Campaign Against Those Stupid Hid Lights.

[SurGie 54]

Hi Members,

 

Check THIS out. Its about time there was something done about it.

 

I know people say these headlights have auto leveling etc, but i still get dazzled frequently. When i get overtaken by car with them and they shine through the wind mirror at my eyes, no auto level system stops that. Then there's the bumps and speed bumps etc and the level of 4x4 etc.

 

I cant believe these 50% brighter lights are allowed to be on the road they are such a menace in m eyes, forgive the pun

 

Im going to join the campaign, anyone else want to ?

[SurGie 54]

HERE is the web address where you can join the campaign.

 

One more point about this is that 'most' of us drive at night in cities and road ways that have lights at the side of the road anyway. I know country roads dont but country roads dont have as many pedestrians like what cities and towns do.

 

These lights seems a big contradiction in road safety.

 

"cars should not dazzle other road users"

 

I have good eyesight just below 20/20 vision and am sensitive to bright light. Its bright light that over time damages the back of the eyes like sunlight. These probably wont do any damage apart from distracting other divers.

Edited April 20, 2011 by SurGie

[Anthony 1,003]

I have good eyesight just below 20/20 vision and am sensitive to bright light

Don't take this the wrong way, but does that not imply that perhaps your eyes are more of a problem here than the HID's?

[SurGie 54]

As said on the link, some people are more sensitive to bright light than others. It effects older drivers more but it also effects younger drivers too. I can just cope with high beam lights and HID but its very uncomfortable and have raised my hands to block out the light, which is not a good idea.

 

Why should some drivers have to cope with these just because they are sensitive to bright light, just so drivers want to see the road better. We coped with the old lights for decades. I dont agree with the argument that these will cause less accidents, they IMO will cause more. Why make them brighter if the old lights worked legally well for decades >?

 

If people cant see the road well enough on roads without street lights then that's what the high beam is there for. I feel its just a fashion fad of the Max power type

 

Having these HID lights means people will and can drive faster cause they can see further, thats not a good idea either is it >?

 

Either way, it dont matter how sensitive people are to it they dazzle peoples eyes due to being at least 50% brights than standard lights.

[swordfish210 20]

I too find HID lights annoyingly bright, however like most internet based campaigns i can't see this going anywhere.

[Anthony 1,003]

Where do you start with that reply...

 

As said on the link, some people are more sensitive to bright light than others. It effects older drivers more but it also effects younger drivers too. I can just cope with high beam lights and HID but its very uncomfortable and have raised my hands to block out the light, which is not a good idea.

I am well aware of the problems caused by glare and over-senstive eyes as my father suffers from the problems you've mentioned, and as he gets older he has to avoid driving at night more and more because of it which means that he has to adapt his lifestyle and routine as a result, especially in winter with short days and long nights.

 

The key point is though that the lights themselves are not the problem, but rather the problem you have with your eyes - what you're proposing would be like someone with colourblindness (very common in men, with something like 1 in 20 suffering) insisting that red and green are banned because they can't easily tell them apart. No, that doesn't happen, and in some safety critical industries people with colour blindness are banned.

 

I would argue that if your eye problems are so bad that you're having to take your hands off the wheel to shield your eyes from oncoming headlights, that perhaps you should seriously consider whether or not you are safe to drive around at night.

 

Why should some drivers have to cope with these just because they are sensitive to bright light, just so drivers want to see the road better.

Look at it another way - why should the majority of motorists not have access to lighting improvements and the resulting safety benefits just because there are some drivers who, argueably, are not fit to drive at night on the roads?

 

We coped with the old lights for decades. I dont agree with the argument that these will cause less accidents, they IMO will cause more. Why make them brighter if the old lights worked legally well for decades >?

We coped fine with unservo'd drum brakes, crossply tyres and no seatbelts just fine at one point, did we not?

