What Are The Correct Mot Emissions Standards - Mystery?

[mmatthej1 1]

Hum - our car just failed MOT on emissions, showing 1.152 for CO.

 

As I had very recently had it tuned on a rolling road and been assured that emissions had been then corrected to meet MOT standards, I was surprised, to say the least!

 

So I spoke to tuner, who assured me that all is correct by his lights and that no 1.9GTI could ever run to <0.5% CO, which was the standard that the MOT tester used, by reference to the list of 205 engines available on his gas analysis machine - for a 1905cc engine, he could choose either 'DFZ' or 'DKZ' type engines.

 

I don't personally recognise either DFZ or DKZ as references, as I think the 1.9GTI has an XU9JA engine reference.

 

....So I spoke (at length!) with VOSA, who referred to their flowcharts plus info specific to Pug205 and gave me same DFZ/DKZ choices (only), both having the <0.5% limit that the tester used.

 

Can anyone shed light upon this subject,please? If I,ve had this problem, maybe it will come up more generally!!.

[Anthony 1,003]

A non-CAT 1.9 GTi has a D6B engine (otherwise known as a XU9JA as you state).

 

DFZ is the low-compression 105hp 1.9 CAT-equipped engine (found in late CTi's for example), and DKZ is the 1.9 GTI 122hp CAT-equipped engine.

 

The important factor is when the car was manufactured (not, as some believe, registered) as if it was prior to 1st August 1992 then it won't have to sit a catalyst test regardless - the limits for a non-CAT test are 3.5% CO and 1200ppm HC. If it's a post-August 1992 car then it will have to pass a CAT emissions test - 0.5% CO and 200ppm HC.

 

Have a look at the MOT manual section on emissions - clicky

 

If yours is a non-CAT D6B then 1.1% CO sounds like it's pretty much bang on.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Anthony

[johnsimister 10]

That's very strange, as most MOT testers must surely know that most GTI 1.9s don't have cats. As you say, XU9JA with the subsidiary identifier of D6B. A non-cat GTI needs to have less than 3.5% CO and less than (a rather lenient) 1200ppm unburnt hydrocarbons. The data in the Haynes manual says CO should be set to 1% but in practice they seem to run better a touch richer; the original 105bhp 1.6, XU5J, was given the range 1 to 2%.

 

Coincidentally my 1987 1.9 was MOT'd today, on the usual computerised machine with VOSA data link. It scored 1.99% and 99ppm, and passed.

 

Something odd is clearly going on at VOSA, and it sounds like your MOT garage isn't being much help.

 

John

 

Edit - I wrote this while Anthony was posting his reply!

Edited May 29, 2013 by johnsimister

[mmatthej1 1]

Thanks for responses to date, which are indeed informative - looking back on my old MOT's, I do see that the CO limit was always defined as <=3.500% (my car was 2.196% last year and passed!), so 'problem' seems to be with the list of engine options now appearing on the analysis machine; is it perhaps possible that a broader range of options is somehow available? I will be asking the tester, when I go back for the re-test!! (I do have a couple of other issues to get sorted, ahead of this).

 

I'll try to report what is said/outcome, within next 10-days!

[Slo 283 1 Cars]

Hmm interesting on my last mot i was worried about my emissions on my 1.9 too and my guy said it could go upto about 3.5 too but now i've got the 2.0 turbo lump in and last time it was analyzed with no cat it was pumping 1.15% CO, now my cars an e reg 1987 cti registered as a 1.6 and i haven't fitted a cat, i'm using the standard exhaust with the end modified to fit straight onto the turbo manifold. I've yet to fit the boss for the lambda sensor will this pass the emissions or will i have to bite the bullet and weld a cat in?

[TooMany2cvs 65]

If there's been an engine swap, it's the age of the engine which determines the type of test needed - so since it's a post-92 lump which would have been catted originally, it needs catting.

 

And you really need to change that V5C, too - insurance know the truth, right?

[Slo 283 1 Cars]

Im insured by greenlight that advertised on here and i've been in contact with neil on here so he is aware of it but since im still in the process of actually doing it there's no point updating the insurance yet as its sorned and not drivable atm, will be updated and logbook too on completion thanks for the advice bloody cats

Edited May 29, 2013 by Slo

[Ryan 99]

If there's been an engine swap, it's the age of the engine which determines the type of test needed - so since it's a post-92 lump which would have been catted originally, it needs catting.

 

Engine swaps are tested according to whichever is the oldest - the car, or the engine. You only need a cat if both the car and engine are post-92.

Edited May 29, 2013 by Ryan

[Slo 283 1 Cars]

That's what i was hoping to hear Ryan, can anyone shed a second opinion on this please? Don't want to turn up for the mot and look stupid when the guy says wheres your cat especially when it will obviously have a lambda sticking out of it lol

[welshpug 1,662]

no second opinion required, that's straight from the MOT manual.

 

I have a lambda poking out of my downpipe, no questions asked.

[Slo 283 1 Cars]

Oh brilliant thanks wp you and ryan have me me very happy tonight

[TooMany2cvs 65]

Sorry - my bad. I got it wrong way round. It is indeed the _older_ of the two, not the newer.

http://www.motinfo.gov.uk/htdocs/m4s07000301.htm

Vehicles fitted with a different engine must be tested to the requirements of whichever is older, the engine or the vehicle. e.g. A 1995 car fitted with a 1991 engine (of whatever make), test to 1991 standards for emission purposes. Note: The onus is on the vehicle presenter to prove engine age.

[S@m 156]

Having owned, and MOT'd for 6 years, a '97 car with an '88 engine, i can confirm its the older of the two that counts. I would recommend having a look at the MOT manual before you go and making a note of the relevant chapter so you can refer to it if the tester doubts you - i had to do this a few times. The onus is on you to prove these ages though.

[mmatthej1 1]

Anyways, our car has now PASSED emissions for new MOT, thankfully - I wasn't present for the re-test but I think they finally applied the correct CO limit of 3.5% max and we got thru at a recorded level of 1.86%, so scare is now over!

 

My thanks for all comments posted!