Xsara Vts Gearbox Into 205 Gti6

[MrP 1]

I have currently got my gti6 engine out of my 205 and want to put it back in with the vts box attached (which I have)

 

I would like to use the vts/gti6 clutch system thats attached to the box if its possible, couple of reasons for this

 

1 - I have a be1 box so dont have the clutch bits that need to be swapped

2 - I have about 3 vts/gti6 clutch plates.

 

What clutch cable do I need to use? I have some pics of the different boxes, but cant add them?

[Tesstuff 222]

What sort of answers did you find when you did a search for it mate?

[MrP 1]

I searched and read ALL of the threads I could find on this, pm'd some of the people that seemed to have a lot of knowledge/experience in doing this from these threads with no reply and I also tried to add a reply onto an existing thread rather than start a new one and have someone reply just as you have, but it would not allow me.

 

I also wanted to add pics to this thread to help others who want to do this in the future

 

So in answer to your question - I didnt find the answer hence posting this thread.

 

But thanks for your helpful reply

Edited March 16, 2010 by MrP

[CosKev 16]

trying to create a useful thread for others to use

 

Not many people use the Gti6/VTS clutch from what I gather(and as you have found as you have searched all old threads thouroughly ),but if your too tight to do it properly crack on!!!!

 

Pretty sure you need to use your Gti cable with part of the Gti6 cable used on the gearbox end,but I can't be sure sorry,as its a little used way of doin the conversion

[Paul_13 212 1 Cars]

Here's a pic of the bit's I swapped over in my conversion:

 

Sorry about the crap pic, the circle towards the back is the gear selector arm. Both circled items I swapped onto the VTS box.

 

Double check your clutch bushes, they do wear badly sometimes, cheap from the dealer and they normally stock them.

 

Bit's you need to swap/use:

 

Clutch (I used a BX 16v/MI16 clutch as it's a push type not pull)

 

Clutch cable from 205

 

Clutch arm from 205

 

Gear selector arm (circled in blue) The extra gearlinkage and bracket can be removed (11mm bolts/nuts on diff housing)

 

Inner CV cup from N/S driveshaft off a 306 dt/gti6 etc

^ an alternative to this is to swap the diff over from the 205 box.

 

Make sure a Crank Alignment Sensor is attached and in GWO (sensor with plug hanging over gearbox ^)

 

VSS (speed sensor) Part above blue circle. A mechanical and electrical drive has to be sourced (see below)

Edited March 17, 2010 by Paul_13

[CosKev 16]

Paul_13 what do you think of the VTS box????

 

Just putting one in my 309 along with the engine

 

I've done what you listed above,but also did you swap over the pin that gearbox mount is attached too????

 

They are different,and I think you would get too much movement with VTS pin into 205/309 mount after looking at mine

 

The thread starter was asking about how do you use a standard Gti6/VTS clutch in a 205

[welshpug 1,661]

use a 306 cable that's how Kev

 

though I'm not sure if there's enough clearance from the front cable bracket to the rad, I'd personally go for the push type arrangement Paul highlighted above.

 

I find the ratios quite perfectly suited to the engine myself, 6sp would be nice as the rpm does drop 200 odd in top over the 5 speed MI16/S16/VTS ratios, but I do like being able to turn right as much as left

Edited March 17, 2010 by welshpug

[CosKev 16]

The 306 cable fits to pedal ok??????

 

Had a quick look on Gti6 forum and I thought the Gti6 used some sort of self adjuster on pedal/built into cable?????

[Anthony 1,003]

Have a look on Taylorspug's thread about his silver 205 GTi-6 build - he's used the GTi-6 pull-type clutch setup on his 205 and it apparently works very well.

[welshpug 1,661]

yeah, fits the BE3 pedal perfectly fine, a friend of mine is using a BE3 205 cable to work the modified clutch arm on a V6 engine in a 306.

[CosKev 16]

Ah right.

 

Mines all set-up for push type now,Citroen BX16V clutch fitted

[MrP 1]

[MrP 1]

My gearboxes above - 1.9 Be3, Xsara Vts and Gti6. Im chosing to go with the Vts box because of the ratios and after watching shootermcgavins youtube vids of how it accelerates and what it does to Honda Cilly Type R's it just looks brilliant, also if you look at pic you can see how much longer the Gti6 box is!!

 

[2052006 10]

I used the gti6 clutch with mine (VTS box). BE3 cable, spaced out on the end about 20mm iirc - but it did take me ages to work out how to do it and I still struggle to understand how it works . Anyway, the clutch action was very nice after doing this - I think it was lighter than my old clutch when I had the 8v and 1.6 box on (and the clutch was new on that as well).

[joe1joe 3]

i thought i would use an old thread to save posting a new topic

 

i have a vts box with my mi16 bx clutch and fitted goes on fine.

 

but the clucth fork seem too large for the release bearing (as in the distance between the the two pronges being to far apart)

 

i thought you only needed the clutch arm of a 205 and use the vts clutch fork?

[welshpug 1,661]

You need both from a push type gearbox, can be a n/a diesel, 1.8 petrol, 1.9 MI16, BE3 205 etc, they are all push type, VTS is pull type same as the 16v 2.0 engines, TD engines.

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

I'm currently running a BE1 on a GTI6.

 

I have a spare 1.9 BE3 box c/w all the brackets etc required, and a new BE3 push bearing.

 

I understand i'll need the gearstick/selector part from a BE3 car. Can this be taken off from inside the car? (my scrappies is a bit of a swamp and he's stacked cars on top of his 205).

 

Because mines is currently BE1, do i need any of the stuff mounted on the sub-frame or are these the same on BE1 and BE3 205's?

 

TIA

[dcc 855]

you don't need the gearstick from a be3. just ensure you have the top arm on your BE3 box from a 205. its slightly different shape.

 

to go fro be1 to 3 you need

 

be3 pedal (or modify be1)

be3 clutch cable

POSSIBLY need to modify the pedal box hole to accept th ebe3 cable

BE3 gearbox with correct style clutch lever

BE3 release bearing

POSSIBLY a be3 pressure plate - mi16 / bx16v (if going from gti6/vts clutch)

 

I needed to do the same for using a be4 gearbox from a xsara vts.

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Thanks DCC. So I need to be set up for BE3 to be able to run BE4, which is what I'm trying to do.

 

Is it possible to get the gears from my BE4 put into my BE1 by a gearbox specialist?

 

I don't fancy taking the pedal box out again, not sure it would even come out with the GTI6 in.

[Anthony 1,003]

If your car is an F reg it should have the later pedal box I think - later F's certainly do.

 

Clutch pedal is easily swapped from the footwell and clutch cable shouldn't be anymore difficult with the GTi-6 engine than anything else if you work from underneath. I reckon the pedal box could be easily modified in situ too if needs be as it's only filing out the hole for the grommit.

 

Certainly that's the way that I would do it as the BE3 clutch setup is far nicer than the BE1 and parts are readily and commonly available too given that it continued to be used into the 2000's.

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Thanks Anthony.

 

Do you know if the gears could be swapped from be4 to be1 box?

[dobboy 231 2 Cars]

Ignore my post above.....

 

But in my searches i found this which someone might find handy.

 

http://www.rallyparts.co.uk/cwp_change/