[project] The Ultimate Track 205

[Batfink 201]

I'm using a range of sizes, but only the mandated tubes are the heavy gauge stuff, the rest is no thicker than 1.63mm. The space-frame weighs in at around 100kg, something like 120kg with the remaining bits of shell and a bit more once I have all the brackets on. That's not much lighter than a standard shell, but the real weight savings come from being able to use very lightweight suspension components instead of the heavy OE beam / subframe etc.. and the fact that the rest of the build will be extremely minimal!

 

Well thats an 80kg saving verses a standard shell and about 110kg lighter than a caged shell. (A bare shell with no doors/ bonnet/ hatch/suspension is 300kg) I'd say you are doing alright

[Cameron 16]

Really? Bloody hell I didn't realise they weighed that much!

 

I'm currently at 520kg (with driver) with some pretty conservative estimates. The other 80kg will cover bodywork, underbody, fuel system, cooling system, electrical system and other misc bits and pieces, so I should be pretty good with a 600kg target.

[Batfink 201]

I've just done the math based on what our neighbour got cash for the 205, and it comes at 328kg for a bare shell. I'm guessing thats reasonably accurate

Edited December 19, 2012 by Batfink

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

 

Well thats an 80kg saving verses a standard shell and about 110kg lighter than a caged shell. (A bare shell with no doors/ bonnet/ hatch/suspension is 300kg) I'd say you are doing alright

No they aren't, a bare shell is much less. 2 people can comfortably pick one up!! I've man handled a bare shell onto a trailer on my own and I'm a 10 stone weasel! Edited December 19, 2012 by allanallen

[Tesstuff 222]

No they aren't, a bare shell is much less. 2 people can comfortably pick one up!! I've man handled a bare shell onto a trailer on my own and I'm a 9 stone weasel wishing I was 10 stone!

 

Wish I had that problem Al

[Batfink 201]

No they aren't, a bare shell is much less. 2 people can comfortably pick one up!! I've man handled a bare shell onto a trailer on my own and I'm a 10 stone weasel!

 

Well thats what it weighed in at. What weight did you get then?

[allanallen 528 2 Cars]

 

Well thats what it weighed in at. What weight did you get then?

I obviously haven't weighed one as I would have said but they're almost certainly under 150 kgs or there's no chance we'd of lifted it.

[Cameron 16]

Alex and I lifted my bare shell with no doors or panels and no floor, with main hoop and front hoops, and can report that it was f***ing heavy.

 

However, it wasn't 150kg each.. my arms weren't calibrated that day but I'd reckon at 180kg in total. I could see how a rolling shell would be 300-odd though.

 

Edit: In fact I doubt it was even 150kg!

Edited December 19, 2012 by Cameron

[welshpug 1,645]

Subframes and cast steel hubs weigh lots, beam tube in itself doesnt but the trailing arms shafts and hubs do.

[welshpug 1,645]

Oh and i know a zx came in at 540 with subframe struts hubs wishbones, 15 tin sheets, a dozen brake discs three bumpers, beam tube two doors two tailgates.

 

Oh and the bonnet!

Edited December 19, 2012 by welshpug

[rallyeash 155]

I'd say you won't be anywhere near 600kg. More around the 700-750 mark.

 

My 205 is pretty minomal and that's over 700 without driver.

[dcc 855]

hes not using an iron block XU though Ash and has a lot of weight saving going on.

 

Isn't Colin's 205 Sub 700?

[Cameron 16]

No way will it be anywhere near 750kg.

 

I don't want to sound rude, but I have done A LOT of work on my weights to make sure my targets are realistic; they have to be in order to guarantee my components are going to be strong enough! Even if the space-frame and bodywork come in the same as a caged 205 shell, the big weight savings come in from having better designed components i.e. tubular wishbones weighing less than 1.5kg a corner over forged wishbones coming in at 5-6kg - things like that add up to make a big difference!

