My Vts Gearbox - Queries

[chipstick 382 1 Cars]

Removed the 5 speed gearbox from my Xsara VTS last year when I had finished with it. Stashed the box away ready to eventually fit to my 205.

 

Today I decided to make a start on converting it for use ready to fit shortly.

 

The first thing that caught my eye was that the clutch top arm was the same visually as the 205 one I had to swap it with. The VTS one was in better condition - so I kept it and fitted it to the 205 shaft I have - which was clearly different. I compared the top arm carefully expecting a minute difference but couldn't see one. I moved on - hopefully someone will confirm there's a valid reason they are the same? My VTS was an early ph1. A 1997.

 

I change the selector over to the flat 205 type - no problem there.

 

I then popped the diff cover off and then dug out a couple of 205 diffs and started to inspect them for differences.

 

First up was a 205 BE3 diff. The planet gears are chipped but I popped it in the vice and decided to 'practice' on it.

 

 

The crown wheel on this was 17x59.

 

The bolt undid fine and I was beginning to enjoy my progress.

 

The good 205 diff I have (from a BE1 - but I don't think that would make a difference) has a crown wheel with the following numbers 16x59. By all means warn me if the diff that's attached to it is likely to be incorrect for my application.

 

So moving on to the Xsara VTS diff! First shock was the bolts were on the underside! I had a search and that appears to have been normal, so I was slightly reassured.

 

 

 

I have no idea how yet I will undo the bolts that were inaccessible due to the vice being in the way - but I'll get around it somehow.

 

My main concern was when it came to the numbering in my Xsara VTS crownwheel. 14 x 62

 

Again I had a search and this didn't appear to match what others had discovered. Initially alarm bells rang and I thought perhaps at some point the VTS has had a different 5 speed bunged in, this with the earlier discovery of the top arm being visually the same didn't inspire confidence, but before I get too worried I thought I'd see whether it does perhaps differ on the earlier boxes.

[Anthony 1,002]

14 x 62 is a 4.4 final drive, so sounds correct for a VTS gearbox.

[chipstick 382 1 Cars]

Brilliant thanks Anthony.

 

Here's the 2 identical arms I have:

 

 

Had a nosey at my 205 and the arm on that is different. I assume the arm I've labelled 205 is not Infact a 205 one but will be compatible. May need a slight trim it the folded edge catches the box. For some reason I assumed the VTS ones differed enough to warrant changing.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

The later BE box's used the so called strengthened Diff which is the reason you cannot fit a 205 D/S into it as the offset is different. the 4.4 is the right box, the 16x59 is a 1.9 box with the other one off a good old oil burner.

 

Arms are all the same, it's just the shaft that is different, I tend to use the later pin as well, make sure it's greased up

 

personally for peace of mind I'd buy a new planet gear set, as you have seen they often start to break up

[Anthony 1,002]

Your 205 box has had a later clutch arm fitted by the looks of it, which needs modification otherwise it fouls the casing on full depression of the clutch as you've found.

 

A gearbox I bought was exactly the same, and it took me a little while to figure out why the clutch felt odd at the end of the pedal travel as you couldn't see the witness marks on the casing - a couple of minutes with an angle grinder quickly addresses it, like so:

 

 

The original 205 BE3 clutch arm is rather more spindly looking, like so:

 

[welshpug 1,656]

is it not quite obvious that if the arms need some grinding to work, that they are not the same for pull and push clutches?