Gearbox/clutch Fitting Help

[damien 22 1 Cars]

im in the middle of refitting my gearbox/clutch and im stuck on the selection fork and release bearing, ive read the fitting guide on the main site and im confused. it goes on about the release bearing but i cant remember there being one when i removed the gearbox from the gti6 engine.

 

i fitted one and it dont look right.

 

 

i had a read of the guide on the gti6 forum and there is nothing about a release bearing, from the pics on there it looks just like mine (without the bearing)

 

 

am i right in thinking i dont need the release bearing as there seems to be one on the back of the clutch cover plate?

 

 

thanks

[dcc 855]

eeek ignore!

Edited August 18, 2011 by dcc

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

You need to decide if you are using a,

 

PUSH release system, like a 205 GTI BE3 where the release arm PUSHES the bearing onto the clutch cover to release the clutch.

 

or a

 

PULL release system, like a 306 GTI6, where the release bearing is built into the clutch cover, the release arm has to be hooked in behind it as you slide gearbox onto engine, and the arm PULLS the bearing away from the flywheel to release the clutch.

 

I can't tell exactly from the picture but it looks like you have a mixture of both types at the moment, PULL clutch cover, and PUSH release arm.

 

Both systems work fine, the PULL type is more tricky to get the box back on the engine, but otherwise both are OK.

 

I personally use the PUSH type as this allows the standard 205 BE3 cable to be used without modification.

[damien 22 1 Cars]

You need to decide if you are using a,

 

PUSH release system, like a 205 GTI BE3 where the release arm PUSHES the bearing onto the clutch cover to release the clutch.

 

or a

 

PULL release system, like a 306 GTI6, where the release bearing is built into the clutch cover, the release arm has to be hooked in behind it as you slide gearbox onto engine, and the arm PULLS the bearing away from the flywheel to release the clutch.

 

I can't tell exactly from the picture but it looks like you have a mixture of both types at the moment, PULL clutch cover, and PUSH release arm.

 

Both systems work fine, the PULL type is more tricky to get the box back on the engine, but otherwise both are OK.

 

I personally use the PUSH type as this allows the standard 205 BE3 cable to be used without modification.

 

 

im more confused now,

 

the gti6 engine was in my 205 with the box/clutch on it, im removing the box/clutch and refitting it to another gti6 engine so im just copying the setup.

[Masekwm 2]

The top picture is right.

 

The middle picture hasn't got the release bearing yet.

 

The bottom picture, is that the pressure plate you removed from the old engine?

[damien 22 1 Cars]

The top picture is right.

 

The middle picture hasn't got the release bearing yet.

 

The bottom picture, is that the pressure plate you removed from the old engine?

 

 

yes.

 

i cant remember removing a release bearing when i removed the gearbox

[Masekwm 2]

So where did the top release bearing come from?

[damien 22 1 Cars]

ebay.

 

i read on the guide that i needed one so i got one, im just confused if i need one or not and if i dont how does the clutch arm fit on the clutch cover

[Masekwm 2]

I think some people adapted the 205 clutch cable so that they could retain the 306 clutch. Did the clutch cable have anything on it to extend it? I'm not familiar with how it's done but remember reading about it.

[damien 22 1 Cars]

give me 5 min and i will get a pic.

 

i do remember it didnt look standard

 

here you go

 

 

Edited August 18, 2011 by damien

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

if the clutch cover plate etc. is what was fitted to the new engine you bought it will be a pull one and that would explain why we had difficulty removing the gearbox.

 

i would ditch this and use a push type, the arm and bearing in the top one is fine for this but you need a mi16 clutch kit to go with it (well this is what i used)

 

use the clutch kit off your old engine and the fork assembly you have there.

 

to be fair for the price i would replace it with a new mi16 clutch while its off, save doing it in the future??

[damien 22 1 Cars]

the clutch cover in the pic was on the old engine. im under the impression that this is a mi16 clutch

[damien 22 1 Cars]

mi16 off the service box

 

[Tom Fenton 1,541]

Two types of Mi16 clutch. 1900 Mi16 uses PUSH type. 2000 Mi16 iron block uses PULL type.

[welshpug 1,657]

and the 2000 mi16 is the same as the gti6 clutch.

 

is it a gti6 gearbox that was used previously and is going back on?

 

if so you need to use the 2000cc clutch as that will match the release arm+fork you have.

[damien 22 1 Cars]

part no - GCK461AF 1.9 bx 16v

[damien 22 1 Cars]

and the 2000 mi16 is the same as the gti6 clutch.

 

is it a gti6 gearbox that was used previously and is going back on?

 

if so you need to use the 2000cc clutch as that will match the release arm+fork you have.

 

 

my 205 has a 5 speed 406 gearbox on a gti6 lump, that engine has packed up so i got another engine.

the 5 speed 406 box is going on the replacment gti6 engine.

the clutch plate and fork are the ones that where on my gti6 engine mated to the 406 box.

[welshpug 1,657]

just need the 2000cc pull type clutch then, you'll need to remove the arm and angle the fork so it slides behind the bearing as you push the box into place.

[pugpete1108 62 1 Cars]

sorry forgot it was the 1.9 mi16 clutch, not the 2.0

 

so you must have the pull type cable then? might as well use it and do as wp says.

 

ive never fitted a pull clutch so wouldnt know how they come off or go on

Edited August 18, 2011 by pugpete1108

[damien 22 1 Cars]

just need the 2000cc pull type clutch then, you'll need to remove the arm and angle the fork so it slides behind the bearing as you push the box into place.

 

 

so in my 1st post is the first pic right or the 2nd?

[welshpug 1,657]

2nd and 3rd.

 

no need to use the 1.9 mi clutch release bearing unless you change the clutch fork+ arm and the pressure plate

[damien 22 1 Cars]

cool, i will keep it as it is then with no release bearing.

right so i know for next time is it the 1.9 or 2.0 clutch i will need?

also when it comes to refitting the box to the car, how do i do it? i now know the 205 guide is no good and the gti6 guide just states "When putting back together, grease the splines up on the gearbox shaft, it helps to allign the splines.

 

Use the same method when putting the box back on, lift the rear up on to a axle stand, and jack the front up and slide forward"

[Masekwm 2]

Why not swap to a 205 box whilst it's apart, renew the clutch and hopefully you'll get rid of a future point of failure.

[damien 22 1 Cars]

the 1.6 is too short for normal use the 1.9 is too long in 1st/2nd to have any fun.

anyway i dont have a spare 205 box and there is nothing wrong with this one

[Masekwm 2]

I agree, I have a Xsara box and it always feels like it wants to go. But then if I didn't want that I'd have stuck to the standard engine.

 

Then again, if it ever got used, I'd have not just listed it for sale!