Suspension Renewal Thoughts

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Hi All,

 

Following the sale of one of my pugs I intend to treat my 'keeper pug' too some new, shiny suspension parts. I've been doing some searching to find the ideal setup for my needs but I'm a little confused and could do with some input. The car is a 1.6 GTI on 15" speedlines and it's only ever going to be used on the road so I'm looking for a fast road type setup and I'd like to lower it by about 30mm. My current shopping list is below, all feedback appreciated:

 

Front

 

Springs - Eibach E7001-001

Dampers - OE replacement (do they handle well with Eibach springs?) or Bilstien B6

Top Mount Rubbers - BBM Fast Road

Top Mount Bearing - SKF from GSF

Droplinks - Lemforder from ECP

Pinch Bolts - Baz

TRE's - Already replaced

Wishbones - Already replaced (OE inner bushes)

 

Rear

 

Rebuilt 1.9 Beam - from someone off here!

Beam mounts - Unsure, probably a firmer mount from BBM...?

Rear Bump stops - OE Pug

Rear Dampers - Pug K6 (306 GTi-6)

 

Can people share their views on the above? I'm particularly interested in views on the front dampers as my searches didn't up any clear info on which dampers are the best bang for your buck replacement when using the Eibach springs? I know suspension is subjective but I'm looking for a setup that's fast road focussed, retains the 'grin factor' handling characteristics but feels a bit tighter and removes some of the arch gap.

 

Help appreciated ,

 

Cheers,

Dave.

[Tom Fenton 1,536]

I fitted pretty much all of the above for a guy off here about 9 months ago, it was one of the nicest road biased setups I have driven so I would highly recommend it.

Using the Bilstein front dampers and brand new OE 306 GTI rear dampers.

 

Solid rear beam mounts also make a good improvement, otherwise fit new Peugeot stuff.

[GLPoomobile 958]

I had Eibach springs on standard dampers on my old 1.9, which I then swapped to my 1.6. I don't know how old the dampers were, but the setup worked very well in my limited opinion. The Koni adjustable (yellow) dampers with matching springs (as in the springs that came in the Koni kit) that is on my current 205 just do not compare, but that could be becuase I've never adjusted the damping to try and improve things. DrSarty also had EIbach springs on OE dampers on his old red GTI and he raved about it too. Just gives a really nicely damped ride.

 

For the rear mounts I always recomend using solid Group A mounts. I found they didn't introduce any harshness, but just made the car feel really well screwed together. The trade off is a little bit of extra road noise.

 

For front top mounts, I've never tried the Fast Road version (which I understand is mid-way between standard and Group N). A lot of people will suggest using the harder Group N but I always go againts the grain on that. I had them, I didn't like them, I wouldn't use them again on a road car.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

Don't forget drop-links and front ARB bushes.

[Alan_M 66 1 Cars]

Don't forget droplinks and front ARB bushes!

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Thanks people

 

Drop links are already on the list but thanks for the heads up on the arb bushes.

 

It's interesting to hear comments on the eibachs with standard shocks as I expect they'd be a fair bit cheaper than the B6's.....?

[ravydavy 0]

Can't go wrong with bilstein.

 

And definitely what Tom said about 306 rear dampers.

 

I have a set of tarmac spec 306 dampers from special tuning and its amazing the difference they make.

 

David

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Just use the OE replacement billies which where known as B4's bar it's changed again now.

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

I felt I should update this thread now that I have completed the suspension work on my Pug.

 

In the end I went for:

 

Front

 

Springs - Eibach E7001-001

Dampers - Bilstien B4

Top Mount Rubbers - BBM Fast Road

New Top Mount Bearings - GSF

New Droplinks - GSF

 

Rear

 

Rebuilt Hybrid 205 GTi/306 GTi6 Beam - Built by Tom Fenton using GTi6 trailing arms/calipers/discs

Beam sandwich mounts - OE Pug

Beam front mounts - Solid, provided by Tom

Rear Dampers - Pug K6 (306 GTi-6)

ARB - 24mm GTi6 modded by Tom

 

It's also had 4 new Falken 912 tyres.

 

And how does it feel.....? Bloody Awesome is about the only way I can describe it! Obviously I've gone from knackered old bushes/beam/mounts etc too new AND uprated parts but the transformation is night and day. The ride is firm but not crashy, it turns in quickly and you can just feel the rear end helping to point the car in. The car is set about 30mm lower all round and looks the business, some pics will be put up shortly after it's had a quick wash.

