Engine Oil For Competition Use

[thomasrally 3]

What engine oil does everyone use for competition use?

 

I've been using Semi-synthetic Mobil 1 10w/40 but last time we changed the oil after 2-3 events it was like water so wonder whether there's better ones out there more upto the job?

[oilman 7]

Hi

 

Semi-synthetics break down pretty quickly with hard use, a full synthetic (ester based ideally) is a better choice.

 

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/c-657-10w-40-engine-oil.aspx

 

The Gulf Competition, Millers CFS, Redline and Motul 300V are the best options.

 

Cheers

 

Tim

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

What engine is it, I know from experience that a straight oil works well in 8v's with high lift cam's, compared to any Full or Semi synth, to the degree of having zero bucket wear compared to knocking the buckets out every 3 races, this is 230bhp 8v's thou.

Takes a while longer to build up full pressure but maintains it better

[feb 47]

What engine is it, I know from experience that a straight oil works well in 8v's with high lift cam's, compared to any Full or Semi synth, to the degree of having zero bucket wear compared to knocking the buckets out every 3 races, this is 230bhp 8v's thou.

Takes a while longer to build up full pressure but maintains it better

 

Other 205 experts say the same for a 8V. Why is that though and a synthetic doesn't work well on a 8V?

 

I was thinking of using a synthetic 10W-50 e.g. Fuchs/Silkolene for summer/track use without an oil cooler. Would that be a problem?

Edited February 24, 2012 by feb

[Redtop 14 2 Cars]

 

 

Other 205 experts say the same for a 8V. Why is that though and a synthetic doesn't work well on a 8V?

 

I was thinking of using a synthetic 10W-50 e.g. Fuchs/Silkolene for summer/track use without an oil cooler. Would that be a problem?

 

A problem with the modern oils, is that the likes of zinc and other products are taken out of them to avoid damaging the cat converters so they have a longer life span. The modern engines are built to tolerate the new types of oil, but when used in an older engine components can wear a lot faster. My friend who builds racing vw engines said he noticed a lot of cam lobe wear on some of his engines when a certain oil was used.

[alync406 4]

What engine is it, I know from experience that a straight oil works well in 8v's with high lift cam's, compared to any Full or Semi synth, to the degree of having zero bucket wear compared to knocking the buckets out every 3 races, this is 230bhp 8v's thou.

Takes a while longer to build up full pressure but maintains it better

 

I have just rebuilt the engine in my 205 1.6 and have fitted a high lift cam and am running throttle bodies. I am soon going to be running in the engine and have'nt decided on what oil to use in it yet after, I was thinking fully syntethic but from what you are saying would I be better just using a mineral oil in it?

[brumster 135 1 Cars]

Redline Racing 10W40 here. Wouldn't trust my engine on anything else.

[welshpug 1,675]

a few mates just run millers or standard Total 10-40 in rally cars.

[petert 607]

What engine is it, I know from experience that a straight oil works well in 8v's with high lift cam's, compared to any Full or Semi synth, to the degree of having zero bucket wear compared to knocking the buckets out every 3 races, this is 230bhp 8v's thou.

Takes a while longer to build up full pressure but maintains it better

 

Definitely a lack of zinc here. Add a tube of Crane Break-In lube (or Compcams equivalent).

 

http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=crane%20break-in%20lube&source=web&cd=5&ved=0CEAQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fcranecams.com%2Fuploads%2Fbreakin%2F548e.pdf&ei=wxhIT9eNDZGPiAfdjPGlDg&usg=AFQjCNEvMYuYCSaQvqTTvGfg3eQ4WfSOOw&cad=rja

Edited February 24, 2012 by petert

[matt.f 16]

a few mates just run millers or standard Total 10-40 in rally cars.

and a well known engine builder uses Shell helix

[thomasrally 3]

a few mates just run millers or standard Total 10-40 in rally cars.

 

Both semi-synthetic oils?

[feb 47]

and a well known engine builder uses Shell helix

 

SBC.

