305 And 205 Engine Similarities

[FarmerPug 4]

Hello

 

I dont actually own a 205, i have in the past; they were both diesels, one was a 1987 GLD with the old pre facelift dashboard, it was a brilliant car.

 

At the moment ive got a few 305s, they are getting quite rare now, my main reason for liking the 305 so much was that my grandpa drove one and it was the first car i can remember.

In June i got the first one a 1985 S5 from manchester and drove it back to northern ireland:

​It was in good nick for a 305, any that existed here were run into the ground and let rust away, this has bits of rust but nothing beyond repair, its currently stripped back to the shell to sort out any rust, and once thats one im thinking of putting a HDi into it:

So far ive just been gathering parts for the car, the 305 is quite rare now so getting parts takes a bit of time, in the process ive had the back axle, subframe and a few other parts sandblasted and annodised (i work in the design/drawing office of an engineering company so we can get stuff annodised at a good price):

Its still very much a work in progress, my cousin builds rally cars for a living so hopefully he will be able to sandblast the shell and sort out the bodywork, then the HDi conversion can begin, ive thought about putting an XUD turbo in, but id rather a HDi because its a much smoother engine and i have PP2000 on an old laptop so the electrics are not really a worry.

 

I also spotted another 305 on the internet for sale, this time it was a 1986 Automatic, one owner from new with a full service history for £100, the owner wanted the car to go to a good home hence the price, which for any car with a years mot and tax is a good deal, it was however in the isle of wight so the flights over, and ferries back home did add up:

 

As its still in good condition i take this 305 out when the weather is good, its a pleasure to drive, very comfortable and there is a tonne of space in the back so no need to take a trailer when moving stuff. There are bits of rust in places, and ideally it could do with a bit of work and a respray to prevent it getting worse but at the moment keeping it in a dry mushroom house and not taking it out in the rain stops the rust from getting any worse.

 

It is this automatic 305 that i have come to this site seeking advice for, i plan to keep this car as original as possible, the other one was also a 1.6 but according to the man selling it to me it had camshaft wear problems, it was quite clattery and lacked power, the automatics engine is very smooth, however it does suffer from the quirks of a carburetted car, on cold mornings it takes qutie a few cranks to get it to fire up, and it doesnt run very well until it is warm, i really dont know my way around these carbs well enough to be able to tune it right but would like to learn.

Ideally what i would like to do is add an electronic distributor to sort out the ignition system, and convert the car to fuel injection if the carburettor cant be sorted.

 

As there is no real 305 owners club ive came here, mainly because i thought the 305 shares quite a few mechanical parts with the 205.

[farmer 328 1 Cars]

Looks good.

 

I get quite often asked for sourcing parts for the 305 from a owners chairman I work with.

 

Got some heater hoses not that long ago am sure.

[S@m 156]

Very nice pair of 305's you have there, haven't seen one of those in years! I always fancied a 505 myself but they are just as rare and i haven't got the necessary bodywork skills they often require.

 

Looks like an XU5 engine from the last shot so it shouldn't be too hard to replace it with an injected xu5/xu9/xu10 from a 205/405/309/BX/ZX - although it might be a trip into the unknown. An xu10j4rs would be nice.

 

Does the manual one have a BE gearbox?

[Biggles 65]

XU5, XU9 & XUD9 were all fitted to the 305 so your conversion should be straightforward I would have thought.

[boldy205 75]

Ohh V6!

[Biggles 65]

I like your thinking ! Shame to waste a nice big engine bay ...

[FarmerPug 4]

I recently got some coolant hoses from Ian Kirkwood on CPUK, my cousin has a 305 van and im getting him the full set of hoses.

 

The S5 is 5 speed manual, i had a look this evening at it i didnt see any markings that said BE, but the gearbox doesnt look too different to the gearbox on the end of the XUD.

 

Im hoping a DW10 conversion is simple enough, a full 306, xsara 406 etc will be needed for the wiring but setting a DW10 beside an XUD they do look very similar.

The engine in the automatic had a new head gasket fitted about 2 years ago, it has been very well looked after with a full dealer service history, could the fuel injected parts be retrofitted onto this engine, or do you know anything about getting the tune of this carb right, it says webber:

 

The main problem is it can take quite a bit of cranking to get started up, and until it warms up it doesnt idle right, it also can cut out if sitting at a junction without any revs, the S5 when it had its petrol engine also cut out at junctions.

[farmer 328 1 Cars]

Yes I supplied Ian those hoses from a German dealer.

 

He asked for another hose recently unsure if it is for your car.

 

Located on Tenerife though.

