[trackday_prep] 4bie Motorsport Build

[cammmy 1]

I promised Alex I would put this up, so here goes.

 

After pouring money into my neglected (by the previous owners) 4bie I decided that I just couldn't rely on it to get to work, and that something needed to be done.

 

My options were:

 

1: Sell the car and lose A LOT of money

2: Put the car into storage

3: Strip the car out and race it.

 

I went with option 3

 

The car as it was

 

 

 

 

I started by stripping out the interior and putting some sticky, semi-slicks on

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 27, 2010 by cammmy

[cammmy 1]

This left the car sitting WAY to high, so I got some GAZ GGA Gold's for the front (adjusting the hight at the rear to match). This allowed me to get it a bit lower

 

 

 

 

 

 

To prevent oil surge, I have fitted a deeper, baffled sump, an extended pickup, 5 bar relief soring and a windage tray (BIG difference aver 4,500rpm). I also have an XU10 pump sprocket and chain to go in.

 

 

Unfortunately I don't have any pics of the tray.

 

[cammmy 1]

I have now also installed a proper FIA approved fixed back bucket

 

 

As you have no doubt seen. My paint is not exactly in the best condition and the car has been in an accident at some point, hence the front not being quite straight.

 

I plan to fix this by re-shelling my gear into this 4bie which I have recently purchased. It had the cambelt go on it.

 

 

 

 

Note the straight front end, decent paint and non-sunroof. All things I was going to have to fix myself at much greater expense.

 

I have also done small things to the motor such as disconnecting the throttle body heater (rarely gets cold enough to need it here) and have stopped the crank case venting into the inlet.

 

will update when I get the new car and begin transferring the parts accross

 

[AlexN 7]

Looks good! The new shell you've got hold of looks in really good condition. Not having a sunroof is a major bonus as well! They aren't easy things to patch up neatly (although Colin did a very nice job on mine!).

 

It's truly amazing how much crap you can drag out of a 405, the weight saving potential is huge! It was really good fun stripping the car out! Your front shocks look very familiar as well! It will be interesting to see how you find the rear suspension fairs on track. Are you going to use a higher pressure sphere? We'll have to compare notes once they are both up and running!

[cammmy 1]

Yeah, the non-sunroof is an epic find as I thought it was standard. I've probably taken about 100kg out of the car so for with the definate potential for more. Will start again and take it further on the new shell.

 

Indeed, I have Nikica to thank for the struts . Will get a selection of sphere's to try going up to the highest pressure possible. I've raised the car a bit since that pic, the back definately didn't like the hight it was at. Could be a very old sphere in there though.

 

Brother is also making me a strut brace. Will probably just use a bit of steel box section or similar straight across between the struts.

 

I imagine the rears susp would do okay on the track. It's more the rough roads I plan to be racing on that I'm worried about.

[cammmy 1]

I saw a Tomcat Turbo at Pick-a-Part (a wreckers where you take the bits off yourself). I seized the opportunity and as a result

 

 

 

Cost me about 40 pounds

 

I believe it to be a T25 or TB25 but not sure. It says P\N 465199-3S on it. Would be could if anyone can confirm.

 

Will rebuild it and have the housings thermal barrier coated. Will then go about fitting it to my other Mi engine and after that is all rebuilt an tuned, i'll slap it in (once my current engine is worn)

Edited June 6, 2010 by cammmy

[welshpug 1,655]

ahh GAZ did eventually get some sorted for the 405

 

you mention different pressure sphered, is this the pressure of the gas pocket inside? I'd guess something like a V6 xantia activa Auto to have pretty firm ones

[cammmy 1]

Yeah, higher pressure gas. Think you can just have spheres re-gassed to whatever you want (up to it's limit) so may do that.

 

Do spheres from different models have different fittings? Also, wouldn't whatever I use need to be even higher pressure again, as it's one of them damping two wheels as opposed to one each like on the cits?

 

Yeah got the GAZ's, they rule!

 

Looks like the turbo is a TB2555. Max power on the Tomcat's seems to be made at 6100rpm and torque at about 2200. I want peak torque at about 5500-6000 and power at about 7,000 - 7,500. Will this be too small? Could I fit two in there or would that just mean stupid amounts of back pressure at higher RPM?

Edited June 7, 2010 by cammmy

[welshpug 1,655]

not sure on the specifics of the spheres sorry.

 

why do you want the torque so high up?

 

[cammmy 1]

It peaks at 5,500 standard doesn't it? I probably don't drop below 4,500 when really going for it.

 

When I start racing I'll see what kind of rev's i'm holding and can plan better from there.

[welshpug 1,655]

Mine peaks at 4090 rpm.

