How Not To Modify Your 205's Suspension...

[Anthony 1,003]

We still need to look into tracking, but what ever it's set to is clearly working well, as you can steer, apply power, and the diff drags you in that direction. Much easier to drive than before.

I'm borrowing a set of Dunlop tracking gauges for a few days, so you're welcome to pop over and try various settings from toe-in, neutral, to toe-out if you want, so you can feel the effects and see what suits you best

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

Paul helped me raise the rear, which took us an astonishingly short 1 hour, and that's from jacking it up to putting it down.

 

The specific test over the motorway bridge seems to work even better with the rear up, it now glides over it.

 

It didn't take long at all, did mine in 45mins the other weekend looks wierd being on stilts but haven't had chance to drive it yet.

I also lost one of my bumpstops... wonder what car that bounced off and hit lol.

 

Is that the bridge that goes to bracknell from my house? Has a massive kicker going onto the bridge where the tarmac has sunk, I regularly get all 4 wheels off floor in Baleno

 

 

Next job is to raise the front, the wishbones are sitting level at the moment.

[engine killer 6]

Regarding to the roll centre and bump steer issues, I have came up with this after a few months thinking, imagining, drawing and finally send the drawing to production.

 

I hope this will work. A little have to be done on the hub itself - bores the track rod hole to 14mm.

 

Any comment?

 

p.s. all the nuts will be changed to lock nuts when installing.

 

Thanks.

Edited November 1, 2010 by engine killer

[stefan 4]

Been thinking of doing something like that myself, it solves the issue with the horizontal or upright wishbone level when the car is lowered. Any pics of the part on it's own?

[TT205 42]

Very clever!

 

Be interested to hear how successful this is

[Cameron 16]

Is the balljoint extender made of alloy?

 

+1 for wanting to see the part by itself.

[engine killer 6]

Is the balljoint extender made of alloy?

 

+1 for wanting to see the part by itself.

 

 

They are made of steel instead of alloy because I am still a bit afraid of the alloy is a bit soft for this purpose even the with 7075 material.

 

This is the first set I made. After making this set I found there are a number of rooms for improvement.

1) The male side of the roll centre kit (the one stick into the hub instead of ball joint) should have made a bit bigger and the bottom of it (the leg?) should have a 45 degree slope to make it stronger, also most of the aged hub may be a bit loose or even ovaled. Boring out the hubs' clamping holes is needed.

2) the bolt locations (two holes) for joining both male and female should be further apart. You can see the bolts and nuts there are too close to the clamp's bolt and nut. Shift them 1 or 2 mm away each side will make a hell lot easier to tighten them.

Edited November 2, 2010 by engine killer

[engine killer 6]

Will try them soon.

 

If I am not being lazy again, I will be drawing the mark 2 of it soon although I will not be making it unless it fails (hope not).

 

So, if anyone is interested in it I will be sending my drawing/s for your detailed comment.

 

P.S. they will lower the points (arms joining point and steering rod joining point) by about 33mm. I think the caster and camber can also be adjusted (one off) by shifting the joining holes and making the plate bigger to suit. Advise from my mechanic - not to, the sideway force will be increased because the ball joint no longer directly under the male center point. Any comment?

Edited November 2, 2010 by engine killer

[Baz 421]

Looks ace and could obviously use it to dial in added castor/camber if wanted too!

 

Edit; as your edit says!

Edited November 2, 2010 by Baz

[Rippthrough 98]

Advise from my mechanic - not to, the sideway force will be increased because the ball joint no longer directly under the male center point. Any comment?

 

There'll already be an increase in force from the extenders themselves, so probably not worth making it worse with camber/castor on there too.

[Miles 331 1 Cars]

Why not just use 405/406 hubs with a Rose jointed lower arm, Easy and not allot to make up

[engine killer 6]

There'll already be an increase in force from the extenders themselves, so probably not worth making it worse with camber/castor on there too.

Noted with a million thanks!

 

Why not just use 405/406 hubs with a Rose jointed lower arm, Easy and not allot to make up

I have just looked at the servicebox regarding the 406 front hub, apart from the ball joint point, are all the figures same as 205?

 

I have also been thinking to press the ball joint out from the arm once they are dead, and install (make to fit) another ball joint, may be from an Audi or Nissan. I still worry about the rose jointed arm as I have a badly failed experience

[engine killer 6]

after a quick study of both 405 and 406, they are using the same wheel bearing as 205, half bingo!

