Car Written Off!

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Here?http://goo.gl/maps/qU4crNo sign visible there - but, compare the position of the sign with your first pic, and there's most certainly space for you to have nosed past to see the oncoming car.Unfortunately, since it be a 430 mile round trip, I'll kindly decline. But, yes, I would say the same to you face-to-face. It would actually be preferable, since I could easily demonstrate how good a view you would have had.BTW, - I'm glad that you're now such an expert that you feel qualified to tell Rob how to do his job...

Not really an expert but done my research and can read basic plans and road layout plans and their measurements. The sign is missing from the picture obviously but using my picture I first put on you can see where it is now.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Rob also stated that this wasn't his area of expertise.

[welshpug 1,657]

Quite, especially on a road that wide, that much of a straight, and darkness.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Quite what?

[TooMany2cvs 65]

but using my picture I first put on you can see where it is now.

Yes, you can. And it really doesn't help your case very much at all, tbh. It starts roughly the same distance inboard of the exit sign as the sign is inboard from the kerb. Then there's the width of the marked-off gutter.

 

Compare that distance to the length from front bumper to driver's door window of an A3.

 

How much space was there between the front bumper of your car and the edge of the lane in that picture? Be honest...

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Less than a metre

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

I suspect the argument will (quite rightly) be - given the sign had likely been there for days if not weeks and in that time hundreds or thousands of motorists would have successfully exited the petrol station without incident, surely it must be down to a failing on your part by failing to ensure that it was clear before pulling out?

I think that's what everyone is thinking

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

[Goliath 94]

So with your car in that position in the picture above is the front of the car almost in line with the white line that marks out the edge of the road?

 

From the pictures you posted and comparing them to the google maps link it looks like there's almost the width of a single carriageway between where the black sign ends and the road starts.

 

If you are seriously considering taking legal action over the placing of the sign I strongly suggest you measure the distance from the white line that marks the edge of the road to the edge of the black sign, take photos of the measurements as you will need them as evidence.

[muddatrucker 125]

Tempting fate taking the new car back there?!

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

That picture was taken from a mates car the day after the accident,I haven't been anywhere near since! Yeah I need to but to be honest what will be will be now I've got the solicitors on the job so I'm sure they'll send someone out to have a look at the site.

 

The photo is taken from where you look to see if it's clear to edge out any further and you're in the road

[Goliath 94]

I think this illustrates my point better, get some absolute measurements before you take it any further.

 

 

[TooMany2cvs 65]

now I've got the solicitors on the job

Just out of interest, like... What agreement have you signed for legal costs, yours and theirs, in the event you don't win and costs are awarded against you?

[GLPoomobile 958]

Oh dear. Looking at these photos, it doesn't look like there's a strong case for you here James.

 

Looking at the exit from the other side on Google maps (the direction of the approaching car) gives a clearer idea IMO of what the visibility might have been like with the sign there. Of course it's still guesswork as both photos taken from inside the car don't give a full picture of the area and layout and could easily be framed in such a way to make it look like the sign was a big obstruction. But looking at the various clues and perspective etc, we can make a fairly well educated guess at the position of the sign. Blah blah blah.

 

Anyway, here's the Google maps view

 

And (don't snigger) here's a little mock up

 

As I said, it's guesswork, but I reckon going by the daytime photo this can't be far off. Really if you'd pulled up to the junction you should have had visibility past the sign. If you didn't, you were too far (way too far) back from the junction, which IIRC was something I suggested in my first post on the topic.

 

EDIT: forgot to mention that another big clue is the big sign at the right of the daytime picture (with Mexico on it). In the photo the driver's position seems to be in line with the edge of that sign. Now look at the position of that sign on the Google maps image, it's a loooong way back from the road!

Edited February 6, 2014 by GLPoomobile

[mowflow 67]

Everyone is forgetting 1 vital thing here. The ridiculous front over hang on Audis.

 

I have to say. I hate the "sue your ass" American style culture that we seem to be adopting here in the UK. I only fear it will get worse as solicitors see the legal aid gravy train fall off the rails.

