Old Car Surprises Civic Type R

[ALEX 98 1 Cars]

They dont handle better imho,

 

If this was any other forum you'd have seriously loosing argument, but then that depends on your term handle.

Better handle as in feed-back and feel or better handle as in quickest round a track?

 

I wouldn't ventrue to different car forums over rating the 205, you'll just end up getting laughed at.

The Gti is still good in comparrison to newer hot hatches, I should know I had one for 9 years! but like already mentioned you cant beat 20 years of innovation.

 

The CTR is a popular choice for many forum uses who like me have "grown old"

Mainly because there's not that much out there that can replace the old girl in terms of value and fun factor.

Edited October 7, 2011 by ALEX

[205_sunderland 4]

If this was any other forum you'd have seriously loosing argument, but then that depends on your term handle.

Better handle as in feed-back and feel or better handle as in quickest round a track?

 

I wouldn't ventrue to different car forums over rating the 205, you'll just end up getting laughed at.

The Gti is still good in comparrison to newer hot hatches, I should know I had one for 9 years! but like already mentioned you cant beat 20 years of innovation.

 

The CTR is a popular choice for many forum uses who like me have "grown old"

Mainly because there's not that much out there that can replace the old girl in terms of value and fun factor.

 

 

I would say a correctly set up gti with correct tyres,suspension and a good beam etc would kill a type r round the twistys. One thing i have learned over the years about gtis is they have there reputation of handling constantly represented by old knakars with poor beams and suspension which in a gti totally kills the flat out handling. A correctly set-up one is a very different story imho ive drove both cars hard and i found the gti superior bar speed of course.

 

Just my thoughts on it

[Mad Scientist 106]

Total tripe!

[lemmingzappa 75 1 Cars]

I'd say alot of people buy 205's for the character and looks though, not because they're after something technically 'better' than these newer cars mentioned. That's not to say 205's don't drive well though !

[dcc 855]

Have to add to this. I had an EP3 type r (2002 model) and it was on rails in corners. So much so I had the confidence to even push it in the wet. If i had to throw a 205 into a corner at 90 or a civic, I would chose the civic every time! Felt so planted as standard!

[205_sunderland 4]

well each to there own but i still prefer them which is why i own one, i could of had a type r for 2500 quid from a friend not long ago and i turned it down, the only time i would even consider my gti being sold is if i get enough saved up this year to get an s1 elise and 1.8t it.

[matt.f 16]

Got both at the minute!

Ep3 facelift type R and modified 1.9 road rallycar(approx 155bhp).Never had them out at the same time but both are toatally different,one heavilly modified so much so that more or less every part on the car is uprated and the civic is standard.

Civics are well known to have THE best gearbox around and it's true,to get the best out of them you have to be on the limit so is a true drivers car and once you hit 6000rpm it goes crazy and rev to 8300rpm!!Awesome reliability aswell.Mine uses no oil whatsoever.

205 is more fun to drive but you can't compare with it's Tran-x etc.

Type r would absolutly wipe the floor with a standard 1.9

[205_sunderland 4]

maybe i just prefer a rough and ready motor haha, the type r boxes are good alot of people are modding exiges at the minute to replace the toyota boxes

[matt.f 16]

A recon BE3 box with decent linkages/bushes and quickshift is a good box imo

[Tesstuff 222]

Rarely would a thread get me to think like this , never mind comment, but 205 Sunderland you do talk utter b0llocks throughout this thread.

 

Sheesh the state of this forum lately

[205_sunderland 4]

not really im talking from my personal experiences ive had of both cars

[ravydavy 0]

I had or built a honda engined 205. Now people who say they have no low down pull or torque are crackers. I had vtec set at 3500rpm. I could be in 4th gear at 20mph and still pull it's nuts off.

 

Make no mistake Peugeot engines are A lump of scrap compared. I don't know of any other 2 litre normally na engine that can healthily and reliably pull over 200bhp per tonne for extended periods of time.

 

The type R engines are forged and balanced with amazing components standard. I pis+ed around with an mi16 for yonks. Putting loads of money in to find nothing but being unreliable.

 

Fitted a Honda engine namely k20a and box. 221bhp standard without mapping and exhaust. 245 with a few mods and complete reliability. pulls in vtec from 3.5k all the way to 9k

 

Do yourself a favour and bin the pug engine. You'll save money in the long run. If not only in petrol.

 

205 sunderland you talk utter crap.

