Good And Bad Engines

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

Hi all,

 

I'm fairly new to the forum world.... but in comparrison to giving money away for engines and components that are not fit for purpose and are put together by cowboys. Frankly i think its disgusting that some things are allowed to carry on.

Therefore i reach out to you all, I recently purchased a item from a company but the condition and there craftsmanship are just extremely bad and the goods are not fit for purpose. The person i'm dealing with is unreasnable and a liar when it comes to refunding me (Basicly he just wont) Its now been two months and a month since i sent the goods back, out of pocket and no goods... any ideas what to do next would be appreciated.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Pugmanian Devil

[Anthony 1,003]

There's really not enough information there to be able to suggest anything.

 

Whilst avoiding naming and shaming, can you give more information? Such as...

 

What you bought?

What it was advertised as being/having?

Was it purchased from a proper company with a receipt/invoice, or was it a private sale?

What the terms of warranty/comeback offered were?

Why it isn't for purpose / what's wrong with it?

What the company/individual has said and why they're not either refunding or putting right?

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

There's really not enough information there to be able to suggest anything.

 

Whilst avoiding naming and shaming, can you give more information? Such as...

 

What you bought?

What it was advertised as being/having?

Was it purchased from a proper company with a receipt/invoice, or was it a private sale?

What the terms of warranty/comeback offered were?

Why it isn't for purpose / what's wrong with it?

What the company/individual has said and why they're not either refunding or putting right?

[jackherer 543]

Paul_13,

 

Whilst avoiding naming and shaming

 

Guessing who it might be is not a good idea so I have removed your post.

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

Sorry missed that bit

 

I know it could lead to problems, but why are they allowed to continue sponsering the site and sell dodgy engines?!

Half the components they sell are dodgy, I bet all of the mi liners they sell are ovalled. I've heard off someone on here after they purchased some they were beyond repair.

 

My mate paid a fortune for an engine in good faith and it blew up in no time.

And its certainly not the first time its happened either.

 

Another lad on here bought an 8v turbo off them and guess what... full DT bottom end again!

 

People should be made aware of this and allowed to be ripped off.

 

Cowboys!

Edited September 3, 2011 by Paul_13

[Pugleyrich 37 1 Cars]

If it really isn't fit for purpose and you are not getting anywhere with the seller, issue a letter before claim and get them to a small claims court. Not much else you can do if the seller refuses to refund.

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

The story goes....

 

I went back to a company (which i really shouldnt have after having them build me an engine a few years back which only lasted 4 thousand miles, due to them using the wrong piston rings hence the engine losing compression after 4k miles) Thats another story..... i recently bought a set of oversized pistons and was in need of a set of liners to suit them.. so after searching around to try find someone who could bore a set of liners out the only place that said they could was the company in question... before any go ahead was given i covered all angles of "what if" and the response was i guarantee they will be done perfectly and along with that he was so sure that the quality was of top notch that if i wasnt happy with the work in any way he would put them on the shelf and issue me a full refund (that was the lie, because now funnily enough he has no recollection of ever saying that) i sent him the pistons to match to the liners that he was supplying at a further cost (second hand) and after waiting 3 weeks i received the liners and my pistons back, one of the liners looked like it had been dropped and had a in-dent exactly where the firering of the head gasket would sit and all four liners were under bored and oval by 2 - 3 hundreds and more importantly there was nearly no honing crosshatch marks visible. You could still see the bore marks from the cutting process and running your fingernail down the bores you could feel the ridges all the way down the bores.. I contacted him telling him all this and had them sent back up to the company in question. Upon recieving the liners he agreed that one was scrap (one with in-dent) and all the others needed was a proper honing, so thats when i reffered back to our original conversation before any go ahead was given and money changed hands... and not to my suprise he said he never said such a thing... (shock)

 

I said that the goods are not fit for purpose and would like a refund, he then said that he needs to talk to the engineer that he used to do them for him before he can consider refunding..because "I'm not willing to lose out for someone else's mistake" (his words) i was then told that the engineer is away on holiday for a week, so i waited a week, the following week i contacted him (He makes no effort to contact me its me chasing him, like you would expect from such execellent customer care) Only to be told that the engineer is off for another week... so i wait another week.

