[project] The Ultimate Track 205

[qwerty 9]

looks like the car was made to fit the tool cabinet lol

 

looks lush in the situ

 

this is my favorite project at the mo keep the updates coming

[Cameron 16]

Thanks! Unfortunately it's back to the computer stuff for the time being, although I'm pretty happy about that tbh as it's bloody freezing outside!

 

I've started work on the space-frame design, been running back and forth to the garage to take measurements and had my head in the MSA regs for the past week and this is the fruits of my labour so far:

 

 

Getting to that point is the easy bit though! Rough designs take about 20% of the time, it's the fine-tuning and detail design that takes forever! The main safety structure and the rear end will be the only parts I go into detail on for the time being; I can't go into detail on the front end until I know where the engine will go and how much space it will take up, and that requires the engine. Still, it should be plenty to keep me busy for the next few months!

 

Roll cage will (hopefully) be on order this Friday btw.

Edited January 31, 2012 by Cameron

[stu8v 68 1 Cars]

I have front sections (around doors to main hoop) kicking around in my garage.

 

They where sent with slightly the wrong profile on the main hoop end so where replaced by BMS.

 

Any use to you? I guess it would just mean main hoop would have to be bought.

 

Just a thought.

 

Its from theses guys http://bmsengineering.co.uk/Roll-Cages/128/Peugeot_205_Roll_Cage.html

[Cameron 16]

Appreciate the offer but I'm making the cage from T45 so CDS probably wouldn't work.

[stu8v 68 1 Cars]

No worries

[shalmaneser 26]

not triangulating off the strut tops?

 

then again, whats the overall plan again!? going for 206 engine and four wheel drive now?

[Cameron 16]

There won't be any struts. Double wishbones with pushrod to dampers all round!

 

I haven't started on the front end yet, there will be a front subframe (like there is at the rear) that will pick up the suspension points.

 

Haha yeah I admit this project has had several changes of direction, but now it's steadily going towards a proper goal. I had asked the mods to delete the first 11 pages or so as it was totally confusing the project, but it doesn't seem to have happened. Anywho.. the plan is to have a space-frame integrated with the bodyshell, front wheel drive with an EW10 engine. Think of it as an attempt to build the ultimate FWD tin-top!

Edited January 31, 2012 by Cameron

[tom_xl 2]

Just read this whole thread, this project looks absolutely amazing Cameron! I'll be keeping an eye on this to see how it progresses. This is really nosey but I'm gna ask anyway lol, you mentioned Formula Student, where do you/did you go to Uni?

[Cameron 16]

Thanks Tom!

 

I went to uni at Hertfordshire, was on the 2010 FS team. Are you at Oxford Brookes by any chance?

[tom_xl 2]

How did u guess lol? I've not really been involved with FS although I'm getting more involved this year as I'm doing a final year project on batteries and battery management systems so I'm designing a new battery pack for our electric car as they are in the side-pods at the moment and we want them under the seat. Annoying thing is they've changed FS rules now and you can't enter two cars so the electric one isn't getting a look in this year, gives us more time to develop it though.

 

Oh also if you are interested, we are doing a group project on whether bamboo can be used for chassis components on the FS car. We are designing wishbones made from bamboo composite so we can design some for your 205 if you like lol! (Somehow I don't think this will catch on :S)

[Cameron 16]

Looked at your location.

 

Why did they do that? Sounds like a pretty silly rule to me! Electric cars are probably left to the big money European teams tbh as to be competitive in any of the dynamic events you need some very expensive kit! UH Racing didn't do an electric car in 2011 for that reason, instead they had a bigger team with more money developing the petrol car.

 

I think I may stick to steel tbh! Although in the first year we had to make a method of getting a tin of beans to travel as far as possible, so we made a trebuchet out of bamboo. Needless to say it.. err.. well it exploded actually.

[tom_xl 2]

Haha brilliant. Our electric car wasn't too far off the pace last year apparently (I wasn't involved), bearing in mind we had a budget around 15-20k and Delft had a budget of 250k and used torque vectoring lol.

