block 2.0 litre engine. If I do that, once the car is on the road and working well, then I will use some aftermarket cams ( Petert) , a diesel crank if I can find one, but all this is for the future.

As an update, I made some progress on the car today but ran out of time and took no photographs. I will sort those on Wednesday and then post the progress!

[TAG 25 1 Cars]

Evening,

The solid lifter head with the Peter Taylor cams I sold to Tom Fenton. I have a brand new pair of standard cams. Part of me wants to upgrade the cam( at least the inlet one) as I have an Emerald and Jenveys , but the sensible bit says that enough money has already been spent, I have new cams so ought to use them. I have almost standard compression ratio and a fully balanced bottom end, new liners, new oil pump, in fact new almost everything one way or another. Head gasket? Nothing clever, just a standard Payen one, 1.4mm thickness . I will end up with an almost completely standard mi 16 on bodies and aftermarket ecu which I hope will give me a smooth , driveable engine that pulls well and is happy to rev up to 7k on the odd occasion. Oh, one thing I had forgotten is that I plan to run sequential injection. I have the 'tang' from an XU 10J engine and the housing that holds the cam sensor . Might even use the vacuum pump yet, but that adds the oil drain complication so may just use the vacuum from the inlet for the brake servo.

I also have most of the bits needed to build up an iron block 2.0 litre engine. If I do that, once the car is on the road and working well, then I will use some aftermarket cams ( Petert) , a diesel crank if I can find one, but all this is for the future.

As an update, I made some progress on the car today but ran out of time and took no photographs. I will sort those on Wednesday and then post the progress!

 

The diesel crank is a straight fit into the XU9 and XU7 ally blocks, not the iron XU10 block for what it's worth.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Ah. Thanks for that. I had not appreciated that small but critical point.

Small amount of engine related progress today . Mangaged to finish off building the head and my new heater matrix arrived!

I removed the cam sensor' tang' from an XU10 inlet cam that I had and fitted to my new cam. The senor housing is just part of a bigger thermostat housing from the same XU10 engine but as I already have a BBM thermostat housing I just wanted the sensor housing so cut it away . Now needs a proper clean and probably a new sensor

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

Do you have smart trick to get the tang properly aligned on the XU9 cam?

I'm about to do the same;have a XU10 inlet cam with tang and PeterT XU9 cam in the engine where I need to press it on. I'm not sure yet on how align it properly...

[jackherer 543]

I will end up with an almost completely standard mi 16 on bodies and aftermarket ecu which I hope will give me a smooth , driveable engine that pulls well and is happy to rev up to 7k on the odd occasion.

 

It'll be interesting to see the result as it sounds very similar to mine, I think you said you were getting it mapped at Emerald too didn't you?

 

My ECU is just an old M3DK so the injectors are wired in pairs, I think that's the only significant difference.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Yep. Spoke to the mighty Dave Walker today to talk about the configuratuon file changes for sequential injection on the K6 . My options are to map at Emerald with the engine in the car or explore the dyno option . Not quite sure about which route yet.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

All I did was rotate the cam so that the cam wheel woodruff key was at 12.00 o clock and then popped the tang on at 3.00 o

 

clock. I did not press it on but just warmed it up gently with my blow torch . It just slipped on . Given that it is just producing a single pulse every 720 degrees of crankshaft rotation the alignment is not absolutely critical

[jackherer 543]

I didn't think they were keen on using the dyno for mapping?

 

http://www.emeraldm3d.com/engine-dyno

 

It will not be used to map customer’s engines; we see it as an R & D facility and nothing else – at the moment.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Ah. Should have clarified. If it is the dyno route, then it would not be at Emerald . From the cost perspective, Emerald is the more likely!

[jackherer 543]

Ah I see. Well, you've seen my thread so you'll know that I recommend Emerald and they map for a fixed price too so you know where you're at.

[petert 588]

Here's the best pic I can find of the standard tang position at present. It really depend on what ECU you're using. For example, the standard position works for any ECU that is looking for a home position before #1. This doesn't work for Motec or Autronic, as they fire channels 4,1,2,3 rather than 1,2,3,4.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

As usual Peter, you are an absolute fountain of knowledge and wisdom. I have just been to check mine and it is as in your photograph. Phew! Oh, just in case you have not looked at your messages, thanks for the wedge plate and the restrictors which arrived yesterday . Brilliant service . Much Appreciated

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

More work on the car today. I managed to get the rear axle fitted, then added the brakes, all the piping and other underneath stuff. Also routed the front to rear brake hose and the battery cable ( the battery is destined for the boot) . Fuel lines were installed last week along with the tank. Next job wiill be the front suspension and steering so that I can get the car on its wheels and move it about a bit.