 

if they are giving the same figures (measurement between shock mounting, bearing, ball joint centre, steering rod fixing) as 205, pressing out the ball joint from 205 arm and fabricate an extension to fit the 405/406 balljoint and 205 arm will be even easier and safer, don't you think so? also, we only have to change the ball joint and not the arm when the ball joint fails, much cheaper.

[Cameron 16]

Glad to see you made them from steel! I only asked because the colour looked like it was hard anodised in your first pics.

 

You will definitely need to put a radius between the male stub and the plate for future ones, you've got a major stress raiser in there at the moment with that sharp corner.

[stefan 4]

Excuse me for going off topic, but what's with the PAMUČNA MAJICA 2kom envelope? I thought you're from China, what's a Croatian envelope doing there?

 

P.S. I like the bit, I belive the 2nd version (like said above) will be spot on

[engine killer 6]

You will definitely need to put a radius between the male stub and the plate for future ones, you've got a major stress raiser in there at the moment with that sharp corner.

you are right, I was worrying about that weak point the first time I looked at the final product. not experienced enough

 

 

Excuse me for going off topic, but what's with the PAMUČNA MAJICA 2kom envelope? I thought you're from China, what's a Croatian envelope doing there?

 

P.S. I like the bit, I belive the 2nd version (like said above) will be spot on

oh, the envelope, iirc it was from the lovely "GTi" polo shirts I ordered from "de Noir" here and I just love to reuse it

 

the second version..... that may be just a ver. 1.5 with just the "extra radius" for the stub plate because the full set fabrication cost me about GBP200

Edited November 2, 2010 by engine killer

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

Only thing with the 405/406 hubs is that the 205/306 brakes don't fit straight on.

 

However just use 405 or 406 brakes and everything's just good

[engine killer 6]

Only thing with the 405/406 hubs is that the 205/306 brakes don't fit straight on.

 

However just use 405 or 406 brakes and everything's just good

hmmm, I am using AP 4 pot (with bracket).

 

sounds like a big no to me or a lot of hassle.

 

There is only probably 1 or 2 405 left in Hong Kong but still some 406 around. Will see if I can source or borrow a spare hub from anyone for measurement.

[welshpug 1,657]

not much hassle at all really, just use all the 406 braking parts that you can get easily off the shelf.

 

Colin Satchell has used 405/6 hubs on a few builds with 306 wishbones on one arrangement I have seen, but I don't know any specifics of dimensions etc, it was a complete chassis package with bump steer correction and no ARB's (DrSarty's white EVOII)

[engine killer 6]

not much hassle at all really, just use all the 406 braking parts that you can get easily off the shelf.

 

Colin Satchell has used 405/6 hubs on a few builds with 306 wishbones on one arrangement I have seen, but I don't know any specifics of dimensions etc, it was a complete chassis package with bump steer correction and no ARB's (DrSarty's white EVOII)

there is not quite the same on this side of the planet. Toyota is the majority and then Honda and some other Japanese, the common European cars are Merc and Bimmer. Peugeot is a very rare breed.

 

So getting the parts for Pug..... sometimes is a nightmare scrapyard can be a rip-off too.

[B1ack_Mi16 67]

there is not quite the same on this side of the planet. Toyota is the majority and then Honda and some other Japanese, the common European cars are Merc and Bimmer. Peugeot is a very rare breed.

 

So getting the parts for Pug..... sometimes is a nightmare scrapyard can be a rip-off too.

 

Shouldn't be hard to source some cheap parts from the UK though and get it shipped to China

[Cameron 16]

you are right, I was worrying about that weak point the first time I looked at the final product. not experienced enough

 

It's a good mistake to make though, as you won't make it again!

[engine killer 6]

It's a good mistake to make though, as you won't make it again!

I have to admit that I am a real rookie here.

 

but keep learning from time to time especially from here this is the reason I didn't give up my 205

[engine killer 6]

Dear all,

 

My kit failed but a very good lesson.

 

A picture say a thousand words!

 

Started to work on a new kit again.

[engine killer 6]

The roll center kit should lowered the arm's ball joint point by 33mm. It did but the direct extension of the ball joint caused the edge of the arm impact on the brake disc when the car is back on the road (not on the jack). Also, that 33mm didn't make the arm pointing downward, it was about horizontal only. It was probably because I have lowered the cay by far more than 33mm.

 

So, roll center kit off but only the bump steer kit remains. SCARY! The arc of the arm running is completely different to the tie-rod's. What I mean is, for example, when the wheel goes up 10mm, the arm swing up and the ball joint path (arc) movement is completely different to the tie rod ball joint path. Serious bump steer in return, even when the car is running about 50mph!