Engine Rattle

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

This is weird. The moment I had a reoccurrence of the symptom's I put the car on a ramp, took off all the covers and checked the timing holes with 10mm dowels- all ok.

 

Tried to start it- it would start run at about 2000rpm cough and die.

 

Checked the timing several more times after each attempted start- ok then suddenly not- with the cam locked the crank had moved from its locked position to about a 10 o'clock position as you look at it.

 

The belt seems tight so I can only presume the cam or crank pully must be worn. My next plan is to replace both and the belt- Ive had the tensioner off- the spring is good and the roller moves freely.

 

Anybody else have an idea?

[welshpug 1,661]

is the woodruff key present for the crank pulley and lower sprocket?

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

crank pulley- when I took the alternator pulley off it fell out and I remember refitting it so yes.

 

I don't know if I'm fitting the belt incorrectly maybe?

basically I do the following.

 

1.Set the timing on the crank/cam

2.Slaken the nut under the manifold

3.Slacken the 2 nuts on the spring

4. Adjust /fit the belt

5.Crank the belt round twice-ensuring the tensioner spring is moving freely- check the timing holes

6. Tighten the 2 nuts on the tensioner and retighten the nut behind the manifold

7. Check the tension on the forward longest run ensuring it wont turn past 90 degrees.

 

Now I believe this is correct.

 

This makes me think that the crank cog or may be the cam wheel must be worn - seems unlikely failing that then the tensioner must be faulty.

 

The water pump and tensioner were both new last summer.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Telf

[welshpug 1,661]

you need to tighten the tensioner nuts before moving the crank.

 

crank and cam wheels are steel, wear on these will be pretty minimal even on a very high mileage engine.

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Thanks Mei,

 

well that's probably what I've done wrong then, I guess I'd better buy a new belt just in case

Edited November 5, 2015 by Telf

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Fitted a new belt today using the following method:

1.Set the timing on the crank/cam

2.Slacken the nut under the manifold

3.Slacken the 2 nuts on the spring

4. Adjust /fit the belt

5 Tighten the 2 nuts on the tensioner and crank round twice- check dowels fit.

6. Slacken the 2 nuts on the tensioner - the spring compressed a bit more

7. Retightened the nuts and cranked around twice more- checked the locking dowels still fitted.

8. Check the tension on the forward longest run ensuring it wont turn past 90 degrees.

 

After doing this to me the belt still doesn't feel especially tight so I made a quick 10 second video:

 

This seem ok?

 

 

https://youtu.be/e1aCDvpGaEg

 

Thanks all!

Edited November 6, 2015 by Telf

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Becoming a bit of an epic tale now!

 

I rebuilt the car- started it up and it revs to about 2000rpm starts to chug- the revs drop off and it dies. If I keep trying I get smoke puffing out the AFM inlet.

 

If I advance the dizzy fully forward it runs a bit longer but basically dies - it doesn't matter were the dizzy is it just stops running.

 

Checked the belt timing 20 or so times -its still fine

 

I'm completely stumped now.

 

I checked the cylinder pressures again(from 1 to 4) 180/200/195/190 - did this 5 times to ensure the gauge wasn't playing up - the same each time.

 

Ive taken a video of its sick chugging:

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

Have you checked the crank pulley is keyed to the crank properly? Likewise have you removed the camshaft pulley and checked the drive pin is located and intact?

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

https://youtu.be/aFXWd-84IzM

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

The crank key is in place tom, I have no reason to doubt the cam pin is out- After every unsuccessful start I have cranked the bottom round to check the timing and its spot on.

Edited November 7, 2015 by Telf

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

The cam sprocket is in the right place, but is the camshaft itself???

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Ok can you explain what you mean? If I take the Cam sprocket off there should be a pin that ensures its aligned with the Cam (as I remember) so you think maybe this has sheared and its just the force of the sprocket bolt that's 'aligning' the cam sprocket with the timing hole?

 

I mean its a possibility - I will have a look see tomorrow - if I'm understanding you correctly- did you watch the video- its running rats isn't it!

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

It's worth checking.

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Cam sprocket removed and checked - all ok

Crank sprocket removed - Both woodruff keys ok

Refitted and timed.