I have always been using that in my sorrento without problems.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Give Sunoco (76 racing) a call, top range of oil's inc Running in oil, they'll point you in the right direction as this is where the 8v oil used to come from years ago

[oilman 7]

If you are racing or rallying your car then you need to consider your oil choice carefully as the stock manufacturers recommended oils will not give you the protection that your engine requires under stressed conditions.

 

A standard oil will not be thermally stable enough to cope with higher temperatures without "shearing" meaning that the oil will not give the same protection after a couple of thousand miles as it it when it was new.

 

Let’s start with the fundamentals. An engine is a device for converting fuel into motive power. Car enthusiasts get so deep into the details they lose sight of this!

 

To get more power, an engine must be modified such that it converts more fuel per minute into power than it did in standard form. To produce 6.6 million foot-pounds per minute of power (ie 200 BHP) a modern engine will burn about 0.5 litres of fuel per minute.(Equivalent to 18mpg at 120mph). So, to increase this output to 300BHP or 9.9 million foot-pounds per minute it must be modified to burn (in theory) 0.75 litres.

 

However, fuel efficiency often goes out of the window when power is the only consideration, so the true fuel burn will be rather more than 0.75 litres/min.

 

That’s the fundamental point, here’s the fundamental problem:

 

Less than 30% of the fuel (assuming it’s petrol) is converted to all those foot-pounds. The rest is thrown away as waste heat. True, most of it goes down the exhaust, but over 10% has to be eliminated from the engine internals, and the first line of defence is the oil.

 

More power means a bigger heat elimination problem. Every component runs hotter; For instance, piston crowns and rings will be running at 280-300C instead of a more normal 240-260C, so it is essential that the oil films on cylinder walls provide an efficient heat path to the block casting, and finally to the coolant.

 

Any breakdown or carbonisation of the oil will restrict the heat transfer area, leading to serious overheating.

 

A modern synthetic lubricant based on true temperature-resistant synthetics is essential for long-term reliability. At 250C+, a mineral or hydrocracked mineral oil, particularly a 5W/X or 10W/X grade, is surprisingly volatile, and an oil film around this temperature will be severely depleted by evaporation loss.

 

Back in the 1970s the solution was to use a thick oil, typically 20W/50; in the late 1980s even 10W/60 grades were used. But in modern very high RPM engines with efficient high-delivery oil pumps thick oils waste power, and impede heat transfer in some situations.

 

A light viscosity good synthetic formulated for severe competition use is the logical and intelligent choice for the 21^st century.

 

You must seriously consider a "true" synthetic for "shear stability" and the right level of protection.

 

Petroleum oils tend to have low resistance to “shearing” because petroleum oils are made with light weight basestocks to begin with, they tend to burn off easily in high temperature conditions which causes deposit formation and oil consumption.

As a result of excessive oil burning and susceptibility to shearing (as well as other factors) petroleum oils must be changed more frequently than synthetics.

 

True synthetic oils (PAO’s and Esters) contain basically no waxy contamination to cause crystallization and oil thickening at cold temperatures. In addition, synthetic basestocks do not thin out very much as temperatures increase. So, pour point depressants are unnecessary and higher viscosity basestock fluids can be used which will still meet the "W" requirements for pumpability.

 

Hence, little or no VI improver additive would need to be used to meet the sae 30, 40 or 50 classification while still meeting 0W or 5W requirements.

 

The end result is that very little shearing occurs within true synthetic oils because they are not "propped up" with viscosity index improvers. There simply is no place to shear back to. In fact, this is easy to prove by just comparing synthetic and petroleum oils of the same grade.

 

Of course, the obvious result is that your oil remains "in grade" for a much longer period of time for better engine protection and longer oil life.

 

Worth knowing before you use an oil that may not be up to the job.

 

Cheers

[edbar 6]

I use shell helix 10w40, Engine is spotless internally and no wear on components so far, as recommended by SBC.

[thomasrally 3]

I use shell helix 10w40, Engine is spotless internally and no wear on components so far, as recommended by SBC.

 

This one? http://www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/p/car-accessories/engine-oils-and-car-fluids/engineoils/10w40-engine-oil/?521772251&0&cc5_245

[edbar 6]

Yeah thats the one, make sure you get the petrol one and not diesel.