 

After those two weeks i called him again, he's now saying that he cant get hold of the engineer and that he would call me back that day... the day passes nothing... i call again the next day... same thing happens.. the third day i call back and he says he spoke to him but.. heres where he was mincing words making no sense... he doesnt think the engineer would refund him but he has to wait to see what he decides and so on....?? he then gives me the engineers number (which really has nothing to do with me because im dealling with this guy and his company who he gets to do the work for him is between him and his engineer) i call the engineer and expalin the situation, and he replies that its really nothing to do with him and i should be dealling with the other guy, i mention that the other guy wont refund me until the engineer says he would refund him... the engineer replies that what the other guy wants to do with me is up to him and what ever needs to happen between them two is down to them two to sort something out between them....

 

I call back the company now and tell these things to him, thats where he just replied, "No i wont refund you" ...after almost 3 weeks of waiting and chasing... thats my conclusion... he offered to re - honne the 3 liners and supply another 4th liner at no extra cost and have that re - bored and honned... to this day im still waiting and that was 2 weeks ago

 

Another thing that strikes me as odd is how can he accurately re - bore the 4th liner when he doesnt even have my pistons to measure to make sure tolerance's suit.. not to mention the fact that they are still oval and they were all under bored anyway to begin with... theres just no way they will be right and after spending over 1k on this recent engine that i'm assembling... theres no way i would even consider using his state of the art linners!!....

 

What to do next and when i recieve the liners and there no good what should i do then?????????

[S@m 156]

We all know what company this is; a company which needs naming and shaming across all the french car forums. (and there are hundreds of topics showing their terrible workmanship; i have fallen foul of it once aswell). Nonetheless, its not my place to do so, especially given the mods stance on the matter.

Anyway, back on topic, do you have proof of your correspondence prior to money changing hands? Emails, letters? anything at all? I fear without that you could have a struggle on your hands.

 

Sam

[Rich705 3]

What? So a dodgy company sponsor the forum and the mods turn a blind eye to them ripping off members?

 

Surely I must be understanding this incorrectly?

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

Yes im sure many people already know which company, the only evidence i have is the visa payment made on my statement...i have recieved no invoice yet and have no evidence of the goods been returned due to the company organised collection and i wasnt given any paper work (even after asking for some from the collection people he use's) i feel the only thing i can do is go threw visa and try get my refund that way, im sure if they dig around he would have to tell them the recent history of what was collected from my address...also i will include a independant engineers report who inspected the liners once i got them from the company in question... im now currently waiting to recieve them back from him with the re-work done as i had no other say in the matter. But as most can already guess i can only assume they will still be not fit for purpose, at least this way hes had his second chance to rectify the wrongs... i will not let this go as i have already let him off with the failure of a £3500 engine a few years ago.. i think with that in mind i would have expected a little more understanding in this matter... finally if at the end of the day companys can operate in this manner and no one has the freedom of speech to expose them for what they really are then perhaps i should get in on the game and open my own cowboy business... any suggestions on a name... im tempted to go with "NoFlow" will have to check on the availability of that bussiness name tho....

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

What? So a dodgy company sponsor the forum and the mods turn a blind eye to them ripping off members?

 

Surely I must be understanding this incorrectly?

 

 

 

Well think of it like this, if you was on a forum ripping ppl off, and making plenty of non hard earned on your part wouldnt you sponsor forum's in order to keep your establishment flowing!! i think i might sponsor the forum once my own business takes off too.....

[Phil H 16]

Thank goodness you paid on VISA. Assuming it was over £100, just call your credit card company and ask for a Section 75 claim. They will refund you and then claim it back off the seller.

Edited September 3, 2011 by Phil H

[Anthony 1,003]

Do you lot really think that lowly of the forum and the moderating team? Sometimes I honestly wonder why I bother

 

It's nothing whatsoever to do with enabling companies to rip-off our members or to line our pockets with advertising revenue as seems to be implied - quite the opposite in fact, since I requested no direct naming and shaming to protect the forum in a society where companies and individuals are increasingly resorting to litigation to protect reputations. It was a request to keep this resource available for everyone

 

There are ways of indirectly implying who a bad trader is that won't cause problems, just requires a bit of lateral thinking.

 

There are companies who currently advertise on the forum who will not be getting their advertising contracts renewed - I'll leave it as that.