I rebuilt the axle as per the guide on this forum but the powder coater misunderstood my instructions so ended up with some yellow bits that were meant to be grey and a black bit that was meant to be yellow. Hey ho. It was not the end of the world. I have used braided -3 hose with -3 jic stainless fittings throughout with metric to jic fittings for the calipers. I suppose it is a bit of an extravagance as copper pipe is soooo much cheaper but less convenient to work with .

The Baker BM fuel lines , complete with clips fitted an absolute treat so top marks to Stu for these.Brake calipers are exchange recon ones from GFS . I got new handbrake cables from a branch of Motorsave in Uttoxeter about three days before they closed down the branch!

The next conundrum is the steering rack. I have a gti power rack that has been rebushed by a specialist in Derby so is in excellent shape. Snag is that I have also seen a couple of Xsara VTS racks for sale . Bit hard to justify the cost unless someone here tells me that the VTS rack makes the car a much better drive than the standard gti 3.2 turns item

Edited December 7, 2016 by Andy

[TAG 25 1 Cars]

Is this a road car? Standard 3.2 turn rack is absolutely fine for the road, big improvement over the standard non-pas rack

[jackherer 543]

The VTS rack is brilliant, once you've tried one in a 205 the standard rack and the 3.2 turns rack feels like driving a tractor.

 

You'll be fine with a 3.2 turn rack as long as you never try driving a 205 with a VTS rack.

[welshpug 1,661]

totally agree, 2.4 turn is brilliant especially with 309 wishbones and 21mm bars on 205 width rear, makes adjusting the steering such fun in the corners.

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

The Xsara rack is a good modification but the 3.2 rack is also a massive improvement over the standard manual steering rack.

Be careful if buying one, there are two types, ph1 and ph2, 2.4 and 2.6 turns respectively and a change to the pipework connections.

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Thanks for this advice. I have the 3.2 power rack. The one I have seen available is the phase two Xsara which is 2,6 turns and the push-on hydraulic connection which makes life a bit more complicated. The ideal is the phase one, but not seen any of those.

[petert 588]

We have a 205 model called an Si here, with 1.6 single point injection. It has a 2.75 (I think) PAS rack, which is a great drop in replacement for the 3.2 rack. Not in any UK model?

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Morning. Not as far as I know. The hydraulic fittings are not a huge problem as there is a small engineering company near where I live that can make up fittings and pipes. My hesitation is only about spending another £150 when I have a perfect 3.2 power rack with pipework already adapted to plumb up to my 106 electric power steering pump. However, others have pointed out that the 2.4/2.6 rack is a huge improvement. What makes it even worse is that my Integrale ( sob) had wonderful steering with a 2.4 rack and exactly the right amount of power assistance .

I will sleep,on it Might try a cheeky offer on the Xsara rack and see what happens.

Thanks for the extra information

[Anthony 1,003]

If you've already got a refurbished 3.2 PAS rack then give that a try and see what you think - it's unquestionably miles better than the standard 3.9 turn non-PAS rack.

 

The VTS racks are very good - I have one in one of my 205's - but I'm not sure that they're necessarily worth the prices being asked for them these days.

 

We have a 205 model called an Si here, with 1.6 single point injection. It has a 2.75 (I think) PAS rack, which is a great drop in replacement for the 3.2 rack. Not in any UK model?

That I was aware of, we only got 3.2 turn PAS racks and 3.9 turn non-PAS racks over here.

 

That said, checking Servicebox there is a different part number listed for monopoint injection PAS racks (400057 for RHD) - over here we only got that engine in late automatic models AFAIK.

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

Does that 205 Si model have electric PAS as well?

 

 

Note that you can also use ZX 2.0 16V racks; have 2.6(or 2.4?) turns as well, but splined drive iso squared.

Edited December 9, 2016 by wicked

[Andy 105 1 Cars]

Slightly random question about the behind dashboard ' sound deadening ' and heater / pedal box replacement. I have rebuilt the heater motor and replaced the heater matrix to ensure the heater is as good as it can be. The sound deadening that I removed is not in brilliant condition, but would go back . I have thought about using the thin 'heat and glue' adhesive pads that are available from body refinishing suppliers as a replacement. Any thoughts on that gratefully received. Next is about the pedal box and heater. If I do end up replacing the o.e. Sound deadening do I need to,put it back before the heater and the pedal box, or an I put one or both back before the deadening?

Oh, forgot to add, I also have an after market sound insulation kit which was made specifically for the 205. It includes all sorts of pads for every area of the car except the inner bulkhead, hence the above question

[petert 588]

Does that 205 Si model have electric PAS as well?

 

No, normal GTi pump.