[trackday_prep] 405 Mi16 Track Car

[JeffR 51]

The final issue to deal with in the bell housing area was the length of the release/thrust bearing tube.
The stack height of the AP twin plate clutch assembly was causing an issue with the clearance between the tube and the extra height of the AP assembly.
After some calculations, we shortened the tube to work with the above.
A trial assembly should confirm our measurements.

[SweetBadger 94]

I was concerned about the stack height of the twin plate AP clutches with the thicker clutch plates - It wasn't a problem with the sintered plates as they're thinner. I assume you've gone for the thicker paddle type clutch plates?

 

If you have any more trouble with the spoox bearing, Helix do a 50mm one which is a direct fit on a BE3 clutch fork, smaller diameter than specified for the AP clutch, but works fine.

 

If you stick to the max release bearing movement specified by AP (5.5mm),  then on a standard clutch pedal and cable setup you'll end up with about half the pedal travel of the standard clutch. I found the easiest way around this was to move the pull point on the clutch pedal (where the cable attaches to the cable) approx 10mm inwards towards the clutch pedal pivot point - this made the pedal travel similar to standard, and reduced the force required to operate the clutch (super light pedal feel!).

[JeffR 51]

Yes, using the paddle type clutch plates.
I wanted to persevere with the Spoox bearing as it cost a motza. I think all is in order now. I imagine the Helix 50mm would be a contributor to a lighter pedal too.
I’ll probably adjust the clutch with a low pedal initially and keep the release movement in line with the recommended 5 to 5.5mm travel. It's a big job to remove the pedal box on a 405 too.
Did a dummy assembly with a spare bell housing and the shortened tube today, and my calculations appear spot on. Clearance everywhere!

[JeffR 51]

Been a while since the last update.

 

I didn’t like the feel of the low pedal idea, so decided to make an adjustable bracket mounted to the floor to limit the pedal travel. I was able to measure the release bearing movement through the bell housing vent holes while a mate slowly pushed down the pedal. When I had the recommended 5 mm travel I locked the pedal stop adjuster.

 

Next job was to find why I still have low oil pressure (29psi).

 

Fitted another new oil filter (Purflux LS867B) replacing the Fiamm equalivent-no change.
Replaced the cheap Chinese oil pressure transducer with an indecently expensive Honeywell one-no change.
Removed and dismantled the Pace Slim Jim pump-all in excellent condition internally so I expect no improvement there but haven't yet run the engine to confirm.
Recent surgery has me banned from the garage for another couple of weeks but I’m running out of ideas of where to look next.

[JeffR 51]

OK, finally got clearance from the doc to continue mucking about with the race car.
Unfortunately more (frustrating) news on the low oil pressure issue.

 

Using Penrite 10W-40 mineral running in oil.

 

A recap-
*Replaced the Fiamm oil filter with a Purflux LS 867B which I’ve used exclusively in my 1.9 engine (until supplies became scarce). Sourced new supplies now.

*Dismantled the Pace Slim Jim pump. No apparent wear.

*Swapped the cheap Chinese oil pressure transducer showing only 29psi for a better quality (Honeywell) one. Same 29psi.

*Fitted a mechanical oil pressure gauge-same 29 psi.

*Checked that the supply to the oil gallery from the feed where the original oil pump feeds the gallery through the block port was the same between alloy & iron block. The Pace sump flange blanks this off as oil supply is fed directly into the oil gallery.

*On assembly checked the spray jets underneath the pistons are operating correctly and not jammed open.

 

I can only conclude that there’s something internally causing a leak from the oil supply causing a decrease in oil pressure.
What have I missed?

 

[SRDT 182]

On some old Peugeot engines using the wrong oil pressure warning switch can uncover a hole between the oil gallery and the sump, the problem is that you can't check the oil pressure if you put the original switch back.

[speaksgeek 5]

Pressure relief valve on the pump? Has it been wound in/out for some reason?

[JeffR 51]

On 2/5/2019 at 7:21 AM, SRDT said:

On some old Peugeot engines using the wrong oil pressure warning switch can uncover a hole between the oil gallery and the sump, the problem is that you can't check the oil pressure if you put the original switch back.

Thanks for your suggestion, however I can't see anything that fits your description.

 

Do you know which family of engines you referred too? Mine is an XU9 head on an XU10 block.