 

I can go a stage further if you wish, taking a similar stance to something like Pistonheads, where naming and shaming topics are generally removed without warning, and the posters of such topics warned or banned. If that's what you'd prefer, let me know and I'll dig out the banhammer. By comparison, we're generally extremely laid back on here, but as longer term members will remember we have had issues where a very public spat between an ex-member and a company on here got to a stage where the forum itself was threatened - neither of the involved parties are members on here any more, but we don't want to get into a situation like that again.

 

With regards to the problem that the OP is having, given that you've paid by credit card, I'd be contacting the credit card company and sorting the issue out that way, getting your money back from them, and letting the credit card company issue a chargeback. The company clearly hasn't provided you the goods that you paid for in a timely manner and doesn't appear to acting with any haste to resolve the issue, so speak to the credit card company.

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

Thanks to all for reading and shedding some light on what to do next.... Let me know if anyones after a set of bored out liners to use as golf course holes...

[GLPoomobile 958]

I can understand Anthony taking this personally, as he's quite right. And so far as I understood it, it's not the mods who are responsible for the advertising. I thought that was up to Cybernck

 

One thing's for sure though, there's been a high flow of complaints directed at this company over the years. You'd think that the heads ( ) of the business would take it a little more seriously really.

 

I think the fact that every time I see a topic like this I can usually guess who the company in question is, speaks volumes.

 

I vaguely recall that Cybernck said a while back that the only reason the forum is still advertising this company is because they had to let it run until the end of the contracted period. Fair enough. But like a lot of others, I'm surprised they were even allowed to renew their sponsorship last time around! They've had unhappy customers for years!

Edited September 3, 2011 by GLPoomobile

[dcc 855]

Would this company in question have just 1 Engineer/builder? or could there be several workers there who vary in competance levels?

 

One thing is for sure, I had one of their big valve high flowing heads on an old mi16, with some nice cams to suite, was seemingly well done, but im no expert. the only thing was the cam ladder bolts were not torqued down, but just done by hand and all to a seperate force...

 

Having heard nothing but praise for quite possibly the best builder who browses and gives nothing but first hand advice and comments on this forum, my next engine will be coming straight from a legend near Truro...

[harryskid 193]

I must be missing some thing because i don't know the firm but what a discusting way to treat people who buy some thing in good faith. I run my own business and on call backs i make it a habit to deal with them prompt and fairly. I hope you get it sorted mate. You could always try trading standards but i am not really sure.

[Cameron 16]

..there's been a high flow of complaints directed at this company over the years. You'd think that the heads ( ) of the business would take it a little more seriously really.

 

Nice.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Scottish Law is different thou as far as I know which doesn't help matters

[ORB 227 1 Cars]

Turd in a box is quite a common bit of advice used on here. I like the idea, I say go with it.

 

Does anyone from the company under discussion actively use the forum? I was wondering if they may flow by and pop their head into this topic to say hi?

 

Then they may be able to sort it??

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

Turd in a box is quite a common bit of advice used on here. I like the idea, I say go with it.

 

Does anyone from the company under discussion actively use the forum? I was wondering if they may flow by and pop their head into this topic to say hi?

 

Then they may be able to sort it??

 

I'm sure there must be somebody who often flow's by and pop's there head in from time to time....Probably use to it by now no doubt.

 

1) If you approach a company for a set of liners and they say to you 2 week turn around plus a perfect result or you're money back, 99% of people would say "go ahead"

2) If you approach a company for a set of liners and they say to you 3 month turn around plus a perfect result or you're money back, 50-95% of people would say "go ahead"

3) If you approach a company for a set of liners and they say to you 3 month turn around (if you're lucky) and good luck if there useable and as for you're money back (Laugh @ the very thought of the idea) 100% of people would say "go f............"

 

You get promised number (1) but in reallity you end up getting number (3) without the chance of giving you're satisfactory reply that goes with number (3) before they have you're money...

 

It's quite simple really you place an order, you wait for ages, you get a an item that could be used for many other task's BUT the task its meant for...

 

Next time i get a spare £3500, message me and i may aswell just spread the love around the forum... Better than getting an engine built that come's back a year later (yes a year) and last's 4k miles and in the mean while you were promised a new block but you notice that its the same heli coiled block you sent there in the first place thats come back and you were promised a paint job on the block but looks like its been painted in 2 mins....to this day there is a picture of that engine on the company in question website advertising full dyno capabilities.... copy right laws and all...

