Thoughts Please

[hudson 10]

I Apreciate this had probably been done to death but my searches haven't turned up much I have bought and had fit a16v mi engine to

My road rally car the engine has been properly built and run in and mated to all the correct bits ie gearbox shafts diff and suspension one thing I would like some advice on is with all the info with regard to oil surge I have been looking into methods to prevent it one being dry sumping and the other piece of kit I have read through this site is such a thing as an accusump. I have been in contact with pace and got a price of 1082 pounds not bad considering the cost of a proper motor rebuild how does the accusump shape up does anyone have any info with regard to either plus or against .the engine has been built with a pts trap door gti6 sump and pump and pickup all the usual mods I've read about on here is this enough without the cash spending ?? The accusump is a lot cheaper but if your oil pressure has dropped to allow the kit to work is there any point in it as damage could already be done or am I reading into the working of it wrong

[kyepan 291]

We had a thread on here recently about this, and it came largely down to the fact that very few people had bothered to fit a mechanical sender and actually see what the pressure was doing and if the pressure was an issue post mods. You're in the best place already having sorted everything else to do spend the small amount of time and effort fitting a mechanical gauge / and nice big warning light, followed by a bit of gentle testing.

 

Then you can make a decision about the dry sump / accusump from an informed position about whether it's actually needed for the kinds of things you do with the car. One mans need is another mans excess and vice versa.

Edited May 8, 2012 by kyepan

[Baz 421]

Exactly, & to add in my experience not one engine is the same as another.

[petert 588]

I've recently added a Moroso 1.5Q accumulator to my 205. It works very well for what it's intended to do. It gives approx. 10 secs of oil pressure. In addition to the oil pressure gauge not moving, you know if its been working by touching it. After a recent sprint, it was warm at one end and cold at the other. I chose it over the Accusump as Summit are currently including mounting brackets for free.

 

The electric valve gives you the ability to pre-lube a cold engine. ie turn the key, wait for the oil pressure to rise, then start the engine.

Edited May 10, 2012 by petert

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

What about the oil level in the sump if it discharges at idle? Can you have ~1Q extra it it without the crank hitting the oil?

[petert 588]

It will partially discharge at idle, but as soon as the revs increase the pressure in the accumulator will match the gallery pressure, +6psi. Not really a problem in a race car. If concerned about this, you can add a pressure switch (30, 45 or 60psi) so it only turns on when oil pressure drops to that value.

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

I don't think you want switch it off based on pressure, cause it will not fully charge the accumulator on the straight end just before that sharp corner where you need it.

And it might add some response time to the accumulator.

 

Up to what level do you fill your sump? max on the stick with accumulator partly filled or accumulator empty?

I was looking at a 4cup Accusump, but I can get away with a 1,5Q Moroso, I prefer that one (cheaper). (Mi16 sump with Constella baffle)

[petert 588]

It fully charges on the inlet, using a one way valve. Only discharging becomes pressure dependent.

 

You check the oil level when the accumulator is full.

[hudson 10]

Anyone a link for the moroso unit supplier please

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

Accusump dealers in the UK

http://www.performanceunlimited.co.uk/

http://www.thinkauto.com

 

Moroso units can be found on ebay in the US.

[petert 588]

Moroso 1.5Q with manual valve:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MOR-23901/

[unariciflocos 49 1 Cars]

I hope I won't sound retarded saying this, but that's basically just like the expansion tank on a closed circuit heating system.

 

One may even be able to use an expansion tank for this purpose maybe . A 2 liter expansion tank costs peanuts, works up to 10 bar, 110C, my only concern would be how the rubber inside would cope with the oil.

Edited May 11, 2012 by unariciflocos

[welshpug 1,661]

Aren't these accumulators a bit like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted?

 

I mean if the oil pressure drops low enough to need the accumulator's assistance, the damage is/has already been done surely?

[j_turnell 137 3 Cars]

The only real cure is dry sump, so is it worth trying anything else? I agree with Baz that it does appear to differ between engines but is it worth the risk esp with an expensive competition engine.

[unariciflocos 49 1 Cars]

The only real cure is dry sump, so is it worth trying anything else? I agree with Baz that it does appear to differ between engines but is it worth the risk esp with an expensive competition engine.

 

Peter said his 1.5 liter accumulator holds pressure for 10 seconds, go up to 2 or 3 liters and you should be set for any corner you should encounter. So yes, it is worth trying anything else if it's going to cost 200 quid instead of 1100.

 

Aren't these accumulators a bit like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted?

 

I mean if the oil pressure drops low enough to need the accumulator's assistance, the damage is/has already been done surely?

 

If you don't use the actuated valve then it's not, the accumulator will play the role of the pump for as long as it has oil in it. Let's say that you have 2 bar air pressure in the accumulator's air chamber, as soon as oil pressure is down to 1.9 bar then oil will flow from the accumulator to the galleries.

Edited May 11, 2012 by unariciflocos