Advice On Buying A 306 Diesel

[Ams 23 1 Cars]

Apologies for all the question, hope to get some good feedback to help make my mind up. I need to buy a cheap diesel runaround and I've been looking at some 1.9 and 2.0 306 examples for around 1k. I've not found much info on which one is the better out the two. They seem comparable in terms of MPG and insurance hence my difficulty in deciding.

 

Are there any specific common issues with the 306 diesel range? Any changes during Phases 1-3? Which one is the one to go for? I've found an extremely clean 75k miles 2.0 HDI near me but don't want to jump the gun.

 

Appreciate any advice!

 

 

[welshpug 1,657]

The HDI is better on fuel and more refined, otherwise mechanically they are very similar, basic engine design is much the same, i.e same crank and similar block but a larger bore with a common rail DI head.

 

specifically the diesel variants, look for smoke on startup and hard acceleration, crank pulleys and aux belt tensioners can mek noises, the HDI crank pulley cane separate and throw chunks of metal into the timing belt so needs addressing asap.

 

nothing specific to look at really, same as any other car just look for the usual wear and tear items, things that do cause larger bills are the rear beams, even the newest ones are past their prime by now and if you are looking to keep hold of you should budget for a rebuild.

 

 

avoid cars with a sunroof if possible, the roof skins rot out rue to the sunroof frame being spot welded on post galv process, look out for bulkhead and lower chassis rail and floor crossmember rot.

 

rear inner quarters can rot out where the upper rear seatbelt mountings go.

 

door looms can cause problems on the earlier cars, I think the phase3 had a few revisions and issues here are less common.

[Anthony 1,003]

Ignore the 1.9 NAD's - they're very underpowered.

 

Choice is really out of a 1.9 TD or a 2.0 HDi.

 

The later is more refined and more economical, but more complicated and hence potentially less reliable - that said, I've had just one engine related issue in nearly 100k miles ownership of my HDi's and that was just a fuel pump relay and otherwise has been flawless despite nearly quarter of a million on the clock. Late Y-reg onwards HDi's are also cheaper to tax for what that's worth, and a simple cheap remap gives you 120-130hp which transforms the car.

 

The former is very simple and bombproof if cared for, and if you get one with a Bosch rather than Lucas pump, quite tunable and will run on veg oil.

 

Personally, I'd get a HDi out of the two and just find the tidiest example you can with decent history.

 

In terms of things to look out for on 306 HDi's...

• Crank pulley - these are a bonded pulley and can break up but aren't too expensive to replace
• Lift pump (in tank low pressure pump) - again, these can fail and bank on it if it's whinning
• If the performance is very flat and doesn't feel like it is boosting then it's probably a knackered MAF sensor
• Injectors will probably tick upto around 3200rpm - if they don't it's probably low mileage, beware of any that are really bad on "low mileage" cars
• The air con almost certainly won't work on any 306
• Check that the heater blows hot and doesn't smell musty - heater matrix failures are an utter pain of a job on these and not uncommon
• Vagueness in a straight line and on gentle corners is probably wishbone P-bushes
• Check the rear beam for cambering, squeaking and play - same basic design as a 205 and fails in the same manner
• Check all the electrics work properly and in particular things in the doors (locking, windows etc) as door looms fail
• Check that the ABS and airbag lights come on and go off with ignition as expected - airbag issues from the front seat connections are very common and sometimes bodged for MOT's by removing the bulb.
• HDi's should run at a constant 80 degrees or so and even in traffic take ages to rise from that
• Check the passenger rear wheelarch for an arch liner - Peugeot didn't fit them on all cars (particularly estates!) and the C pillar rusts away
• Check the chassis rails underneath the car where they meet the floorpan - they tend to rust here, especially on lowered cars
• Sunroofs can rust, but most later cars have AC and no sunroof
• If you can, check later Cyclone alloy wheels for buckling as they are quite weak - they're awkward to balance too as they're centerless

That should get you started

[dcc 855]

for sub 1k HDI's look at the xsara! Hell of a car for the money!

[Anthony 1,003]

Oddly I found that Xsara HDi's were commanding similar if not higher values than the equivilent 306 when I looked last year.

 

Xsara did have the option of the 110hp HDi engine though which the 306 never did.

 

You should be able to get a nice late example of either for less than a grand as prices are really low at the moment

[Ams 23 1 Cars]

Many thanks for the valuable advice chaps, exactly the kind of info I was looking for. I'll search for both 1.9 and 2.0 HDi's and gauge condition using the very useful pointers mentioned. I haven't even considered a Xsara equivalent, I'll expand my search to include HDi variants of that model. Generally both the Xsara and 306 diesels seem to very good bargains. They certainly appear to be a better choice than my current Clio DCI, which feels like the automotive equivalent of a Jenga tower.