 

David.

[205_sunderland 4]

why is this turing into a huge debate over the engines....again,captain obvious could work out an xu is no match for the 2ltr honda lump. All ive said is i think 205's handle better i wouldnt class that as utter bollox at all.

 

Im really surprised so many people seem to beat their meat to the tune of a vtec. Ive never classed them as quick cars really except for top speed as every car ive owned (except for my first car and previous gti) has been quicker. My corrado at them alive even when charged,my mi16 on r1 bodies seemed to have them aswell so i guess im just confused how peoples mi's couldnt.

[feb 47]

I test drove an ep3 when i had my 1.9 gti and found it gutless low down and mod range. it mau be quicker if driven on the limiter but it doesn't suit my style of driving having to keep the car in a low gear in case an overtake opportunity arises. i find high revving engines with no torque low down a pain for day to day driving. on track its a different story but each to their own.

[Richie 32]

I'm keen to try a VTEC - I'd like either an Accord Type R or Civic Type R EP3, or DC2 Integra whilst the 205 hibernates.

[205_sunderland 4]

I test drove an ep3 when i had my 1.9 gti and found it gutless low down and mod range. it mau be quicker if driven on the limiter but it doesn't suit my style of driving having to keep the car in a low gear in case an overtake opportunity arises. i find high revving engines with no torque low down a pain for day to day driving. on track its a different story but each to their own.

 

Agreed

[Baz 421]

Rarely would a thread get me to think like this , never mind comment, but 205 Sunderland you do talk utter b0llocks throughout this thread.

 

Sheesh the state of this forum lately

 

+1!!!

 

 

We're bigger this guys FFS. I shouldn't really need to, but here goes;

 

It's subjective.

 

I regularly compete in a 205 against modern hatches, and beat them. But sometimes, track layout etc dependant, i don't.

 

On paper, the CTR will eat a 205. But we all know it's not that simple. And there's your answer, it is not directly comparible, to have your answer, you need to put the same driver in both cars across the same distance with the same conditions, but; even then it'll be dependant on the layout of the set course, one car's power delivery/gear ratios/mechanical grip is always going to suit it better than the other & vice-versa!

 

Can we go back to being adults and remember that nothing is simple? Or shall we bring power figures into it...

Edited October 9, 2011 by Baz

[matt.f 16]

They do have a fair bit of go before 6k though,it's not just nothing then it all goes mental.

Man's car with a man's engine end of!

[GLPoomobile 958]

Or shall we bring power figures into it...

 

Shall I give Sarty a call and persuade him to come on here to argue about torque? You'll all regret starting this discussion then

[Mad Scientist 106]

He won't come back though will he, which is a shame. I miss his patronising comments and grammar lessons!

 

The original "argument" was that a 1.9 with as new suspension would "eat" a type r "in the twisties".

 

This statement is typical of someone who loves his chosen marque, be it daily driver or weekend toy.

 

Unfortunately, it's not true, in any like for like situation.

[GLPoomobile 958]

Vtech YO!

[kyepan 291]

Vtech YO!

[ALEX 98 1 Cars]

On another note, off road and very tight twisty country lanes the 205 could have the edge on the CTR!

If bother cars were kept standard.

 

Just to mix things up again

[Batfink 201]

handling and grip are often confused as being the same thing. I would have thought the honda is more than capable, especially when the roads are reasonably open; but a thin and tight b road gives a small, more nimble and lighter car an advantage. I dont think the newer Type R is especially clever suspension wise but it will have a far stiffer chassis giving a better tyre contact point. Is it enough to offset the weight increase I really dont know when compared to a similar power 205 in cornering speed.

 

GLPoomobile is right though with the effect of power delivery. Modern engines are producing much better power deliveries off cam than their older brethren. The honda cam timing does kick in later but the engines then rev that much higher. Dont forget the VVT is about making a powerful engine more drivable and fuel economic at slower speeds rather than the other way round. You are given a suitably wide power band to drive normally in. I think you can get gizmo's to adjust all of that should you want.

Edited October 10, 2011 by Batfink

[MiniGibbo 142]

Another vote for the Honda walking it here,

 

I remember a couple of years back a lad on civiclife well the *predecissor to civiclife a lad had a stripped out EG civic with some braces and an exhaust was convinced hed been pushing an e36 m3 evo one sunday morning.. some of the explanations true "fan bois" where coming up with it being true where embarissing..