 

I cannot see (geddit?) how better headlights that allow you to see more clearly at night could not be considered anything other than progress, the same way as brakes that allow you to stop quicker or tyres that offer increased grip. Driving a car with HID's back to back with one that doesn't clearly shows the benefits and improvements.

 

Having these HID lights means people will and can drive faster cause they can see further, thats not a good idea either is it >?

That's complete rubbish. Do people drive twice as fast with high beams on than with low beams? Of course not

 

Either way, it dont matter how sensitive people are to it they dazzle peoples eyes due to being at least 50% brights than standard lights.

Providing that they are properly aimed, HID's are no more dazzling than regular halogens IMO. Those LED DRL's are FAR more dazzling frankly.

 

Defective or mis-aimed headlights are another matter entirely, and I agree that a mis-aimed HID is more dazzling than a mis-aimed halogen - that's not a fault with the light source itself though, only with how it is aimed. Many of the aftermarket HID conversions fall into this catagory, as some halogen housings do not aim the beam properly, and others will need re-aiming after the fitment of HID bulbs.

[feb 47]

I totally agree with Anthony, it couldn't have been better said.

 

I too avoid driving at night when I can or drive considerably more slowly than I do in daytime or pass the wheel to my wife and scare myself $hitless on the passenger seat as she can drive much faster (within the speed limit) at night than me!

 

Some people have eagled eye vision at night and it has nothing to do with 20/20.

 

Drive a car with HIDs (OEM ones not aftermarket bulbs that potentially do more harm than good) and you will realise that halogen lights are like candles.

 

If you find it difficult to drive at night for whatever reason minimise your night driving or reduce your speed to a "safe to stop as far as you can see" level.

Edited April 20, 2011 by feb

[welshpug 1,666]

I don't have an issue with o.e HID lighting on cars, its all these aftermarket kits fitted to older cars that really annoy me.

[SurGie 54]

So whats the real point in having them then ?

 

They distract my driving and cause me to look away from the road ahead, what part of that dont people understand, im am obviously not the only one has these problems with them ? What part of the law where drivers should not be "dazzled or distracted" dont people get ? Some old lights are very bright on the newer cars which also makes it harder to drive safely.

 

It seems a selfish thing having these because they make the road better to see for you but harder for other people. I see lots of cruz people at McDonald's with them on also. I sat eating when the driver opposite had them on blinding me in the eye, so i put my high beam on, they soon turned them off, show offs.

 

If people want to see the road better then keeping the old lights would mean in general people would drive slower because they cant see as much of the road, I know if people had no lights at all would drive dead slow, so the same principle is related to driving speeds.

 

As said most roads have lights and country roads can have the high beam on, so whats the point accept annoy other divers.

 

On the evening News they just said that the law states that car lights with these should have the auto dip facility and head lamp washers. Not all have them do they ?

 

 

Genuine HID's also pose a threat campaigned by the 'Driving instructors association & British motorcycle federation'.

 

Don't just take my opinions of them.

 

Also on the news iv just heard that the boss of the 'society of motor manufacturers and traders' say there is a problem with normal lights having glare, as they know about glare yet they are willing to have this glare 50% brighter, mm that makes very good sense.

 

As a side note i prefer to dive at night, less cars generally and can see if cars are coming easier at junctions etc.

 

Which do you think knows better the boss of the 'society of motor manufacturers and traders' or the 'Driving instructors association & British motorcycle federation' ?

Edited April 20, 2011 by SurGie

[feb 47]

A "trick" when driving at night when there is oncoming traffic is to lock your eyes on the far right line/ede of the road and not look straight ahead. Try this and you will realise that you wil be able to drive much better without being dazzled.

 

All OEM HIDs are self levelling. EU ones (at least) have washers as well.

Edited April 20, 2011 by feb

[allye 530 3 Cars]

'most of the roads have lights' you've never been to wiltshire or Devon then! I don't have a problem with them, yes some are dazzerling but it doesn't blind me at all. As above, a large part of the problem is misaligned kits or even oe bulbs.