 

Yeah I think ur better off with steel too lol, although there's a lot of papers claiming they can make bamboo/glass fibre mixed composite stronger and lighter than steel I really don't believe it! Anyway I'm getting a bit off topic here so I'll shut up haha

[Rippthrough 98]

Yep, it's a bugger to weld mounting tabs on though...

[Cameron 16]

Gaffer tape?

[Liquid_106 97 1 Cars]

Gaffer tape?

Bodge artist! Cable ties FTW :oP

Edited February 1, 2012 by Liquid_106

[Cameron 16]

Cage is on order!

 

I've gone for a Custom Cages "Club" kit, which is basically just the front and main roll hoops and the mounting plates, then I'll custom fit all the tubing from there.

 

I've also decided to go for CDS tubing, not T45, mainly because it saves me a hell of a lot of money. The whole point of a T45 cage was that I can make it lighter than MSA regs allow, but that requires me to go through expensive MIRA / FIA homologation. If I didn't do that (which I don't want to) then fitting a cage made of luxury material is kinda pointless as I'm bound by the MSA minimum tube dimensions. Also with CDS I can save a lot of fitting time by MIG welding it in place, and seeing as my MIG welder is far better quality than my TIG unit this kinda makes sense too!

 

The downside is Custom Cages are out of CDS tube at the moment, so I have a 6-8 week wait until it can be bent up. Not a massive problem tbh as I have plenty of design & prep work to do between now and then!

Edited February 3, 2012 by Cameron

[alexcrosse 124]

Think of it as an attempt to build the ultimate FWD tin-top!

 

You can try...

[Cameron 16]

This is so on!

 

I'm gonna humiliate your gay little lagmonster.

[Rippthrough 98]

See, what you wanted, was a bloke with a nice shiny new tube bender, and 10 lengths of certified CDS already in stock.

 

[stu8v 68 1 Cars]

See, what you wanted, was a bloke with a nice shiny new tube bender, and 10 lengths of certified CDS already in stock.

 

 

Or to by my spare front sections

[Cameron 16]

Damn you both.

 

Is your tube 45mm x 2.5mm?

[Rippthrough 98]

Yup!

[Cameron 16]

Well.. tits.

 

Never mind, at least having to wait for mine means I won't be tempted to cut corners prepping the chassis.

[Cameron 16]

First of all, thank you to the mods for doing some much needed trimming of this thread! It's now roughly half as long and hopefully half as confusing!

 

I got a phone call about 30 mins ago from Custom Cages saying my cage was ready(!) so felt it necessary to do a little update. They had promised me a 6 week lead time until they'd even got the tubing in so how they've managed to get tube and bend it all up in under a week is beyond me, but I won't be complaining! I'll be picking it up next Monday afternoon.

 

There's a lot of design work that I've needed to get out of the way, hence the lack of updates. I thought rather than spamming this with lots of CAD screenshots I'd just save it for when I have a nice big update. My space frame design is structurally complete, I just have to get in touch with the MSA and clarify what the regs are on space frame tubing that doesn't form part of the ROPS then I can start the build; In the meantime I'm working on the wishbones, uprights and packaging.

 

I've been running analyses on the rear suspension all week and have got designs that I'm happy with in terms of weight and strength, my load cases have been braking forces, cornering forces, and 4g bump forces for the lower wishbones. The uppers were fine but lowers required me to go up a size in tube diameter and add a larger gusset under the pushrod mount. Here's how the rear end looks at the moment.

 

 

I don't know how clear it is, but you might be able to see the method for adjusting camber via a series of shims between the upper wishbone clevis and the upright. This should make it so that you don't have to remove the wishbones to adjust camber.

 

Torsional stiffness of the space-frame is next, then on to the front suspension!

[cybernck 402 1 Cars]

Don't get too excited for nothing, as it's just a number of posts per page that has been increased,

effectively halving the amount of pages, but all the posts are still there, sorry .