Car Written Off!

[EarthMummy 0 1 Cars]

I have no real advice to add but I am deeply saddened to hear and see your 205 like this!

I hope you are doing EVERYTHING in your power to get the petrol station. I don't care if legally it is situated right - it's still an utterly stupid place to put it.

Audis are generally hard and heavy cars which explains the damage on your lovely 205, was the Audi driver speeding at all? Looks like a severe impact.

[TooMany2cvs 65]

Audis are generally hard and heavy cars which explains the damage on your lovely 205, was the Audi driver speeding at all? Looks like a severe impact.

Umm, he was in the Audi...

[EarthMummy 0 1 Cars]

Umm, he was in the Audi...

I must of misread it then.........

 

Oh yes...... My bad haha

Edited February 1, 2014 by EarthMummy

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Thanks for comment even if it was the wrong end of the stick lol, yeah got solicitors chasing the petrol station now. Hopefully get some compo to put in a bank for my newborn daughter since she was inside my girlfriend at the time of impact! She deserves it I suppose.

[TooMany2cvs 65]

yeah got solicitors chasing the petrol station now. Hopefully get some compo to put in a bank for my newborn daughter since she was inside my girlfriend at the time of impact! She deserves it I suppose.

You're serious, aren't you?

 

Jesus wept.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Damn right I am. They'll be insured, and that's what it's there for.

[deathbringer929 49 1 Cars]

you must be a man that never complains about the price of insurance. some poor petrol station owner will most probably have a massive premium hike because of your careless driving. please tell me if the police pursued prosecuting you?

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Yes they did but after speaking to the officer who dealt with it we agreed to meet up at the accident scene. Subsequently after hearing my case and showing all the evidence about the sign been illegally placed he said he'd look to drop my charge admittedly I haven't heard back yet but he said to give it a couple of weeks before expecting to hear back.

 

After reading the evidence I've explained and shown in this thread was the sign illegally placed and doesn't conform to planning permission? Yes or no?

 

And to be honest I don't really complain about the price of insurance I pay it and the garage pays it in case of times like this when they break the law which in some way however slight helped me have an accident regardless of my actions, as to they're premium hike, if they'd been more considerate for the law and people's safety instead on concentrating on advertising bloody coal so much there would be no need for the hike

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Next...

[Goliath 94]

Sorry to hear your daughter was injured, I hope it wasn't too bad and she makes a full recovery.

[TooMany2cvs 65]

After reading the evidence I've explained and shown in this thread was the sign illegally placed and doesn't conform to planning permission? Yes or no?

Which law do you think they broke?

Which law are you being accused of breaking?

[GLPoomobile 958]

To me, this doesn't seem like a black and white case of party X being clearly at fault. I think both James and the service station have some blame, but ultimately it was an accident rather than blatant careless driving, which I expect the Police will conclude too.

 

As I've said before, going by everything James has said in this topic and the photo at the start, I don't believe that the sign was 100% to blame as I think really James should have spotted it (it surely wasn't pitch black was it, what with the illumination from the service station forecourt?), and I also think he might have seen some of the peripheral illumination of the oncoming headlights if he'd been a bit more observant. That of course is just my thoughts and by no means a statement of fact as I wasn't there. James may not agree. I do strongly believe that this is a lesson to be more observant and take those all important few seconds extra to look both ways a 2nd time before pulling out of a junction.

 

Going by the photo I do agree with James that the placement of the sign is at the least bloody stupid and thoughtless, if not dangerous. If it's proven that the placement is against some sort of regulation/legal requirement then they absolutely 100% have a case to answer for, and I see no reason why James shouldn't pursue them if that's the case. No matter if James is partially to blame, if I were in that situation and I knew that I'd made a silly mistake due to something else that was a major contributing factor, then I'd be going after whatever/whoever was responsible. You'd surely have to have very full pockets and the forgiveness skills of Jesus to just suck it up and forget about it!

 

The other party (other driver) involved is the unfortunate "victim" in this. Their insurance will go up as a result. If the police don't prosecute James then it has to be accepted as an accident, and accidents happen, that's the way of the world.

 

I'm not a fan of the "compo culture" but it's not like James is committing insurance fraud. On the other hand, personally if it were me I might see the replacement vehicle without being out of pocket, the fact that everyone escaped unscathed, and the lesson learned as a happy outcome, and good enough. Trying to get more from the situation is perhaps a little greedy, even if you are within your rights.

Edited February 6, 2014 by GLPoomobile

[TooMany2cvs 65]

Going by the photo

I'd still like to see a better photo, showing a wider view of the exit, preferably with some distances, too. Google Streetview location, even.

 

Oh, and I don't know if it makes a difference, but the much quoted regulations linked to earlier are for Northern Ireland. In addition, they are just "best practice" - they carry no legal weight.

Edited February 6, 2014 by TooMany2cvs

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

I know they broke the law stating where the sign can be placed for safety of road users relating to the vision splays that have to be within certain guidelines. U asked this earlier in the thread and I posted the planning portal information after you argued the point before funnily enough you didn't reply when I put it on in black and white showing exactly where they went wrong!