[welshpug 1,657]

As Anthony mentioned, there's two variants of the Xsara HDI (well specifically three afaik, phase1 90, phase 2 90, phase2 110 bhp, I dont think there's a phase 110 )

 

the 110 engine itself is the same but has an Intercooler and larger MAF.

 

The boot on the xsara is usefully a little larger.

[Anthony 1,003]

The only other thing that I will say is that it pays to be fussy as there is a lot of what would be best described as s**t out there that's liable to be a headache or expensive.

 

It's not so much the fault of the 306 itself as for the most part it's quite a nicely made and designed car (although there are some utter howlers that make you scream with frustration) that they clearly learnt from many of their mistakes with the 205/405 etc (using things like sealed wiring connectors for example) but they're old, cheap cars now and inevitably cheap cars attract cheap owners that won't properly maintain them.

 

Badly maintained and often bodged aging French car... what could possibly go wrong?

 

Spec wise, the two 306 HDi's you're best off looking for are Meridian or DTurbo spec. Meridian's are commonly available and are nicely spec'ed, the later cars particularly, but the suspension is distinctly comfort based. DTurbo's are rarer but have a similar setup to GTi-6/XSi suspension wise which is, to me, a significant improvement.

 

It's not a major issue as you can easily enough upgrade a Meridian to something more sensible by pinching bits from the dozens of GTi-6's and XSi's getting broken. A rear ARB in particular makes a massive improvement on the non-sport models like Meridian's

 

On the subject of suspension, I forgot to mention that knocks from the front will almost certainly be droplinks and the rear feeling a bit vague is probably tired beam mounts - the design of these is much worse than the 205/309 ones in my opinion and replacing with solid mounts massively improves things.

 

They certainly appear to be a better choice than my current Clio DCI, which feels like the automotive equivalent of a Jenga tower.

I genuinely LOL'd at that - never have I read a better description of Renault build quality

[Anthony 1,003]

the 110 engine itself is the same but has an Intercooler and larger MAF.

MAF is identical between the two. It's the 2.0/2.2 16v HDi's that have the larger MAF and uprated HP pump.

 

The 110 engine is intercooled as standard and has electronic boost control - these respond very well to remaps and you'll happily see 150hp from one. The downside is that AFAIK all HDi 110's have a dual mass flywheel and with it the usual tales of woe.

 

Otherwise, the 90 and 110hp engines are broadly similar, bar a few minor differences.

 

Later HDi engines (late 2000 ish I think) have a few more bits of emissions gubbins on them too to get them to pass the tightened Euro 3 emissions, but thankfully the ECU's are pretty simple so it can all be junked without danger of an engine check light coming on or any impact on MOT smoke test (although in theory you need a cat to pass visual inspection these days). It's well worth blanking the EGR as a sensible minimum as at best it just gunks the inlet with black tar and at worse costs both performance and economy - plates to do so are about £4 on eBay.

 

In terms of economy btw, my HDi hatch has averaged around 51mpg over the last 50k miles I've been measuring it to give you a reasonable idea.

[welshpug 1,657]

must be the C5 and 406 that differs then, as my sisters 110 has an 80 mm maf where the 406 90 and the xsara 90 had a 70mm unit.

[Anthony 1,003]

406 110 is defo the same unit as a 90 - that's what I've got on my car at the moment!

 

(the same car I removed the elbow and lower pipe from at the scrappy for a future intercooler upgrade)

 

Just double checked servicebox to make sure that I'm not talking rot, and that confirms it for both 307 and 406 - DW10TD (90hp) and DW10ATED (110hp) showing as a 70mm unit, whereas the DW12TED4 (2.2 16v) is showing as a 80mm unit.

 

I'd be surprised if C5's don't follow the same pattern with 8v's having a 70mm MAF and 16v's an 80mm, but anything is possible with the wonders that is PSA's random delving into the parts bin

[welshpug 1,657]

definitely an 80mm maf, 1920 AG ! bought a new o.e.m unit for the C5 and his had died.

 

DCC lent me a 406 unit and had to gaffer it on to make it fit it now resides on DCC's Xsara 90 as his died.

[dcc 855]

My MAF on my xsara wasn't a MAF. it was just 2 resistors soldered inside. p.o.s. - fixed now tho!