[mowflow 67]

I have to say that comparing the google images to your own images it does seem a little bit of artistic license is being employed. Do you know if there have been any more accidents or have the garage removed or even move the sign? Going by your description and picture it seems that people would have no choice but to exit the petrol station full throttle, screaming and hoping for the best.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Oh dear. Looking at these photos, it doesn't look like there's a strong case for you here James.

 

Looking at the exit from the other side on Google maps (the direction of the approaching car) gives a clearer idea IMO of what the visibility might have been like with the sign there. Of course it's still guesswork as both photos taken from inside the car don't give a full picture of the area and layout and could easily be framed in such a way to make it look like the sign was a big obstruction. But looking at the various clues and perspective etc, we can make a fairly well educated guess at the position of the sign. Blah blah blah.

 

Anyway, here's the Google maps view

 

And (don't snigger) here's a little mock up

 

As I said, it's guesswork, but I reckon going by the daytime photo this can't be far off. Really if you'd pulled up to the junction you should have had visibility past the sign. If you didn't, you were too far (way too far) back from the junction, which IIRC was something I suggested in my first post on the topic.

 

EDIT: forgot to mention that another big clue is the big sign at the right of the daytime picture (with Mexico on it). In the photo the driver's position seems to be in line with the edge of that sign. Now look at the position of that sign on the Google maps image, it's a loooong way back from the road!

Nice diagram! The sign is a lot closer to the road than you've put it though surely you can see that from the photo I put up earlier. And how big is the a3 compared to the on coming car in your diagram? Looks more like a q7?!

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Just out of interest, like... What agreement have you signed for legal costs, yours and theirs, in the event you don't win and costs are awarded against you?

No win no fee! Simple as that.

[Goliath 94]

Nice diagram! The sign is a lot closer to the road than you've put it though surely you can see that from the photo I put up earlier. And how big is the a3 compared to the on coming car in your diagram? Looks more like a q7?!

 

If the A3 was smaller there would be even more visibility!

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Are you sure? Surely it'd be lower down and meaning visibility over the sign is reduced as shown in the photograph.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

What about the position of the sign, you agree the drawing has been done in favour of the opposing argument and in actual fact it's closer to the road that shown on the google type picture compared to my photograph. I'm going to make a detour on my commute tomorrow and take another pic if I remember in the morning.

[Goliath 94]

What about the position of the sign, you agree the drawing has been done in favour of the opposing argument and in actual fact it's closer to the road that shown on the google type picture compared to my photograph. I'm going to make a detour on my commute tomorrow and take another pic if I remember in the morning.

 

Cool, that would clear it up a bit, try and take a picture parallel to the road, the further away from the sign you are the easier it will be to see. From the in-car picture you posted up it looks like the sign is a good foot or 2 further back than the small 'exit' sign.

[Goliath 94]

Are you sure? Surely it'd be lower down and meaning visibility over the sign is reduced as shown in the photograph.

Yes I agree it would be lower down, but if it was smaller it would also be able to be a lot further forward giving even more clearance from the sign.

[GLPoomobile 958]

And how big is the a3 compared to the on coming car in your diagram? Looks more like a q7?!

 

Yeah, I agree the A3 does look a bit big compared to the other vehicles, although the approaching car is in the distance so there's perspective to consider. I did think of making it a bit smaller but then comparing it to the features of the Service Station (which is obviously more relevant to scale than a distant car) I felt if I'd made the A3 smaller it would have been too small. Bit difficult to judge really. BUt having said that, if I'd made it smaller, then as Goliath pointed out it would make the case stronger for increased visibility. Because with the front of the car up against the junction, the smaller the scale the less of the car there is obstructed by the sign if you you were to be looking around the sign rather than over it.

[GLPoomobile 958]

The wee man is keeping me up so I've an excuse to do more geeky jiggery pokery

 

This version might be a bit more realistic. I've downscaled the A3 a bit comparing it to the oncoming car, and I've also changed the shape and position of the sign based on the night time picture.

 

It's all pretty pointless though because I only need to make the slightest changes to scale and positioning and it can go from one extreme to the other. One version can show you having next to no visibility and the other can show you having bags of it.