[Anthony 1,003]

'most of the roads have lights' you've never been to wiltshire or Devon then!

Significant sections of the motorway network and trunk A-roads throughout are unlit, not to mention an increasing tendency for street lights in urban areas to be switched off late at night.

[Baz 421]

A "trick" when driving at night when there is oncoming traffic is to lock your eyes on the far right line/ede of the road and not look straight ahead. Try this and you will realise that you wil be able to drive much better without being dazzled.

 

 

THIS.

 

Although i wouldn't call it a trick.

 

Not looking directly at bright lights i'd call 'common sense'.

 

There isn't a legitimate problem in my opinion or they wouldn't be fitted to cars, they work very well indeed having cars with both kinds of headlights i know the difference and given they've been around for years now, i think this is a waste of time.

[SurGie 54]

A "trick" when driving at night when there is oncoming traffic is to lock your eyes on the far right line/ede of the road and not look straight ahead. Try this and you will realise that you wil be able to drive much better without being dazzled.

 

All OEM HIDs are self levelling. EU ones (at least) have washers as well.

 

They still shine in my eyes even when im not looking directly at them they are that bright.

 

Yeah thats easier said than done and why should drivers have to do that ? I had a big Chrysler pass me in the GTI 6 on the motorway the other night and it dazzled me in the wind mirror, no leveling will stop that. Its not just the cars coming towards me it's also when cars are turning and other times/circumstances on the road. God help anything that gets in-front of the cars that gets dazzled by these lights.

 

Thats not really the point though is it, the point is lots of other drivers have difficulties because of how bright they are, about 50% more than standard. The ones iv seen have a piercing shine in my eyes and most of those are on new cars so must be the official type. Look at the link where a cab driver hates them and he drives for a living and is campaigning against them.

 

They may be legal right now but so are those new cars with super shiny clear indicators. When im at a round about or such like, when the sun shines on them the indicator cant be seen at all. Now how did they pass the standard i dont know. If people should turn when no traffic is around then whats the indicator really for, its for indicating other drivers and these dont always do that in certain circumstances ?

 

I understand how they make the road very clear which makes driving easier on the eyes of people that cant see in the dark well but then there's the drivers that can see in the dark better and cope fine with the old type. I read on here on a post that the Mot's suppose to change about the rules of these HID lights but iv not seen anything on the links i've posted about that.

 

I know I'll have to just put up with them unless this campaign goes somewhere, and i ant wearing those yellow anti glare glasses.

Edited April 21, 2011 by SurGie

[Cameron 16]

I think your efforts would be better directed at a campaign against dickheads who drive with their full beams on on the f***ing motorway.

[tri_longer 25]

So lets assume this protest works and we suddenly decide to ban HID lights.

 

Now all those aftermarket kits illegally fitted to cars designed for halogens is one thing.

 

Just exactly who pays the cost for all the cars legitmately fitted with them from the factory to have them removed? Becasue with the best will in the world, even if they stop fitting them to cars as from this very moment, there are still an awful lot of vehicles going to be on the road with them working for many years to come.

 

We may as well start a campaign to stop the sun shining beacuse on some days thatis to bright to drive in as well?

[Mikey S 29 1 Cars]

I think your efforts would be better directed at a campaign against dickheads who drive with their full beams on on the f***ing motorway.

 

or sit constantly in the middle lane....

 

Ive ran aftermarket hid's in my cars for years. There E marked and there properly beam set. Infact, I could count the number of times ive been flashed on one hand. You need to remember that all headlights kick to the left, Hence why your blinded in your offside mirror when a car overtakes you, regardless of whether the car is fitted with halogens or hid's!. WTF are drivers supposed to do? turn there lights off whenever they overtake?!

Edited April 21, 2011 by pugger

[cRaig 273 1 Cars]

They still shine in my eyes even when im not looking directly at them they are that bright.

 

...........

I know I'll have to just put up with them unless this campaign goes somewhere, and i ant wearing those yellow anti glare glasses.