[FarmerPug 4]

Ian did mention some of the hoses came from Greece, so thanks for your help in sourcing them. Its one of the reasons ive decided to put a DW10 into the 305 instead of the XUD is that there are still plenty of spare parts available for it, my cousin wants to keep his vans engine original as there is only 70,000 miles on it.

 

I suppose some of the silicone hose kits designed for the 205s would be a good upgrade for the 1.6 petrol engine.

[farmer 328 1 Cars]

Quite surprising how easy those hoses are to find compared to 205 hoses.

 

Anything else just ask Ian as he has all the slides to pick the part numbers out.

[FarmerPug 4]

Im suprised at that, i would have thought spare parts for the 205 to be much easier to find, at least on the aftermarket i assume there are silicone upgrade kits for the GTis?

 

As for the slides, I managed to buy an old Peugeot microfiche joblot off ebay, Ian lent me one of his 305 fiches and i pictured each of the pages on the fiche, organised them into folders and uploaded it to google drive, i dont know how much use the 305 parts lists might be to 205 owners but here it is:

https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B5UstL2jIkcjbWx3ZWNyWndGdjA&usp=sharing

At the moment im doing the 505 as it doesnt show up on servicebox, I have 205 microfiche slides aswell but never did the same as i see it on servicebox.

[farmer 328 1 Cars]

The slides even come in handy for early 205 parts also.

[Andy_C 50]

Love the 305; always have.

[FarmerPug 4]

Does servicebox cover the pre facelift 205s, ive never really looked into it too much, if you want i can do the same with the slides i have for the 205?

[welshpug 1,657]

mostly all covered but some of the more model specific data is missing, parts that are long gone dont have part numbers shown in some instances.

[Willem_Jacobs 6 1 Cars]

it has been done before,

 

i know of a 305 GTX that was HDi 2.0 converted... this one used the full electric harnass of a citroen berlingo van (even used the internal and dash electrics to get rid of Canbus issues...

 

It seems to be a more or less straight swap since it uses similar gearboxes and engine types...

[FarmerPug 4]

There is a 305 HDi on youtube, i think the owner is also in the netherlands (the numberplates had NL in the corner), it would be great to ask him a few questions about doing the conversion.

Using a non canbus car like the berlingo, or Xsara would probably be the wiser thing to do, i seen a 406 turn up the other day on gumtree for £350 but it was a 2002 so had the full canbus and the owner said it wasnt running right because of dirty diesel.

 

As for the old automatic, I put together this video of it starting up over the past week to try and show what its doing, its not too bad in the video because ive been starting it every day, normally if it sits for about a week it will be worse but here it is:

​

 

It starts up, sometimes this takes a bit of time, and once its running if i put my foot on the accelerator it cuts out.

[Ryan 99]

Have you tried using the choke when starting it from cold? I notice the choke light is off in all the clips.

[FarmerPug 4]

There is a choke light but this one has no choke cable its supposed to be automatic, the S5 when it was driving had the same sort of carburetor but it appears someone fitted a manual choke it never had any startup issues, but then it had pinking problems and it cut out at junctions even worse.

[FarmerPug 4]

I think the carburettor would need a rebuild and good looking over, the engine bay does smell of petrol especially after running for only a short time, and this vacuum pipe has a screw in it where this black part is broken:

 

Can you identify this carburettor, i know its a webber but the stamping on it isnt legible:

 

I can remember emailing an american company who said it was a 34 DGEC.

But a uk based company i emailed the other day said its a 34 DRTC

[Ryan 99]

The stamp on the side looks like 34 DRTC that's been stamped twice to me, and looking at some pictures of both I think it's a DRTC - the fuel inlet on a DGEC is the wrong shape.

[DamirGTI 342]

Deffo carb problem ... gummed up jets and possibly acc pump .. take it off and dismantle it , give it a good clean up and blow with compressed air and fit new gaskets/O-rings/diaphragms check and re-adjust the float as/if needed .

 

D

Edited November 27, 2014 by DamirGTI

[FarmerPug 4]

I had a bit of a closer look at the carb its leaking quite a bit of petrol (which may explain the fuel consumption), anyhow a friend was round and suggested something very simple but yet very effective at identifying the carb, wipe the stamped area on the automatics carb, some wd40 and a rag brought it up like new, and its very clearly stamped:

 

A rebuild kit is £35 ish, but i have absolutley no experience of working on carbs, how hard are they to rebuild.

[oldkiteman 6]

the stalling,bad fuel consumption and petrol leak could all be caused by the carb flooding.a tiny bit of dirt in the needle valve where the fuel goes into the float chamber holds it open and the fuel level rises too high causing all these symptoms.It could also be flooding due to faulty float.