[johniban 59 1 Cars]

No they aren't, a bare shell is much less. 2 people can comfortably pick one up!! I've man handled a bare shell onto a trailer on my own and I'm a 10 stone weasel!

 

you've moved a shell on your own? crikey you must have powerful arms

[dcc 855]

Moving a shell on your own isnt too difficult. Especially when youre a unit.

 

On topic

 

Cam im interested in your comments about tubular wishbones. I know your going for a twin setup but can you post a basic outline of what youre going to build. Im on 3g and cant go back easily...

 

Also lurked here long enough. Hats off to you for the patience to do it.

 

[Cameron 16]

I sure can! The basics will be:

 

Spaceframe chassis with double wishbones and pushrod dampers, front engine rear drive

Carbon fibre bodywork (wet lay) in the form of front & rear clamshells

Basic aero - flat floor, front splitter, ducted cooling, rear diffuser and (huge) wing

Fabricated wishbones & uprights, CNC hubs up front, modified Sierra stub axles & hubs at the rear

295mm AP 4-pots up front, 280mm Yamaha R1 4-pots at the back

2.0 Duratec turbo, hoping for around 300-350bhp

Sadev sequential gearbox, custom prop & shafts, 7" Cosworth rear diff

 

I think that's about it.. let me know if I forgot anything.

[stu8v 68 1 Cars]

I sure can! The basics will be:

 

Spaceframe chassis with double wishbones and pushrod dampers, front engine rear drive

Carbon fibre bodywork (wet lay) in the form of front & rear clamshells

Basic aero - flat floor, front splitter, ducted cooling, rear diffuser and (huge) wing

Fabricated wishbones & uprights, CNC hubs up front, modified Sierra stub axles & hubs at the rear

295mm AP 4-pots up front, 280mm Yamaha R1 4-pots at the back

2.0 Duratec turbo, hoping for around 300-350bhp

Sadev sequential gearbox, custom prop & shafts, 7" Cosworth rear diff

 

I think that's about it.. let me know if I forgot anything.

Colour? LOL

[Cameron 16]

Undecided.

 

Might go with white and blue, or blue and day-glo yellow.

[Mad Scientist 106]

This is fascinating stuff in theory. I presume you are living on beans and foregoing all social interaction for the foreseeable with that shopping list!?

 

It will certainly weigh very little, and go very quickly.

 

 

The question is, can you drive???

 

Edited December 19, 2012 by Mad Scientist

[jamie_1992 66 1 Cars]

At least you won't have your wallet weighing you down when it's done lol

[welshpug 1,645]

Just an observation, but I think you may be a little overbraked on the rear, though that may not be so given it'll be rear drive, I noticed Colin Satchell's car which I doubt will be much different in weight at the rear given you'll be hanging a diff out back, runs 2 pot Kart brakes and quite small discs.

[rallyeash 155]

Colin's was about 700 minus driver from memory.

 

Look forward to more Progress!

[Cameron 16]

Well I've saved a lot of money the past few months by doing pretty much nothing due to all my joint problems, and I have about 8k tied up in two cars I plan to sell early next year so that should get me a long way fairly quickly. I need to get the big investments (gearbox and dampers) out the way, then all the rest can be bought in dribs and drabs for the rest of the build.

 

RE the brakes, I'll be running a pedal box with separate circuits so it's just a matter of sizing the master cylinders properly. I have a very comprehensive chassis calculator that I use to spec everything from springs and ARB's to brake sizes so it's all thought through. A 205 will be have very different needs to this due to the high CoG and forward weight bias so you can't really compare.

 

Edit: Can I drive? Good question! It's something that worries me a little.. I know I can build it, but will it scare the crap out of me? Probably!

Edited December 19, 2012 by Cameron

[309jazzpanda 41]

Excellent project and very very pretty welds on the frame, the sound of carbon clam shells certainly makes me twitch

[Cameron 16]

I know it makes me moist too.

 

The prospect of making my own moulds doesn't, however.. but it'll be worth it!