Track Car From Scratch

[robnic 0]

Hi all,

 

I'm building a 205 (with alloy Mi power fairly std for starters but using 45 TB's) from a bare shell mainly for track use, my 'local' is Cadwell although I will hopefully get to other circuits, as you all know it's an expensive build and I would like to get it something like right from the start so I am after some advice regarding suspension set ups... please :-)

 

I'm using a non GTi shell with only stiffening a 6 point bolt in cage, so starting at the arse end (I'm sure I will have to cut the rear arches) I thought I would use the narrower 205 beam to minimise the body 'mods' as opposed to the 309 beam, I intend using GTi-6 arms with adjustable Gaz shocks (not sure yet if gold type or the lesser ones) first question is regarding the ARB and torsion bars what sizes do you think would suit me best with my front end set up, std 15" Speedlines btw.

 

Up front I'm using the single rose jointed lower arms with inner poly bushes, power rack w/o power and Gaz (again not sure if gold or lesser ones) coil overs with BM adjustable top mounts, so questions for the front are what poundage springs and 205 or 309 ARB? I realise I already have a few variables here with adj top mounts and rose joint arms that is (apart from cost!) why I might go with the lesser Gaz shocks just to limit some of the adjustments I can make!

 

Sorry for all the questions and realise I can probably find answers searching but I've got to do my first post at some point!

 

tia Rob

[oz. 2]

I found 200lb springs fine to me. A stiffer ARB - front and back would be advisable.

 

I don't think using a 309 beam on the back would cause you to need to modify it. There are a fair few 205's running with the wider beam and I haven't hear of any of them having to change anything.

 

One point I would make though is - if you do change the rear beam change the wishbones to wider ones too. This would keep the handling pretty similar to normal but feel a bit more 'planted'.

[Cameron 16]

Stiffer ARB front and back is pointless, you'd be better off just increasing the spring rates. Anti-roll bars are for balancing the handling so shouldn't really be fitted to both axles anyway.

 

It depends weather this is your daily or just a track hack. If it's the latter then go for something like 300-350lb springs, Gaz Gold's (more expensive but worth it!) and 24mm torsion bars. Weather or not you should go for a thicker rear anti-roll bar is a matter of personal preference, so don't jump on the massive ARB bandwagon before you've tested it. The last thing you want is a car that constantly tries to swap ends on you. If you think the car understeers too much then uprate the rear ARB, mine does fine with the standard one.

Edited April 10, 2010 by Cameron

[robnic 0]

It is gonna be trailored to track days so I will go with 300lb springs & 24mm tb's and probably save for the Gold's (pity I missed the group buy beginning of the year) I intend posting my progress on here of the build as it goes.

 

Thanks for the replies it is appreciated

 

Rob

[Cameron 16]

If you're going for 300lb springs then don't be tempted to buy your Gaz's off eBay or other cheapie places, the damping rates will be way off. You're better off getting them direct from Gaz because they can custom valve them to your springs at no extra cost.

[robnic 0]

Thanks for the tip Cameron, I hear you and totally agree you've gotta be careful on fleabay nowadays eh! I've been looking and waiting for used ones to turn up but least you know where you are if you buy new. Gaz's seem popular and I know it's personal preference but should I be pricing up other breeds, AVO, Billies, Konis or go with Gaz?

[robnic 0]

Thanks for the tip Cameron, I hear you and totally agree you've gotta be careful on fleabay nowadays eh! I've been looking and waiting for used ones to turn up but least you know where you are if you buy new. Gaz's seem popular and I know it's personal preference but should I be pricing up other breeds, AVO, Billies, Konis or go with Gaz?

[TVH 0]

What tyres are you going to use? 300-350lb front is in my opinion very good for semi slicks but rolls too much with real slicks. Road tyres need softer springs because of less grip and sidewall deflection. I have 23mm torsion bars and 24mm rear arb and it is still understeering even when lifting off.

[Cameron 16]

If it's a track car it would be a crime not to have at least Toyo 888's.

[Batfink 201]

From my experience in building a non gti track car, the 309 rear beam will fit on without arch modifications but you cannot use 15" alloys like the standard 1.9 gti ones.

We ended up with the rallye 13" steelies on cut slicks and all was well.

[robnic 0]

Hi,

 

That was my thoughts 195/50R15 R888's... another expensive item at near a ton per corner!

[robnic 0]

From my experience in building a non gti track car, the 309 rear beam will fit on without arch modifications but you cannot use 15" alloys like the standard 1.9 gti ones.

We ended up with the rallye 13" steelies on cut slicks and all was well.

 

I was really intending using the 15" Speedys so I guess I will have to cut back the arches which seems a shame to do as this shell is one of the best I've seen it's a 1990 with one old duffer owner and 49k on it! but I will do so to fit the Speedlines this is why I may use the 205 beam to limit the amount of metal I have to remove I will know better when I eventually make a start, I'm still aquiring bits at the mo but I will post a new build thread when I get going.

[notamondayfan 44]

Im sure you could find a knackered 1.9 beam or borrow one, and test the gaps before you commit to spending cash on a decent beam, or start cutting into a decent shell.

[Cameron 16]

£100 a corner, where's that from!? You want to try Camskill, they'll do you Yokohama A048's (which are better) for £80 per corner!