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

GLPOOMOBILE... You've hit the nail on the head in everything you say and I am been greedy but for the hassle I had over Xmas without a car, worrying about 'her' going into labour and been stuck , it was quite stressful. She also suffered some damage to her back which meant she had to have an assisted labour as she could 'push' properly hence why I felt we deserved something when things could of been very different.

[GLPoomobile 958]

She also suffered some damage to her back which meant she had to have an assisted labour as she could 'push' properly hence why I felt we deserved something when things could of been very different.

 

As a new dad myself, I can empathise as my wife's labour turned out to be quite stressful as we wanted it to be 100% natural but it had to be assisted at the end as my boy was stuck. So if the accident contributed to a stressful labour (amongst other things) then fair enough. IF it's concluded that the garage was partly to blame.

 

And of course the best outcome is that everyone, including the baby I assume, was OK in the end

[TooMany2cvs 65]

I know they broke the law stating where the sign can be placed for safety of road users relating to the vision splays that have to be within certain guidelines. U asked this earlier in the thread and I posted the planning portal information after you argued the point before funnily enough you didn't reply when I put it on in black and white showing exactly where they went wrong!

I repeat - what LAW? That document giving the Northern Irish regulations do not state any LEGAL REQUIREMENTS, and they reference no legislation. They give best practice and recommendation alone. Either way, whether the sign should have been there or not is a moot point. It was. You failed to take account of it. It may as well have been a parked van.

 

Did you accept the fixed penalty/course which you were offered early on in the process? If so, then that's the end of any prosecution, since you've pleaded guilty and accepted an alternative penalty to having your licence endorsed.

 

Any chance of giving the location, so we can see in Streetview?

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

A164 Long riston jet garage fancy meeting me there and we'll discuss it?. And if you look on the East Riding of Yorkshire council website there's a section which says the same as the bit I put up.

[Rob Thomson 6]

I know they broke the law stating where the sign can be placed for safety of road users relating to the vision splays that have to be within certain guidelines. U asked this earlier in the thread and I posted the planning portal information after you argued the point before funnily enough you didn't reply when I put it on in black and white showing exactly where they went wrong!

 

I'm a highway engineer for my sins. This isn't really my field of expertise, but I think you're on a hiding to nothing if you try to blame anyone but yourself for this.

 

Guidance isn't law, and even ignoring that I think you'd struggle to find any proper guidance about how much visibility a private access should provide where it meets a public road. The national guidance - stuff like the Design Manual for Roads and Bridges - only really applies to trunk roads and motorways.

 

Local authorities can (and do) state planning guidance regarding visibility at private junctions with public roads, but those visibility constraints apply to permanent features only. A temporary sign hanging off a couple of stakes isn't a permanent structure and I don't think would ever be considered to be a breach of planning conditions.

 

Think about it this way... How many junctions there are between public roads that afford almost no visibility? What about urban streets where parked cars block visibility at junctions? What about pedestrians stood on footways at junctions affecting visibility? These situations aren't ideal and certainly don't conform with any guidance you can dig up, but they happen all the time and it's always the driver's responsibility to drive according to the conditions and not drive into the side of other cars.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

The picture I put on is in fact the one off the East Yorkshire council site off the gov.uk site which can be seen at top of the picture

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Read section 12.1 of the planning guidelines on petrol station advertising boards. It clearly stays what the must and must not do it's an instruction and not a lapse recommendation.

[Rams_gti6 12 1 Cars]

Signs over 0.6 (could be 0.7) m2 aren't allowed just to be placed anywhere what you're referring to as a sign on 2 stakes is fine if it's within the measurements they stipulated

[mowflow 67]

Yes they did but after speaking to the officer who dealt with it we agreed to meet up at the accident scene. Subsequently after hearing my case and showing all the evidence about the sign been illegally placed he said he'd look to drop my charge admittedly I haven't heard back yet but he said to give it a couple of weeks before expecting to hear back.

 

After reading the evidence I've explained and shown in this thread was the sign illegally placed and doesn't conform to planning permission? Yes or no?

 

And to be honest I don't really complain about the price of insurance I pay it and the garage pays it in case of times like this when they break the law which in some way however slight helped me have an accident regardless of my actions, as to they're premium hike, if they'd been more considerate for the law and people's safety instead on concentrating on advertising bloody coal so much there would be no need for the hike

 

Did you shake on it? ​

[TooMany2cvs 65]

A164 Long riston jet garage

Here?

http://goo.gl/maps/qU4cr

 

No sign visible there - but, compare the position of the sign with your first pic, and there's most certainly space for you to have nosed past to see the oncoming car.

 

fancy meeting me there and we'll discuss it?

Unfortunately, since it be a 430 mile round trip, I'll kindly decline. But, yes, I would say the same to you face-to-face. It would actually be preferable, since I could easily demonstrate how good a view you would have had.

 

BTW, - I'm glad that you're now such an expert that you feel qualified to tell Rob how to do his job...

[Anthony 1,003]

I suspect the argument will (quite rightly) be - given the sign had likely been there for days if not weeks and in that time hundreds or thousands of motorists would have successfully exited the petrol station without incident, surely it must be down to a failing on your part by failing to ensure that it was clear before pulling out?