How Can I Blow £3,000?

[driversdomainuk 8]

Hi

 

I have set myself a budget of £3k for developing my Mi16 engine. It is all standard with weber carbs.

 

Can I have views on how best I can spend £3k on it?

 

It has been reconditioned recently although has zero oil pressure at hot idle (i never let it idle now!) for some weird reason....

 

I use the car for hillcimbing...

 

It has 170bhp at moment, and was wondering what BHP a £3k investment would make?

 

Thanks

Rob

[Baz 421]

Obviously sort the oil pressure issues, maybe make a few changes to aid oil control, surge-prevention etc. Then i'd think about ignition management, cams, depending on what's left, sell carbs, go to bodies & full 3d mappable management.

Edited June 7, 2011 by Anthony

[driversdomainuk 8]

Obviously sort the oil pressure issues, maybe make a few changes to aid oil control, surge-prevention etc. Then i'd think about ignition management, cams, depending on what's left, sell carbs, go to bodies & full 3d mappable management.

 

 

 

Sorry, but there's a few things there that don't add up, High comp pistons yet only 10.2:1?

 

220bhp at the fly, that's quite optimistic for the compression and management. Has it been on an engine dyno?

 

 

High compression pistons should make 11.8:1 (according to the ones on eBay)

 

I was planning on a Big Valve Head, porting, rally cams, solid lifters, forged pistons and rods...that should see 200bhp maybe, and little change from £3k

[S@m 156]

At the risk of being lynched......Honda K20 conversion? Unless you have to stick with psa parts for particular regulations then its a far more reliable and certain way of achieving 220bhp then any Mi16. I know thats what i would do given your budget!

 

Sam

[driversdomainuk 8]

At the risk of being lynched......Honda K20 conversion? Unless you have to stick with psa parts for particular regulations then its a far more reliable and certain way of achieving 220bhp then any Mi16. I know thats what i would do given your budget!

 

Sam

 

whats a Honda K20 engine? and is it an easy job going into a 205?

[driversdomainuk 8]

or another option - what about a 206 GTI 180 engine? with my carbs on...is it easy to fit?

[S@m 156]

The Honda K20 is the engine in the current Civic type R, its 200bhp in UK spec, but there are Jap spec versions with 220 and even a mugen with 240. Basically, it has been done before just run a search, theres a few different ways of doing it. Its something i would love to do to my 306 when i get sick of repairing Mi16s. The 206 gti 180 conversion has been done aswell, the engine code is EW10J4. Basically, they have all been done, just search!

 

 

Sam

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

I know someone with a Dry Sump'd Longman Crate engine, Steel Rods, Solid Lifters etc cost to build was around 10k and and power est 250bhp, save a few quid

[welshpug 1,661]

just my opinion based on what I've read, and pretty close to the above, I would;

 

Sort oil pressure issue (is it the measuring, the oil, or actually low due to large tolerances?)

 

Leave the valve sizes alone. ("big valve head" and "porting" at this level really just eats your money up from just building a reliable engine that produces a nice spread of torque+power, may not give quite a headline figure, but WILL be quicker...)

 

Higher compression pistons, 11+ / 1.

 

Decent tuned length inlet tract with throttle bodies (as you'd get from someone like Colin Satchell+Sandy Brown) not necessarily bike bodies but they do work well and suit this type of inlet.

 

Decent ECU, DTA S40, Omex 600 etc.

 

Camshafts to suit.

 

Exhaust Manifold to spec.

[driversdomainuk 8]

just my opinion based on what I've read, and pretty close to the above, I would;

 

Sort oil pressure issue (is it the measuring, the oil, or actually low due to large tolerances?)

 

Leave the valve sizes alone. ("big valve head" and "porting" at this level really just eats your money up from just building a reliable engine that produces a nice spread of torque+power, may not give quite a headline figure, but WILL be quicker...)

 

Higher compression pistons, 11+ / 1.

 

Decent tuned length inlet tract with throttle bodies (as you'd get from someone like Colin Satchell+Sandy Brown) not necessarily bike bodies but they do work well and suit this type of inlet.

 

Decent ECU, DTA S40, Omex 600 etc.

 

Camshafts to suit.

 

Exhaust Manifold to spec.

 

good few points there..thanks

[Baz 421]

+1 with Welshy on not bothering with the expense of bigger valves etc unless budget really permits, the Mi head flows VERY well as it is.