 

Many thanks to everyone for their advice and a big thanks to Tom for sorting out my rear end (ooo eerrrr!) and Batfink for supplying the front shocks. It might have set me back the best part of a grand, but in my eyes it was well worth it

[Tom Fenton 1,536]

Glad to hear you've got it done Dave, as I said to you and as I've said to others, I think the combination of the Bilsteins/Eibachs coupled with a rebuilt beam and the 306 GTI rear dampers makes for a lovely road biased 205.

 

We need some pictures though!

 

Bit of interesting info for you, when I stripped your old drum beam I found one side was on the verge of seizing, and on the other side someone had been there butchering before, and had rougly welded the stub axle into the rear arm, nice!

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Glad to hear you've got it done Dave, as I said to you and as I've said to others, I think the combination of the Bilsteins/Eibachs coupled with a rebuilt beam and the 306 GTI rear dampers makes for a lovely road biased 205.

 

We need some pictures though!

 

Bit of interesting info for you, when I stripped your old drum beam I found one side was on the verge of seizing, and on the other side someone had been there butchering before, and had rougly welded the stub axle into the rear arm, nice!

 

Pics are coming

 

It doesn't surprise me that bodging has been going on in the rear beam department, I think the previous owner may have been fond of bodging.....

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Ok, here are some pics to round up this thread. Please excuse the fact it hasn't been cleaned (apart from the wheels as she's had new shoes and the tyre fitters left 'em full of gunk):

 

 

 

 

What are peoples thoughts on the front ride height? Low enough?

 

Cheers,

Dave.

[welshpug 1,646]

looks pretty goid, if a tiny bit low on the back, have you compared the sill height front to back?

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Not recently, I did do about 200 miles after fitting the front springs/top mounts etc. and found the n/s to be ~10mm higher than the other three corners. I need to check this again to see if it's settled down or not.

 

I like the height of the rear, if it doesn't settle down I'll be tempted to look at some springs which bring the front down a little further without sacrificing the handling/comfort that the Eibachs offer.

[Tom Fenton 1,536]

Measure the sill heights, the wheel arch gaps are deceiving as the front arches are massive!

[feb 47]

Are you kidding us about the cleaning?

The car looks great!

The rear seems to be a tad lower than the front though.

Check with Anthony, he had a set of SBC springs that are a little lower than the Eibachs (if he still has them or not planning on using them).

Where did you have the wheels done and how much did it set you back if you don't mind me asking?

Also what colour code did you use?

Edited August 30, 2011 by feb

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

Measure the sill heights, the wheel arch gaps are deceiving as the front arches are massive!

 

I'll get it on the flat tonight and give it another measure from the sills.

 

Are you kidding us about the cleaning?

The car looks great!

The rear seems to be a tad lower than the front though.

Check with Anthony, he had a set of SBC springs that are a little lower than the Eibachs (if he still has them or not planning on using them).

Where did you have the wheels done and how much did it set you back if you don't mind me asking?

Also what colour code did you use?

 

Thanks Feb

 

If the sill heights are equal and settled then I might message Anthony re: those springs.

 

By my standards that's pretty filthy. When the sun comes out again (hopefully) it's getting a proper mopping and sealing, together with a blast of plasticare. I bought the rims off Stufarri on here who, I believe, hand sprayed them and hand polished the lips. I'm not sure what colour code he used for the grey but it's lighter than a lot I've seen, but I think it works really well with the grey plastics.

[pug_ham 243 3 Cars]

Looks good but I also agree a bit low at the back.

 

As standard they are supposed to have a slight rake down to the front aren't they?

 

g

[Batfink 201]

If you fitted the Eibachs with the plastic end covers you can get the car down probably a few mm by removing those. Will not make a massive difference though

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

'Plastic end covers'.....? I just fitted the springs to Billy B4's with BBM fast road rubbers and standard bearings/top mounts assembly....I recall no plastic Eibach'ness.

[Tom Fenton 1,536]

Some of the Eibach springs have a plastic/nylon sleeve on the ends of the springs where they contact the upper and lower spring pan. We really are skinning farts though, you may lose 4mm ride height if you removed them. By the sounds of it your springs don't have them anyway.

 

If you want we could raise the beam up a touch to compensate. I am suprised though as the last car I fitted the exact same bits to, I set the beam to the same as I did yours, and that sat lovely.

[d7ve_b 44 1 Cars]

'Skinning farts'

 

I'll measure the sill heights tonight as I'm sure there's an issue on the n/s front which might be causing unwanted highness at the front. I'll report back later.

 

I'm not too keen on raising the rear as I quite like the rears ride height, ideally I want to get the front down a little.