Why Wont It Run Properly?

[pugtop 0]

Hi all, after some inspiration here. My 1986 1.6 GTi has been in storage, damp most of the time, for around four years. It has been started on and off during this time and after the damp had cleared it ran ok. Went out in it last week for the first time in 4 years and it ran ok but the alternator was showing a weak charge, so I fitted a good spare. Sorted that fault. Drove over the weekend and it was ok, and ran quite well, then Monday night, went to the Ace Cafe for French car night. On the way there, got to Hanger Lane Gyratory and the engine cut out at the traffic lights and took three phases of the lights to get it to cough into life again. Annoying and VERY embarrasing.

On the way home I had little or no low end throttle, no mid range and loads of full throttle, not very usefull.

Tuesday night, changed the afm for one off of another car (that was a runner, but may be faulty), and tried a working tachymetric relay, no different.

Weds night, changed the ECU, no difference. Changed the plugs for new ones, no difference...etc etc...

Thursday night, changed the Throttle body for a later one, changed the SAD for a tested and working one, and the car started, then cut out again and wouldn't start again, pretty much as Monday night.

Tonight, cleaned plugs as they are getting really sooted up, really qiickly. Removed alarm to make sure it isn't the immobiliser causing the issue and it started, got hot then, when turned off, wouldn't start again.

It is idling at about 1200rpm + and can't be adjusted down on the air screw, i've done as many of the tests in the Haynes book of lies as possible with no real faults found and i'm struggling to find fault. Also changed the distributor sensor wire for a good one, changed the coil and ignition module for working ones too, and it will sit and idle ok, if a bit high. Isasue now is that it won't rev cleanly and once it's turned off, won't start again!!!

I'm going to try the AFM off my rally car, which I know is ok but don't want to strip too much off and rin that....if that doesn't sort it i'm flummoxed!

 

Any ideas???

 

Kev.

 

Oh and it's not the car in the picture! That IS my rally car which is fine thank you....

Edited September 21, 2012 by pugtop

[205kenny 7]

Sounds like its overfueling, have you tried a coolant temp sensor?

[pugtop 0]

Hmm, had looked at it but the resistance readings are bang on, may look to see if I have any spare ones and swap it over. Have a lot to do tomorrow and Sundays weather looks crap, so i hope I get the chance to do it this weekend. I suspect it is over fuelling too, but thought i'd check everything else out while I was at it.... also thought i'd lost spark at one point....It's old, it's cranky, it's a 205!

Edited September 21, 2012 by pugtop

[JRL 14 1 Cars]

Hi Kevin, If you need to try any of my engine parts from my 1.6 cti you are more than welcome to come by this weekend.

James

[pugtop 0]

Hi James, thanks for the offer, got a whole 1.6 rally car to nick bits off if required, so I hope i'm covered for parts. Go a 1.9 here too at the mo' that belongs to someone else and has its gearbox out, so I should be ok. Got loads of parts here probably three cars worth so if there is anything you need let me know. I need to sort this car this weekend hopefully as I have four SOLID weekends coming up, one of which it is supposed to be appearing at a wedding!

Got my Discovery front discs and pads to change tomorrow morning too.....going to be busy!

[JRL 14 1 Cars]

lol a wedding, lucky bride.

[pugtop 0]

Mine is for carrying the ushers, my mates 1.9 is his main wedding car .....believe me this is no budget wedding!

My Jag is at another wedding next weekend......

[JRL 14 1 Cars]

Sounds good fun, the whole of 205gtidrivers could turn up like a bikers club wedding.

[DamirGTI 344]

An big air/vacuum leak , check the air hose on the bottom of the inlet manifold , as well as the rest of the air/breather/vacuum hoses ... everything from the AFM entry till the cylinder head , hoses , pipes , gaskets , injector O-rings .

 

Damir

[lagonda 42]

Although it doesn't explain the high idle, your other issues sound very similar to trouble that it took ages to resolve on mine. Condensation in the distributor cap! Easy to spot if you take the cap off as soon as the engine stalls.

[pugtop 0]

Well, having done a bit more testing and some more research today, I have only found that the Temp sensor is showing about 60ohms at hot running temp, therefore I suspect it if afulty. I by-passed the sensor with a wire to short the plug and the car ran. Gonna try to get a sensor tuesday and we'll see. I think that changing all the other bits has improved performance, it goes like a rocket now, BUT and it's a big butwith the sensor plugged in, once it's hot and you turn it off, you have to crank it like buggery to get it to start, if it does at all. Still got the high idle issue, down to 1200rpm now, with the air screw wound all the way in! Wonder if the temp sensor is making it overfuel and causing this???

Test results are:-

AFM resistance is ok.

SAD works as it should,

Throttle body is in good shape.

Throttle position switch works as it should.

ECU seems ok.

Ignition system seems ok (nice fat spark now)

Temp sensor ........ we will see!

Everything else checks out ok

Deffo no major air leaks because if I put my hand over the afm inlet when the engine is running it tries to suck me in......

[welshpug 1,666]

I think you have found your culprit for the Overfuelling at least, but I think there must be an air leak if its still idling at 1200 with the air screw all the way in.

 

Ohms for running temp should be around 300, not 60! I may have a NEW temp sender here Kev

 

Edited September 22, 2012 by welshpug

[pugtop 0]

I know what the resistances are supposed to be, I have the Autodata book on file and have printed it out, so that I can have it outside for reference. No sign of an air leak but there must be something wrong as you say, i'll see once i've fitted a new temp sensor. I have tried two different throttle bodies (both AMC? later type bodies), due to the original one not shutting properly. I will check for leaks with some Easy Start but when I pulled off on of the induction hoses the revs dropped.

One thing of note, when I drove it today it pulled like a freight train, better than it's ever been before!!!

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

It was you, Anthony and I was talking to.

 

Regarding the starting issue, have you changed the fuel pump?

 

I had the same problem; restarting after turning off when hot, would refuse to start. Turned out fuel pump was bushed

Edited September 22, 2012 by Paul_13

[pugtop 0]

Believe me there's plenty of fuel..... not sure if any of my spare pumps are any good! Need a hp pressure tester next!

[pugtop 0]

Many thanks for all the help, managed to get the temp sensor from GSF today, fitted it, adjusted the throttle stop screw about 1/2 turn and BINGO, sorted. This is what tech forums are for!