[Ams 23 1 Cars]

The one I was looking at was this : http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201404173401754/sort/pricedesc/usedcars/fuel-type/diesel/radius/200/onesearchad/used%2Cnearlynew%2Cnew/postcode/g21du/make/peugeot/page/1/model/306/price-to/1500/price-from/0?logcode=p but it sold today grr. Guy said it sold within 45 minutes of the ad going live.

 

Badly maintained and often bodged aging French car... what could possibly go wrong?

 

Dat dere should be the tagline for 205gtidrivers.

[RossD 44]

Not on the Xsara they dont! Standard solid flywheel and slightly uprated clutch compared to the 90bhp model. I ran a 110bhp Xsara for 6 years (2007 - 2013) and it was the probably the most reliable car I've had. It wasnt good looking and the interior wasn't the nicest, but the engine has plenty of grunt and it handled well. Also with the standard fit 283mm brakes it stopped rather well too!

 

The downside is that AFAIK all HDi 110's have a dual mass flywheel and with it the usual tales of woe.

[Anthony 1,003]

The one I was looking at was this : http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201404173401754/sort/pricedesc/usedcars/fuel-type/diesel/radius/200/onesearchad/used%2Cnearlynew%2Cnew/postcode/g21du/make/peugeot/page/1/model/306/price-to/1500/price-from/0?logcode=p but it sold today grr. Guy said it sold within 45 minutes of the ad going live.

I'm not too surprised as - on paper at least - that looked like a very good buy.

 

Tidy looking good spec late 1 owner 306 HDi with low mileage, FSH and that falls into the low tax bracket.

 

Don't be too afraid of mileage on these cars *if* they've been well maintained btw as they do wear it well and will cover 200k+ without too much bother. My hatch has done 244k miles now and is still on the original engine/gearbox/turbo/injectors, still drives nicely and still is utterly dependable

 

(indeed, I've been so impressed with it that when I needed more space, I bought the same in estate form)

[Anthony 1,003]

Not on the Xsara they dont!

Fair enough, I stand corrected

 

Wonder why though, as other 110's are dual mass nonsense even with BE gearboxes (eg 307) - another PSA parts bin special I guess like Mei saying that the C5 HDi 110 uses the 16v MAF as standard when none of the other models with that engine do.

[RossD 44]

Yes, its certainly the odd one out of all the other 110 HDi's. My current 406 had a DMF but I used the Valeo solid flywheel conversion kit as the DM flywheel squeaked constantly when pulling away. I can't feel any difference at all between it and the DMF

The other good point about the Xsara was the 58mpg I could get from it without trying!

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

I was deliberating over the same decision last September/October, and ended up buying a 2000 HDi with working air-con. In the few months I was driving it, it was relatively pleasurable to drive returning a real 52mpg even if it was quite sluggish (when did diesel vans get so quick!). It's been off the road last few months for an overhaul (new beam/bushes/shocks etc).

 

Parts are cheap, fairly easy to work on (doing the cam-belt/matrix is another story though), engine seems to go on if looked after, cheap to run, simple to remap to 120-130hp and still looks good today amongst the 'unpaid-for-jelly-moulds' on our roads.

 

Have you considered looking over on 306oc forum for one?

[Anthony 1,003]

Parts are cheap, fairly easy to work on (doing the cam-belt/matrix is another story though)

I'd say the cambelt is quite straight forward and easy on an HDi - it's just a regular PSA fair of locking pins to get the timing correct and a tensioner and idler pairing after all, all with reasonable access if you don't have spades of meat for hands. Parts are cheap too at about £50 for a cambelt kit.

 

The matrix is a pain though, agreed.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

I'd say the cambelt is quite straight forward and easy on an HDi - it's just a regular PSA fair of locking pins to get the timing correct and a tensioner and idler pairing after all, all with reasonable access if you don't have spades of meat for hands. Parts are cheap too at about £50 for a cambelt kit.

 

The matrix is a pain though, agreed.

 

I should correct that. You're right, the actual cambelt is straight-forward enough but it's getting to the point of changing the belt that's tedious. I did not enjoy the ridiculous number of cambelt covers, and one of the retaining bolts is on the back of the head.

Edited May 13, 2014 by Alan_M

[welshpug 1,657]

ahh yes, THAT bolt, its a BIG PITA on a 405 with the XUD9TE, due to the top mounted intercooler and proximity of the bulkhead.

[rikky 37]

My HDI paid for itself after 2 months pretty much; it's saved me a bomb on fuel to be honest, it's always doing 600-650 miles to a tank (60ltr), and does not mind having enormous amounts of conifers or plasterboards thrown in it. Bought it with a blown turbo and changed that and so far had no problems with it in 18 months. The injector is starting to chuff but that's it

Edited May 13, 2014 by rikky