Sub Frame Stitch Welding >

[Cameron 16]

I wasn't going to make a big deal out of this, but since the thread has been re-opened..

 

The whole point of welding is getting good/full penetration of which i have plenty of, looks are not important unless you are a pro or care that much about looks.

 

This is absolutely not true I'm afraid! To get proper consistent penetration you need to have ALL of the following - clean metal, a steady hand to advance the weld at the correct speed, he correct heat settings, the correct wire speed, the correct torch angle. Funnily enough, these are also the things you need to have ALL of in order to get a good looking weld! The two are hand-in-hand, if your weld is not neat and uniform then you have compromised it in some way.

 

You hear a lot of people waving their dicks around saying their welding "may not be neat, but it sure is strong" but this is 100% bulls*it.

 

Take it as some constructive criticism, when I look at your pictures I see many many things wrong with your welds - porosity from where you haven't had the weld area clean enough or have had the torch too far from the work, gaps (which will concentrate stresses and encourage cracking) in the welds from stop-starts or where you haven't been steady enough, high weld beads indicative of not enough heat and too much wire - to name a few! None of these things make for a nice strong weld and funnily enough, none of them look good.

Edited December 1, 2011 by Cameron

[SurGie 54]

Sad very sad, the forum sounds like a bunch of women.

 

Double post

[SurGie 54]

What picture's

[marksorrento205 80]

You are the sad one. Yor think people are attacking you when all Cameron is doing is offering you guidance and advice on your welding! Take the advice and use it to improve your welding.

[SurGie 54]

 

Sorry must be internet ex 9

[SurGie 54]

This internet is well bad tonight

[SurGie 54]

[SurGie 54]

It makes me laugh how the mig welding that was done by the manufacturer on this frame around the wishbone bolt hole sections etc, are higher than any of my welds and look less penetrated around the edges. This sub frame is totally original and has lasted the 16 years of road driving at over 100k worth of miles, yet the frame/welds are straight and true. So i have no worries it will easily out last another 16 years

 

Far far worse than this type of practice welding i have done in the middle section.

 

 

I did try to hammer break those welds apart and the steel started to rip, not the welds. It was easy on the clean steel but as said, oil was in-between the sheets of spot welded steel. The sub frame was filthy with grease/oil. The welder was set with the same volts & gas, wire speed was a bit lower though. I think i should have sand blasted the whole thing after its clean.

Edited December 2, 2011 by SurGie

[SurGie 54]

Not you Cameron

 

The main point for me is that the welds are strong enough not to break before the steel does, the settings were almost the same as the welded previous pic i posted. I will have a go at one of the welds with a chisel and hammer, so truly see if they are strong enough. I would rather do it bit by bit then have it bend anywhere. The power was set for the speed i weld, not fast or too slow.

[SurGie 54]

 

I'll practice some more...

[Tom Fenton 1,536]

Stop being such a f***ing child. Either lock the thread once and for all, or leave it unlocked.

[marksorrento205 80]

Be fair Tom!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

It's his ball. If he does not want to share it ...........

[feb 47]

Lock (so that noone can post any arguments), in the meantime go away to look for evidence to argue with the previous comments, post and lock again

Don't take this the bad way.

There is nothing wrong with constructive feedback, if you are not willing to listen to it and you believe certain comments are personal "attacks" then you should seek help. Either stop posting or learn to ignore the comments you don't like. Starting 3 threads with the same title because someone criticised and "spoiled" them is not necessary IMHO.

Don't take everything so seriously, not everyone is out to "catch you".

As for someone's comment about where to stick the wire to, you could tell them to stick it back to theirs instead of asking them if there is need for such comments, that would shut them up probably

I think it's due to the high octane fuel they are sniffing

Edited December 2, 2011 by feb

[chipstick 382 1 Cars]

Lock your thread and be done with it. If you can't handle the heat, get out of the kitchen.

 

You ask for comments when you start 3 'look at me' threads (which should have been put in your project thread, not in a stand alone if you didn't want specific comments on it) and then can't take on board the constructive cristism. Cameron is trying to help you with your welds.

 

Listen to people who know better from experience, ignore people who write without evidence.

[SurGie 54]

There are constructive comments about the threads topic etc but there's no need for the amount of useless spam post's in it. I'm sure other people dont want to waste time reading all the crap, i tried to post another thread in the hope of it being a clean thread.

 

Can we get back on topic ?

 

I have provided evidence and will be testing the welds myself later on, i have no doubt they are strong enough. The wire feed was too fast but the power setting i had on the Portamig welder was set at 2 main volts and 5 fine volts. This is almost the same setting as the 3mm to 1mm practice weld (recent pic) i did before hand. I agree not perfect but good enough not to break at the weld seams. The sub frame thickness is around 2mm to 2mm.

 

Another point about it is, the welding is only to gain stiffness, it's not for constructive strength.

[kyepan 291]

how did this thread get so out of hand.

[harryskid 193]

As to where to stick the wire, it on the metal !

[SurGie 54]

how did this thread get so out of hand.

 

Yeah tell me about it, its still getting off topic posts on it, youngster's telling their elders about the pot and kettle

 

As for the wire, well thats what i must have been doing wrong then.

 

Any more ?

[Lan 24 1 Cars]

You hear a lot of people waving their dicks around saying their welding "may not be neat, but it sure is strong" but this is 100% bulls*it.

 

totally agree with that my dad is a welder and he has always said to me if it looks s*it it is s*it

[SurGie 54]

well if the s*it original welding on the sub frame is s*it then it cant be with it being used for over 16 years of driving and is fine. When i use to practice a while ago i did some s*it looking welds on 3 mm and tested them with the hammer method, they were strong enough not to break the welds but to bend the 3mm steel plate. What more do you need when welds dont break and are stronger than the steel it's self ?

[Daviewonder 533 3 Cars]

I hear what your saying Surgie but I'm sure there's more forces involved that just bending.

[dcc 855]

Just thought I would post this here.

 

What a f*cking boring thread.

 

You can't weld. We dont care. Some people offered some advice, you decided to throw your toys out of the pram. grow the f*** up or just do us a favour and uninstall you o.s.

 

KTHNXBAI

[cheesegrater 43 1 Cars]

I take it seam welding would be overkill. The same level stiffness would be achieved by stitch welding?

[EdCherry 34 1 Cars]

If your going to do a job, do it properly!

 

Echo cameron, s*it looking welds are s*it welds.

 

P.S. Nice to see you deleted the pictures now :wub: :wub:

Edited December 3, 2011 by EdCherry

[Batfink 201]

theres good welding and bad welding. But are people just moaning or saying the welding is not good enough for the job it needs to do?

Surgie - good job for having a go yourself. Shame you are getting so much stick for it. It does not always go 'right' but never be afraid of trying...