[JeffR 51]

10 hours ago, speaksgeek said:

Pressure relief valve on the pump? Has it been wound in/out for some reason?

When I dismantled the pump I checked to see if the spring had broken or the piston jammed. Both were OK and I reset it back to the same position it was previously in.

[welshpug 1,661]

can you test the pump pressure off the engine?

 

maybe a jerry rigged track pump (floor standing bicycle pump)  or a footpump and see what pressure you get up to?  ive testrd fuel presaure regulators with them (and airhorns! l

[speaksgeek 5]

Along the same lines, can you use your tank air feed to pressurise the system? See if it will simply hold 100psi or whatever the high threshold is.

 

A complex test could be to setup the pump and belt on the bench with some dummy lines and a pressure vessel. Maybe the engineering firm would jury rig up a stand so you could put the pump drive into the lathe chuck to drive it at various speeds.

Edited February 6, 2019 by speaksgeek

[JeffR 51]

Yep, thanks to you both. The next step is to confirm if the pump is capable of delivering the pressure required. I need 100psi cold oil pressure to give me 55-60psi when hot.

[SRDT 182]

21 hours ago, JeffR said:

Thanks for your suggestion, however I can't see anything that fits your description.

 

Do you know which family of engines you referred too? Mine is an XU9 head on an XU10 block.

It's on older engines like 404 or 104 ones and I never heard of that on a XU but it's a really sneaky way to loose oil pressure.

As you doesn't have the OEM pressure switch bolted it was worth to at least give it some thought.

[JeffR 51]

Some good news and some embarrassing news!

Oil pressure problem identified and solved. I now have full pressure again. Huge relief.

Embarrassing news that it was ‘operator error’. No need to go into detail.

Abraham Lincoln or Mark Twain once said-“Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt”.

[speaksgeek 5]

Pretty sure that quote is from Donald Trump.

[Tom Fenton 1,542]

I prefer

 

"He who never screws anything up, never actually does anything"

 

Might be useful to say what it was to maybe stop someone else doing the same!

[SRDT 182]

[JeffR 51]

Now the oil pressure problem is behind me, the last issue to tackle is the vibration under braking.

Since the current DS3000 pads were nearing their end of life and I had a new set handy, all I needed was a new pair of front discs. Installing the pads gave me a chance to try out my multi piston re-seating tool too.

 

I thought for the few $$$ of some Coupe discs better than removing the steering rack with the associated problems of hydraulic fluid everywhere and reinstalling which would need string lines to set the toe in/out again. So hopefully I’ve overcome the braking problem.
If not, I’ll look at the rack as a last resort.

Which gets me to the end of the ‘to do’ list. I’ll be on the phone to my engine tuner this coming week to organise a dyno tuning session.

Can’t wait.

 

[camgti 56]

Nice one Jeff. Any updates? 

 

Love the car. Its so clean, props to you! 

 

Cam

[JeffR 51]

Still waiting to hear back from Chasers. They have a second branch in New Caledonia servicing the nutters with their de-limited high powered Ford pick ups (aka SUV’s) to tear up the island and terrorise the feral pigs!
He (Paul) spends several blocks of the year over there catering to their wishes.
I’m informed he’s scheduled to return soon.
My plan is once the car is tuned, do a test day at Winton and if all is well a sprint session at Sandown and Phillip Island before putting it up for sale.
Unfortunately, poor heath has forced this decision on me.

[camgti 56]

Sad to hear. Hope you can use it a few more times. 

 

Whoever gets into it will no doubt love it

 

feel better soon

[JeffR 51]

Good news in that the car finally gets tuned next Tuesday.

 

Hopefully a good result and some more fun times before it's time to pass it on.

[camgti 56]

How was did it all go Jeff? 

[JeffR 51]

Yeah, the tuning went OK. Had a few issues like partially stale fuel, and the neg camber front hubs/AO50 race tyre combo not ideal for a twin roller dyno.
Only the inner half of the tyre made good contact on the rollers (Dyno Dynamics) but soon overheated causing slippage.
Engine made between 10-15Kw more power than the 1.9 so calculated around 190-195hp at the wheels.
Next opportunity I get I'll use a hub dyno taking the tyre slippage out of the equation.

 

[JeffR 51]

I've decided to skip the testing at Winton and hope its first outing at MSCA Round 6 at Sandown on June 23 is successful with no issues-fingers crossed.