Edited June 7, 2011 by Anthony

[dcc 855]

Just what exactly on james28's engine will make it 220bhp? thats more than my fecking engine lol not many 1.9 lumps making 200+ ponies, agree with baz here lol

 

also

 

not many k20a or k20a2 engines even make 195bhp, apart from being one of the most gutless engines in a car i have ever owned, I would only ever buy one again if it were JDM. vtec is not all whats its cracked up to be!

[S@m 156]

not many k20a or k20a2 engines even make 195bhp, apart from being one of the most gutless engines in a car i have ever owned, I would only ever buy one again if it were JDM. vtec is not all whats its cracked up to be!

 

I found the K20z4 engine to be awesome fun in the FD2 civic. Even though its a heavy car! Although not as much fun as a B18 MB6 civic i used to have access to!

 

Sam

[camgti 56]

Built the same engine Sarty did on Evo2. 250hp Should be doable with 3k? 88x87 Iron XU10 MI16, standard head, stage 2 PeterT cams, Ditch the carbs and fit ITBs...

[petert 588]

I'm with Welshpug. Compression, cams, management and ignition on a well setup base engine. It just needs to be machined properly, balanced if required and standard head put together properly. That means starting with guides and working out from their. Depending on cam choice, you may need better valve springs (shimmed correctly), but don't waste money on cams with more than 0.430" lift.

[driversdomainuk 8]

Thanks for all the replys so far....So would you think 200bhp for 3k is possible?

 

Also is it worth buying steel rods AND pistons?

[wicked 103 3 Cars]

Don't forget to spend some quid on a proper diff and ecu.... That will take a big chunk from your budget.

[driversdomainuk 8]

Don't forget to spend some quid on a proper diff and ecu.... That will take a big chunk from your budget.

 

 

already have a tran-x diff!!

[driversdomainuk 8]

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/standard-kits/jenvey-dynamics/peugeot-mi16-tbp45-kit-ckpg03

 

See link above - would I need to spend £726 + vat for the kit, then around £600 for say an Omex 600 ECU...Is that all I will need to spend for the throttle boddies?

 

thanks

[feb 47]

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/standard-kits/jenvey-dynamics/peugeot-mi16-tbp45-kit-ckpg03

 

See link above - would I need to spend £726 + vat for the kit, then around £600 for say an Omex 600 ECU...Is that all I will need to spend for the throttle boddies?

 

thanks

 

You will need a throttle linkage, loom a filter and backplate and maybe something else that I have missed.

[driversdomainuk 8]

You will need a throttle linkage, loom a filter and backplate and maybe something else that I have missed.

 

And now much would that cost?

[petert 588]

Thanks for all the replys so far....So would you think 200bhp for 3k is possible?

 

Also is it worth buying steel rods AND pistons?

 

I wouldn't buy new rods. I think you'll definitely need new pistons however. It's a long time since I've seen a good std. liner. The pistons are usually ok however. It's one of those things you won't know until you strip it. If the pistons/liners are ok, I'd just buy one of those new thin Cometic gaskets to increase the CR.

[feb 47]

And now much would that cost?

 

You can get an idea of the costs for the linkage, backplate and filter from

 

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/linkage

 

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/airhorns-filters-and-boxes

 

I assume it is a double linkage that you need but I have no idea about exact part numbers, others that have fitted these should be able to advise (e.g. Anthony, Baz, Miles)

 

If a TPS is not included you have to add that as well: http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/throttle-position plus an air temp sensor.

 

The loom depends who makes it for you or whether you build it yourself.

Edited June 7, 2011 by feb

[driversdomainuk 8]

You can get an idea of the costs for the linkage, backplate and filter from

 

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/linkage

 

http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/airhorns-filters-and-boxes

 

I assume it is a double linkage that you need but I have no idea about exact part numbers, others that have fitted these should be able to advise (e.g. Anthony, Baz, Miles)

 

If a TPS is not included you have to add that as well: http://www.jenvey.co.uk/home/accessories/throttle-position plus an air temp sensor.

 

The loom depends who makes it for you or whether you build it yourself.

 

 

thanks for that mate....

 

I run Weber carbs....would TBs really increase power that much?

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

No but it would make the general running better along with normally better midrange, Filters are not required personally on a competition car (I never use them), You will then find that inlet lengths have a huge difference in power delivery, I know that a old Mi on here which swapped to Sandy B/Colin S bodies made a fair bit more and having played with 8 injector set up on 8v you can get around 10% more peak power with them in the right place