[cammmy 1]

really?

 

I've read everywhere that the XU9J4 peaks at 5,500. The below shows the following for torque:

 

http://www.mi16.nl/main.htm

 

4,000 - 163nm

4,500 - 169nm

5,000 - 180nm

6,500 - 173nm

 

That would put peak torque at around 5,000 possibly higher. Not taking it as gospel but it's in-line with everything else I have read.

[rodionski 3 1 Cars]

Every single place I've looked has 5000 as the peak torque revs.

[welshpug 1,655]

ah, Mine is an XU10

 

peaks at 182 Nm @ 4k, though has less under there than the 1.9, it holds above 165Nm all the way to 6700, second peak at 6k of 172Nm.

 

shorter stroke so I'm not surprised there's less torque, though its a larger bore.

 

RR'd at 162bhp @ 6800.

[rodionski 3 1 Cars]

Sorry I meant every D6C, the only REAL engine. LOL

[KRISKARRERA 2 1 Cars]

5000rpm for 1.9 and 3500rpm for 2.0, though it never seems to work out that way on a rolling road. Gti6 is 5500rpm though I think.

[cammmy 1]

Friend had the Mi16x4 motor in his 205 dyno'd. Power curve was still going up when it hit the limiter. He doesn't know if his has been worked though.

 

Is there any point in going to the red on a 4bie? I don't feel the power drop off but I've made a couple of tweaks that help in the higher revs.

[rodionski 3 1 Cars]

Friend had the Mi16x4 motor in his 205 dyno'd. Power curve was still going up when it hit the limiter. He doesn't know if his has been worked though.

 

Is there any point in going to the red on a 4bie? I don't feel the power drop off but I've made a couple of tweaks that help in the higher revs.

 

On my D6C the only rev range that works on the track is 5000-7000 rpm, in any case not below 4000-4500.

Can you share those tweaks?

[cammmy 1]

Disconnected throttle body heating (doesn't really get that cold here very often at all), disconnected crank case breather to throttle body (put a filter on it an blocked off the holes on the TB), re-mapped chip. They probably didn't make much of a difference on their own but the windage I put in there tray definately did!!!

[MiCRO 0]

Disconnected throttle body heating (doesn't really get that cold here very often at all), disconnected crank case breather to throttle body (put a filter on it an blocked off the holes on the TB), re-mapped chip. They probably didn't make much of a difference on their own but the windage I put in there tray definately did!!!

 

 

Can you please tell me what's the windage tray, and what difference has it made above 4500rpm as you mentioned?

[cammmy 1]

 

http://www.taylor-eng.com/sump/wetsump.htm

 

Sits very close to the crank. This stops oil being caught in the vortex created by the crank spinning at high RPM. As a result drag is reduced and the engine is freed up to put more power to the wheels

 

The higher the RPM, the bigger the difference it will make.

 

I also imagine it would increase fuel economy but not sure how much.

[MiCRO 0]

 

http://www.taylor-eng.com/sump/wetsump.htm

 

Sits very close to the crank. This stops oil being caught in the vortex created by the crank spinning at high RPM. As a result drag is reduced and the engine is freed up to put more power to the wheels

 

The higher the RPM, the bigger the difference it will make.

 

I also imagine it would increase fuel economy but not sure how much.

 

Thanks mate

[cammmy 1]

Also check out the sump baffling information. I went with an XU10 baffled sump plus oil pickup extension.

[MiCRO 0]

Also check out the sump baffling information. I went with an XU10 baffled sump plus oil pickup extension.

 

 

Mine is a XU9J4/Z, so I guess it has a baffled sump as I read something on taylor-eng, and this upgrades look great & usefull, but since they're not plug & play I don't think I'm gonna do it, but I never use my car on a track, so it's not so important for me is it?

[cammmy 1]

XU9J4Z is the same block as the XU9J4 is it not? If you have a look at your sump and it's finned+has the spacer, you can do what I did.

 

Have tray fitted to spacer

Fit pre-baffled XU10 or XU9 (from non-J4 motor that has A/C) baffled sump

Have oil pickup extended.

 

Easy as. The only mod you have to do (and I mean you HAVE to do this) is drill out the hole in the sump flange to acommodate the dowel that goes through the spacer. There is a hole in the later sumps already but it's not big enough. Unfortunately as a result I have cracked my sump flange and am leaking oil. Will need to replace the sump but you live and learn

 

Alternatively you could keep your current sump and purchase the baffle kit from Peter. This means you do not need a pickup extension. You just fit the tray and baffle.

 

If you want me to let you know exactly what you need and what needs to be done, just send me a PM. We'll get you sorted out