Front Camber

[PhilNW 43]

Front end has recently felt unstable and nervous with poor turn in

 

Suspension is fixed platform forest GP N bilstein inserts/springs and mounts. engine 1.9 with transx diff, rear is solid mounted

 

Relatively new front wheel bearings, rear axle rebulit last winter

 

Done a geoemtry check of the front and rear of my road raly 205 ( haynes says front canber should be 0 plus or minus 0.5 degree)

 

Found rear cambers within normal alignment but front right was giving 1 degree neg front left was 0.2 neg. Toe in set as parallel.

 

Not sure if strut is bent or something else that is give this amount of camber

 

Not stripped it down yet, Any thoughts as to what to look for?

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

See if your hubs are ovalled.

[dave richards 26 1 Cars]

306 hubs maybe?

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Have you definitely got a matching pair of hubs?

 

Like dave says, 306 hubs will fit & look nearly identical (depending on which model they came from) but have different camber when fitted to a 205.

 

g

[PhilNW 43]

how do you tell?

 

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

On later ones the driveflange is different & no longer has the slot in the lip that the wheel sits on & iirc the driveflange is also slightly thicker.

 

Other than that you need to be looking for obvious differences such as ABS sensor holes but even that isn't a cert.

 

g

[PhilNW 43]

Have you definitely got a matching pair of hubs?

 

Like dave says, 306 hubs will fit & look nearly identical (depending on which model they came from) but have different camber when fitted to a 205.

 

g

 

Everything stripped - no obvious diff in hubs, What camber could you expect with a 306 hub?

 

Would adding adjustable top mounts compensate?

[welshpug 1,655]

Try swapping new discs over, check offset of old discs.

[j_turnell 136 3 Cars]

Adjustable top mounts would cure it, but only mask the problem rather than fix it. Also check for any damage to the subframe and wishbone on that side.

[PhilNW 43]

No obvious damage to wishbones or subframe when i stripped it down, what camber would you get with a 306 hub fitted?

 

Though I had read somewhere that they give positive camber not negative

Edited February 17, 2013 by PhilNW

[welshpug 1,655]

positive camber.

[grandos 16]

Domed strut top? I assume not if you have strengthening plates but you never know!

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

Everything stripped - no obvious diff in hubs, What camber could you expect with a 306 hub?

 

Would adding adjustable top mounts compensate?

 

The difference is in the machining during manufacture so they won't necessarily look any different but that doesn't mean they aren't.

 

As said, using adjustable top mounts will simply mask the problem & even with them you'd need to have both side set to the same amount of castor & camber by using the adjustable top mounts but you are simply masking the issue & could struggle to get both sides the same which could make for interesting handling characteristics one way compared to the other.

 

Best bet, borrow / get a known matching pair of hubs & see if you still have the same difference in camber side to side.

 

pm sent

 

g

[johnnyboy666 195 1 Cars]

manufacturing tolerances in pattern wishbones may play a part. Mines got 309 TCA's up front and although they 'should' be the same length, there is a visable difference when looking from the front

[PhilNW 43]

 

Domed strut top? I assume not if you have strengthening plates but you never know!

 

plates fitted

[PhilNW 43]

manufacturing tolerances in pattern wishbones may play a part. Mines got 309 TCA's up front and although they 'should' be the same length, there is a visable difference when looking from the front

 

 

bottom wishbones are Peugeot sport heavy duty Grp N

[Tom Fenton 1,540]

Sounds to me like typical ovalled hub, to elaborate this is when the pinch on the bottom of the hub that grips the balljoint pin wears and splays out, result is the balljoint pin not solidly located in the hub, thus geometry changing itself as you drive along making the car nervous unstable and awful to drive with any commitment. To check get them off and carefully measure the bore of the pinch, it should be 16mm and not oval or tapered.

[PhilNW 43]

How easy is it to actual bend the hub to give this amount of negative camber? The original running gear came from a stage car .

 

Done a fag packet calc and to get the camber back to 0.5 degrees the top or bottom of the strut would have to be 6 mm out based on top of strut to bottom ball joint length of about 680 mm

[welshpug 1,655]

Quite easy tbh!

 

Can you get a pic of both?

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

How easy is it to actual bend the hub to give this amount of negative camber?

 

I think you'd bend the bottom of the shock tube far before the hub & the balljoint hole would shear before as well.

 

g

[PhilNW 43]

I think you'd bend the bottom of the shock tube far before the hub & the balljoint hole would shear before as well.

 

g

 

New hub fitted and only minor diff to camber, looks like a bent strut

[Mac Crash 78 1 Cars]

HI, new to forum here, but topic is one I am keen to know more...

 

How do hubs become "ovalled"? in the first place?

[pug_ham 244 3 Cars]

HI, new to forum here, but topic is one I am keen to know more...

 

How do hubs become "ovalled"? in the first place?

There are several reasons imo.

 

Poor maintenance being the main one, excessive force removing the balljoint pin from the hub during either changing a hub or wishbone & the biggest problem is reuse of the clamp bolt & it being over tightened.

 

The balljoint clamp bolt should be replaced everytime with the correct plain shank / shouldered bolt & not a fully threaded bolt.

 

g