Fast Road/occasional Track Day Setup And Tyres

[Jarrus 3]

Hi,

 

I know I've posted before on this subject but bare with me...

seen these on eBay:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Set-Peugeot-205-GTi-Goup-N-Challenge-Bilstein-Shock-Absorbers-Tarmac-Springs-/270968157510?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3f16f5f546

 

A good buy or am I best spending my money else where? I was thinking of using 21mm TBs for the rear and an uprated ARB of some kind,

 

It's for my 1.8 TD Mardi Gras spec using the standard front ARB

 

Also what tyre size can I run? I've seen Rallyeash running a 185/60R14 and now a 195/50R15 on a rallye shell when I thought this wasn't possible without body work

 

Cheers

 

Brett

[Jarrus 3]

SO I bought so second hand GAZ coilovers from a guy on here and some Billie rears, Think he was running them on his 1.9, He recons they were about 180 lb front springs and he said he was running 21mm rear bars (I think) this ok for a fast road car that will see loads of b roads? I am considering going around europe a bit with this, do you think I should go for heavier front springs to go with the fact I'm going to be using an XUD either in 1.8 or 1.9 form? Plus I was still looking into running bigger and wider tyres, any advise on those still

 

Cheers

 

Brett

[Anthony 1,002]

180lb springs and 21mm torsion bars will be fine for fast road use.

 

With the heavier engine you might want to check how much free travel you've got before the springs go coilbound, but otherwise should be fine.

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

180lb springs should be a good match for the 21mm bars, a very nice setup for a fast road car IMO.

[Batfink 201]

Might be worth chatting to Kyepan. He has ditched his 180lb springs/gaz setup for Bilstein Challenge Dampers and Eibach Springs. He can give a good explanation of why and a comparison...

[Jarrus 3]

180lb springs and 21mm torsion bars will be fine for fast road use.

 

With the heavier engine you might want to check how much free travel you've got before the springs go coilbound, but otherwise should be fine.

 

Whn you say coil bound, you mean when the coils touch together? Sorry for the retardation but engines are my thing and suspension isn't, hence me asking...

But you would still think that the extra weight won't be an issue? I have it on good authority that the XUD turbo diesel is about the same weight as a GTI6 engine.

[Baz 421]

Coilovers are overkill for what you want, especially those IMO I'm afraid.

 

I'd keep it simple and stick with decent Bilstein/Koni fixed height type dampers.

[Jarrus 3]

I got them for a good price, plus I did think about going into Rallycross eventually...maybe....or just doing track days.....but for now back road fun machine is what it will be,

 

anyone want to comment on tyres?

[kyepan 291]

With a bit of tweaking you can get the gaz reasonably well set up, the rear adjustable damping is probably more important as it lets you set the rear at a rate to match the 21mm bars. They won't ever ride as well over b road surfaces as normal road dampers or billies partly because of the lack of rebound and partly because they are cheap. But that said they are perfect as a cheap track day set up if you want to fiddle with damping and see how it affects balance and ride. Arguably billies are better rears for standard size torsion bars.

 

Start With the fronts ten clicks from soft and go from there, 15-18 clicks is about as hard as you want to run on the road before it starts bouncing off stuff rather than riding over it. If your on smooth surfaces upwards of 25 clicks and you'll have a fairly pointy front end..

 

I used to run the Rears a smidge harder than the fronts

[kyepan 291]

I would not mind hearing the answer to tyres also, something that is super progressive soft sidewall, lots of feel.

[johnnyboy666 195 1 Cars]

sorry to butt in a bit, but the guy from gaz who I ordered mine from suggested around 250lb springs for track use

[Jarrus 3]

Probably with R888s or AD08's etc... Far to stiff for what I want really....It's a fun car not something that will set the world a light...

[johnnyboy666 195 1 Cars]

ive got 275lbs on my road car and theyre very comfortable, even with the shagloads of potholes around here. Although this is with a tu3 engine so that may have some effect I suppose

[Baz 421]

Way too hard. They classically always over-advise on spring rates. You'd think they know about these things...

 

Compliance is massively under-rated it seems.

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

250/275lb springs with standard rear bars will be utter s*ite IMO. I reckon that sort of spring rate would require 23mm bars to make it anything like.

[welshpug 1,646]

180lb/21mm works very nicely with the right dampers

 

think mine are 9" springs.

[allye 530 3 Cars]

Just to answer your question about Ash's Rallye, he cut back his arches to make way for the bigger wheels/wider track. Also he's running really really hard set up!

[johnnyboy666 195 1 Cars]

they feel quite soft if anything (maybe I've got my wires crossed and theyre 175lb!) either way my beam is shagged currently so i'll get a better impression when my freshly rebuilt one gets stuck on, I do have a thick ARB too.

 

these are only temp springs before the engine swap anyway, as they are shorter than I expect to need with a heavier engine in

[Jarrus 3]

Just to answer your question about Ash's Rallye, he cut back his arches to make way for the bigger wheels/wider track. Also he's running really really hard set up!

 

Ah right ok, I guess then I'll have to cut back the arches to run a 185/60/14 then?

[kyepan 291]

with 250lbs springs it will understeer.. and only understeer. If you want a compliant balanced setup, go for 190lbs.

 

have a search for my gaz suspension thread, i went through all of this before, save yourself some time and hassle!

Edited May 15, 2012 by kyepan

[Jarrus 3]

Will have a look for that thread mate, cheers

 

What ARB's should I use? Bare in mind mine isn't a GTI its a Mardi Gras TD, it does have the GTI front subframe though...

[kyepan 291]

Front is either standard or no bar at all, rear 24 mm seems to be the norm.

[Jarrus 3]

Easy enough, cheers,