 

 

Why not? Surely if you have a specific problem, this would be a cheap and easy way of dealing with it? It seems like a solution to the problem already exists, rather than the majority missing out on inprovements in safety and technology, just because it bothers a smaller minority.

Edited April 21, 2011 by cRaig

[Cameron 16]

Oh, ps.. if they've been passed by EU standards, isn't this a hint that they've been thoroughly checked and tested? I'd be very surprised if a high intensity headlight was approved without testing whether it was a danger to oncoming drivers.

[number2301 1 1 Cars]

I signed the petition (for all the good it'll do) as this is something that's been getting on my nerves for years now. Something which seems to go unsaid is that standard bulbs, as bright as HIDs (say 100w or whatever) are illegal as they're too bright. HIDs are only legal because its a new system which uses less wattage.

 

And I simply don't buy this business about standard HIDs being fine, they are not in any way fine. They're too bright and they change colour/flash as they change angle. How is that safe and legal?

[SurGie 54]

If they got banned then cars made with them before the ban would keep them because they were manufactured before the new law came in. Much like seat belts, if a car was manufactured without them before the new law then its fine.

 

Those shiny new type indicators have passed the standard, yet they cant be seen flashing when direct sunlight hits them. So its not the only thing thats stupidly been passed onto cars.

 

The sun is very different to cars HID lights on the dark road though isn't it, the sun is expected those HID's are not always expected to shine your eyes out & in the day time people auto wear sunglasses at night thats not the case.

 

There's many that hate them and many that like them, the ones that like them have them fitted so.

 

Notice how the motor manufacturers association like them probably because they are part of the selling process. We will see if road accidents fall because of the amount of cars with these lights in time.

 

Does anyone know the difference to old type lights and the old type high beam ?

[feb 47]

When your car has HIDs you are able to see the road much better for a fact. Maybe then you don't bother about cars having HIDs since you can see so much better.

You will then come back and say "eye for an eye" but it's not like this exactly, I bet in the 70's when cars were using Incandescent light bulbs the move to the new technolgy back then halogen caused drivers with the old technology to complain about being blinded as well.

Edited April 21, 2011 by feb

[Anthony 1,003]

Exactly. Anyway, LED lighting is just around the corner, and I believe featured (or an option) on a few select high-end cars already.

[S@m 156]

Seems more like a sensitive eyes problem than a HID problem. Maybe you should inform the dvla of your need to wear corrective anti glare glasses/lenses at night. If this was a protest against daytime running lights then i would be completely with you, but HIDs are not a problem, DRL's are a nightmare, we should limit their brightness as is done in Japan.

 

Sam

[SurGie 54]

When your car has HIDs you are able to see the road much better for a fact. Maybe then you don't bother about cars having HIDs since you can see so much better.

You will then come back and say "eye for an eye" but it's not like this exactly, I bet in the 70's when cars were using Incandescent light bulbs the move to the new technolgy back then halogen caused drivers with the old technology to complain about being blinded as well.

 

 

I dont think people are reading my posts properly.

 

For a fact there are many drivers that have problems with them there's no two ways about that. If i had them they would still be blinding me when night time driving, worse in winter. Its not just me is it, there's also an amount of others that have the same issue with them.

 

They are 50% brighter thats a much bigger difference than when we had halogen lights surely, these dazzle and are blinding at times. They are really sharp on the eye, halogen are not which is another big difference between them.

 

Im sure there is not a small minority that have problems with these lights. Iv been in a car with them and i still think they should be either less sharp and bright or become unlawful. Im sure it was nothing compared to how many people have trouble with these HID's..

 

At the end of the day i feel i have to flash them for being too bright at me, which would not help the situation as it is with two drivers being blinded

 

Daytime driving with lights i am also against.

 

My eyes are fine they get tested regularly, i dont have glare problems i have problems with HID sharp blue light hitting my eyes at irregular times just so someone can see an ant walking across the road

Edited April 21, 2011 by SurGie