 

Set of liners.... damaged, oval, under bored and honed for 2 seconds with visible bore grinds down where your fresh set of £560 forged pistons are meant to flow up n down. (er yeh but if you dont mind i kind of want more than 4k miles out of this engine, preferably with the oil not coming out of the exuast system, call me fussy but thats just me) a simple refund.... noOo!!!!

Edited September 3, 2011 by Pugmanian Devil

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

What was the engine meant to be? 8v? 16v?

My first post that got removed... I guessed right first time. No surprise from these w@nkers though.

 

I started a thread about years ago and several people come forward with their experiences/products they had recieved.

 

One bloke had a 'big valve head' which. had cut down Ford Pinto valves, not in the neatest fashion either. The 'copper slip' they used had rather large particles of copper in like they'd just put a few pipes through a grinder

 

My mates engine cost him 1600, 306DT bottom end with 306 xsi head. The wrong manifolds used and this was meant to be a GTI6 engine package.

There was the conspicuous adapter plate for which the engine bracket was mounted to, this is one of the big giveaways to one of their bodges using a diesel block.

 

Rings blew up in no time. He was naive with cars at the time and this before I got to know him really.

After this we bought a xsara vts engine off of Anthony which was spot on and no problems since

Edited September 4, 2011 by Paul_13

[S@m 156]

The individual in question (and his missus) have definetly popped up on a few forums in the past to try and defend themselves...it usually ended very badly, being that they don't really have a leg to stand on, so i imagine they have decided against doing it further. I seem to remember his missus being particularly offended by a comment about them on the 306 gti6 forum...."a monkey with a dremel would do a better job"...if i recall, sadly it seems to be accurate.

 

Sam

[GLPoomobile 958]

They're a member of the Good Garage Scheme, so may be worth complaining to them.

[Pugmanian Devil 1]

What was the engine meant to be? 8v? 16v?

My first post that got removed... I guessed right first time. No surprise from these w@nkers though.

 

I started a thread about years ago and several people come forward with their experiences/products they had recieved.

 

One bloke had a 'big valve head' which. had cut down Ford Pinto valves, not in the neatest fashion either. The 'copper slip' they used had rather large particles of copper in like they'd just put a few pipes through a grinder

 

My mates engine cost him 1600, 306DT bottom end with 306 xsi head. The wrong manifolds used and this was meant to be a GTI6 engine package.

There was the conspicuous adapter plate for which the engine bracket was mounted to, this is one of the big giveaways to one of their bodges using a diesel block.

 

Rings blew up in no time. He was naive with cars at the time and this before I got to know him really.

After this we bought a xsara vts engine off of Anthony which was spot on and no problems since

 

It was an 8v engine, i read the thread with the pinto peugeot BIG valve head... Abit like my vernier pulley that was supplied by them on the engine they built a few years back... it was straight off a diesel LOL.... along with the COMPETITION Conti tech timing belt and tensioner LOL..... New valve springs.. Yer Ok im sure they were NEW....Definately got charged for them...

 

He wrongly delivered a head to me recently (before i had the liners sent to me) and been an honest person i phoned him straight away to get it collected and sent out to the correct person... But i suppose thats what Decent people do! I even sent him a bottle of whiskey back when he was building my engine, again as a gesture of thanks and the prospects of been treated well... you think any of this means anything to this guy.. (Fat chance!!) As a friend of mine say's "Hes a Jack of all trades but a master of nothing!!"

 

I let the engine experience go, but this time after been lied to about this whole liner scenario, I Want people to KNOW what this guy is about.... bs, lies, and piss poor work, and second hand components... I hope he does read this thread so he understands that it's is threw his actions that it comes down to this... its not even about the money anymore.. It's the Principle!!!! I will be getting in touch with trading standards and the good garage scheme... I too by proffession am a self employed mechanic and if i treated people the way he does i would be broke by now so its bewildering how this guy still has a reputation to get work?? Has anyone out there had an engine built by them which has actually lasted??????? Please come forward and speak on it...

 

Simple fact is, if you're reading this you were meant to supply useable bored liners, bottom line was they were not useable... (and he actually agrred that they needed more work doing) and if they were useable then why am i waiting for him to replace 1 of the 4 liners and to this day still have nothing to show for my £340!!! a refund was more than justified..... And he expects me to just bend over and take it... Quite frankly i know he just dont give a S...

 

Excuse the rant but its just hard to swallow this time round....