 

Now when it starts it instantly revs to 2000rpm - stops there for about 15 seconds then the revs die off, it pops chugs and stops

 

Could this be the setup of the idle screw/mixture/ dizzy?

 

If so I'm not sure what to set first to try and datum it and get it running properly

Edited November 8, 2015 by Telf

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Just to be sure Ive swapped out the ECU,tacho relay and Ig Amp again- no difference.

 

It doesnt seem to matter whether i advance or retard the dizzy ( although at the extremes it doesn't want to start) the revs shoot up to 2000. If I wind the mixture screw in or out it does effect if it will start - but if it does start the revs do the same, ditto for the throttle body.

Edited November 8, 2015 by Telf

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

I found this on the forum - anybody ever tried it?

 

1. Ensure your spark plugs and air filter are clean, injectors working as expected and fuel of desired choice (97 oct+) is topped up

2. Clean the throttle body fully and double check the idle screw and passageway is clean, and the same for the stop plate on the throttle arm where it meets the throttle stop screw

3. Warm engine up (until rad fan kick in)

4. When the engine is warm and still running, squeeze one of the SAD pipes, if the engine drops off then your SAD is stuck open and will need fixing first, if all is ok then just stop the engine

5. Turn AFM air bypass screw fully out in and then turn out by 7 full turns

6. Turn throttle air screw fully in

7. Start engine and set throttle stop screw to 600rpm (650rpm on 1.6)

8. Turn throttle air screw out until RPM achieves required idle speed (900rpm +/-50rpm)

9. Blip the throttle a few times

10. Richen the mixture on the AFM by turning the screw by no more than 1.5 turns either direction of in or out (MIN 5.5 turns out to MAX 8.5 turns out, all from fully closed/in) until the desired CO reading is achieved (1% - 2%) which will raise the RPM

11. Blip the throttle a few more times

12. If required, turn the throttle air screw in until the RPM is lowered back down to required idle speed in step 5

13. Stop engine and adjust TPS to idle switch stop position (pin 2 and 18 continuity)

[steve@cornwall 100]

I had an incident a few years ago which flummoxed the dealers, car started, drove 100 yards or so an stopped.wouldn't restart so was recovered to a local "specialist" replacement leads and plugs , no go. Replaced cam belt, drove fine and called me to collect. By the time I'd driven the 5 miles the car had broken down on the test drive and I went back home. Replaced the dizzy ....test drove then called me in to pick it up. Got a mile down the road and it broke down again. Mechanic from garage came out, adjusted dizzy and off I went home. When I got home wouldn't re start.

 

Eventual problem? Faulty rotor arm spinning in situ! Worth a look. (Admittedly clutching at straws now)

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

changed it steve

[scbond 15 1 Cars]

The setup guide above is a very good one, provided it's the one from the bottom of Andy's thread.

 

Not sure setup is your issue though.

 

The smoke coming out from the AFM...how much/thick? Is it oil vapour/smoke?

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Simon,

 

Its light vapour- pretty sure unburnt fuel.

 

I really cant figure what is going on- the car got me to work (30odd miles) with no issue then it started playing up.Noticed the belt had slipped and carried out the actions as detailed.

I expected it to start no problem but it just revs up to 2500 the starts to die and stinks of fuel.

 

Back to basics I tried to lower the idle, checked the throttle wasn't snagged, checked the dizzy and the fuel/air mix- all to no avail- it just goes straight up to the high(ish) revs

​

[jackherer 543]

It's not the oil filler bolt missing out of the inlet manifold is it?

[Telf 224 2 Cars]

Kieran,

 

You are a bloody life saver! Yes the bolt is missing - it must have rattled out after I rebuilt it- the filler plastic is a bit ratty and it cant have been tightened properly.

 

So cheers matey- the only question is are you a beer, lager or cider man?

 

Once its back up and running I will pop round with those bits I borrowed

 

Paul

[jackherer 543]

Excellent, I nearly didn't post that, my memory of 8Vs is pretty vague, I haven't had one in a 205 since about 2001!

 

I got your text yesterday BTW, I was at a customers though so I didn't have a chance to reply.